91 FJ80 pondering the diesel question (1 Viewer)

[nate dogg]

Hi y'all,

I just sold my beloved companion of nearly 12 years, my 1984 BJ60. It was a great truck but now I've got two little ones and it was getting driven about 25,000km a year. When I sent her away it had 610,000km. All summer long, no AC up to 2000km trips in 35c heat and the rust was of course creeping in and a certain member of the family was displeased about the crudeness of the ol' truck so I found a 91 FJ80 with AC, no rust, triple locked and 2" lift in good shape for a good price. The problem is I hate the 3FE and auto. My old turbod 3B had more useable power and got 10L per 100km all day long around town and out in the bush whatever it didn't matter winter or summer. I couldnt burn a tank in less than 550km if I tried. Now this 80 hogs gas and is gutless. I get best 14L per 100km and around town up to 20L per 100. Also I hate autos. Truck is great other than that So ive been digging around and have determined that what I'd like to see powering my otherwise perfect truck is a Hino W04C-T mated to a ZF5 out of a F350, mated to the full time tcase. I think the Hino is the perfect displacement, industrial cylinder liners, gear driven cam, fuel pump etc, often equiped with exhaust brake (I know most of you are going to say overkill but hey it would still be nice) should physically fit ok, being Japanese diesel should start well in winter, should be a thrift on fuel and should last a long long time. From what I found they are around 150hp and close to 300 ftlb torque. More than enough for me.
Now for the ZF5 trans they are OD (I don't think Hino had an OD trans mated to the W04C-T). They are known to last a long time in bigger trucks with much more power (7.3 powerstroke). The gear ratios are good about 5:1 first and .77 fifth. Also they are dime a dozen and cheap to rebuild. They are aluminum case to save weight too and PTO options.
As for the Toyota full time case I want to retain that as if my wife drives it in the winter I would be more confident sending her out. I once tried to explain how one needs to be careful about understeer particularly going downhill in 4WD or when it is best to be in 4wd or not but it's just not there. Not going to happen. Plus I like how well it works too. I dont miss locking and unlocking hubs.
All of this hub bub to see what everyone has to say. I know this is a big task. I am a HD mechanic and I can get my way through most tasks but does anyone has a blatant reason that this is not going to work so don't try it? I am aware I'm in deep mixing and matching parts here but I'm thinking the only way to REALLY find out is to do it.

 

[mudgudgeon]

what ever your budget and time allowed for the swap is, double both. and have alternative transport for the missus for the duration.

fuel savings alone is rarely a good reason to go down the conversion route.

 

[baldilocks]

The money you spend on this swap would buy lots and lots of gas. Now, it all boils down to- you just want it because Diesel is what you are used to.

Life is short .....

 

[White Stripe]

In canada, I would consider buying a 80 with the diesel motor already in it. I can't remember what diesel Toyota put in them but it has the ability to put out the power you want. U could buy a rusted out one and swap the motor to yours or just buy one in good shape and sell you're 3fe 80.

 

[dogfishlake]

That would be interesting for sure. Hino is part of Toyota's umbrella so you would essentially keeping it all Mr. T, if that matters to you.

 

[ceylonfj40nut]

In canada, I would consider buying a 80 with the diesel motor already in it. I can't remember what diesel Toyota put in them but it has the ability to put out the power you want. U could buy a rusted out one and swap the motor to yours or just buy one in good shape and sell you're 3fe 80.

^^^^Makes the most sense. However our disease gets at common sense to make anything seem practical and within reach. Nothing wrong with that. ^^^life is short.

 

[Michael Hanson]

Hi, Make sure the 3fe is running correctly and the O2 sensors are good . No it's not going to get as much gas mileage as the diesel but it's full time 4 wheel drive and the ac works,neither of which were slowing your diesel down. Mike

 

[nate dogg]

Thank you everyone for your thoughts. Yes I am sure it will take some time to make savings in fuel. There are many little things in why I want to do this of course. I do miss my 60 and the way the 3B had perfect power for pulling up logging roads, idling through cross ditches and would pull and pull down rather than having to grab a gear. I miss those characteristics. I miss the economy. I miss the range- if I am on logging roads I'm limited to less than 300km which means I'm bringing gas. I inherintly don't like gasoline with all the added sensors, vac lines, ingition components. I miss how my turbo 3B would just bear down and build boost when I hit a hill rather than pulling down and grabbing gears and the torque converter slipping and slipping as I pull up a grade. Lots of things.

 

[cody c]

The best thing you can do with an early 80 is ditch the 3FE and auto. But I'm biased.

 

[gungriffin]

Doesn't it seem like getting a sorted RHD HDJ80 could actually be less expensive than a swap? The other item that I have noticed is to consider that factory matching vehicles retain their resale much better than aftermarket swaps. I could see that it would be possible to buy a late 90s RHD HDJ80 out of South America. You could then drive a 97 for 5-6 years and resell to the USA when it hits 25 years old. With this route you might even get your original investment back.

 

[baldilocks]

Thank you everyone for your thoughts. Yes I am sure it will take some time to make savings in fuel. There are many little things in why I want to do this of course. I do miss my 60 and the way the 3B had perfect power for pulling up logging roads, idling through cross ditches and would pull and pull down rather than having to grab a gear. I miss those characteristics. I miss the economy. I miss the range- if I am on logging roads I'm limited to less than 300km which means I'm bringing gas. I inherintly don't like gasoline with all the added sensors, vac lines, ingition components. I miss how my turbo 3B would just bear down and build boost when I hit a hill rather than pulling down and grabbing gears and the torque converter slipping and slipping as I pull up a grade. Lots of things.

Exactly why I love to drive and tow with my dodge/Cummins. I am very apt to haul my 80 on my trailer if I’m going a long distance especially over mountains.

I was pretty much over it but now you’ve got me wanting a diesel in my 80 again damnit.

 

[nate dogg]

You're welcome The truck is darn near perfect except for the motor and trans. Which is obviously significant. I have thought about getting a sacked diesel 80 and transplanting the guts for sure but to find a diesel with 5spd is very rare and to find one at a reasonable price is nearly non existent. It's pretty difficult to find whether just powertrain of complete truck and I can't get away with a trip to SA to scope out trucks for possible diesel swap with two kids under three at home and my wife needing all the help she can get. Not happening. Beyond that, I know the Toyota 1HZ and 1HDT are great but from what I hear there definitely are thriftier diesels out there. It sounds like most people are getting around 12-16L per 100 and I'm hoping for closer to 10-12. Also I like the Hino gear driven pump and cam vs belt and inline fuel pump to rotary. Lots of little reasons the Hino is attractive to me. I'm sure some are rolling their eyes and I get it but I guess I'm just a little stubborn when I get an idea in my head.

 

[White Stripe]

So u have a wife and kids and want to do a custom Hino motor swap? How much time do u want to spend with them? My guess is it will take u a year to do if u have 15 hours a week to spend on it. I'm sure the Hino is a great motor, and I'm sure u have the skill to do it. But motor swaps are time killers. Not a big deal if u have time to kill. All the little details take a while to sort out. It would be better to buy a nice diesel 80 and swap a toyota 5 speed in it and you'll have the same amount of money in it but way less time vs a motor swapped 80-the difference being you'll actually get to drive it as opposed to getting into the motor swap and realizing it's too much work and selling it all for 2k and buying a prius. As far as fuel mileage it's generally not a good idea to do a swap just for fuel mileage. It doesn't work out financially. Spend 20k to get better fuel mileage? I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm saying it's a huge project and not worth the sacrifice. Btw, landcruiser heaven sells a OEM 80 series 5 speed swap kit. For more fuel range u can add a second fuel tank.

 

[cody c]

Pull a 3B/5 speed and swap it in. Turbo it, pull the fuel pump out of the tank and run it. You can delete a bunch of wiring and just leave the computer, pull the clutch pedal assembly from a donor 60 and swap it to (what I'm using in my 80)

It's been done before, Wayne (crushersrule) knew someone that had one out east, he said it pulled fine.

There's the odd 60 diesel for sale in Alberta, you can pick one up and swap it out. Would be cool to mate up an H55 to the HF2A and keep the AWD for winter roads, I think the outplut splines are the same and it could be done, I'm gonna try it one day.

I built a second tank in the back, about 95 litres (25 gallons) where the rear tire was. Plenty for logging roads.

 

[SHREDwagon]

@nate dogg Save some grief and buy an HDJ81 with everything you need, which you can swap down the road later, if you feel the need for LHD. Or, buy a LHD HDJ80 with HD-FT from Europe.

In the end you will still be locker-less with a rear Semi-float on drums and 150HP?! Truck won’t be worth anymore after a Hino conversion than it is now with a 3FE.

IMHO, with option B you’re saving quite a bit of time and money.

 

[nate dogg]

I think there are more than a few that would scoff at a 3B/ H55F combo but I've thought about it more than a few times. It's a great combo but it may leave me lacking once in a while if I tow anything. I'm not trying to to much but I would like to be able to tow at least 3000lb without feeling like I'm working the old girl for all she's worth. And the other thing is parts are getting fewer. Can one buy synchros and bearings etc to rebuild the trans? And the motor is kinda the same. Many times I pulled over the coqihalla (1400m climb in about 20km?) with 2500lb behind me wondering about my precombustion chambers and I'd like to go to DI and an engine that was built to be worked flat out all day long.
My FJ80 also had a bunch of money dumped into it before I got it. Both axles got swapped and it has disks, FF rear axle, diff locks, re sealed front swivels all OEM parts. I dont really care about the hp. People spend alot of money to get a 4BT which is about the same. Of course it has potential for more but that's a clatterfest of a motor IMHO. 150hp and 275ftlbs I think would be enough for me but I want it to last the next 400,000 with oil changes and valvesets. That's it. And it want it to get 12L per 100 or better. I looked at Landcruiser heaven and the R151 kit is 4500USD. Not happening.

 

[White Stripe]

Sounds like you've already made up your mind.

 

[nate dogg]

Sounds like you've already made up your mind.

Yeah maybe mostly hey? I guess what's the point of asking people what they think. I'm not totally closed to other ideas but I can't spend 8-10k on a transplant. I saw a HDJ81 with 5spd for sale semi local for 14.5k which is about as good of a deal as I've seen. Has 270k and part time case/ hubs, RHD, no lockers, not mint but probably decent condition. I could make some money back by parting the rest I decided to transplant. I'm not concerned with resale. I plan to drive it the next 20 years. I would have kept my 60 but I had to decided to retrofit AC, fix rust and various other small things. This has AC, no significant rust and I should servey purposes for the next long while if I can solve a couple things.

 

[gungriffin]

Yeah maybe mostly hey? I guess what's the point of asking people what they think. I'm not totally closed to other ideas but I can't spend 8-10k on a transplant. I saw a HDJ81 with 5spd for sale semi local for 14.5k which is about as good of a deal as I've seen. Has 270k and part time case/ hubs, RHD, no lockers, not mint but probably decent condition. I could make some money back by parting the rest I decided to transplant. I'm not concerned with resale. I plan to drive it the next 20 years. I would have kept my 60 but I had to decided to retrofit AC, fix rust and various other small things. This has AC, no significant rust and I should servey purposes for the next long while if I can solve a couple things.

What is the budget that you believe that you can get this project completed for? I am just curious. Maybe that is the question to answer first.

 

[cody c]

• I know a fella that is thinking about selling his 85 BJ60, he wants to fix the rear axle and then put it up for about $3500, its got a turbo on it and a good 5 speed. (he goes by iggi on mud) if your looking for a donor diesel it may be a half decent candidate. came with AC and power steering of course for that year, which would be nice for the 80.