Bolt on turbo kit (14 Viewers)

[scottryana]

Huh why didn't I think of that??? Sure lets just quadruple the injector size and add a couple more pumps, I am sure we could pump it up to 25psi with the stock computer. lol

Could you get to 10 psi with larger injectors and a fuel pump upgrade?

 

[ThomasMore66]

No. Computer would just cut fuel to the same level as stock anyway. Only way to safely go above 8psi is stand alone, AFAIK.

That's what I thought. So I get the turbo kit and in 2022 (25 years old) when the emissions inspection is DC'd I can go all in.

 

[jjdeneen918]

Hopefully CARB doesn’t throw a wrench at turbos in a general sense, versus superchargers, due to the more available aspects of tweeking & tuning characteristics of turbo setups.

Dunno, just thinking pessimistically.

I’m sure Wits will provide info & insight with his SEMA status, as it gets going.

Joey, will this kit not be available until CARB certification is obtained? Or do you intend to produce & release the kit when parts kits are available? Then begin the CARB certification process?

 

[NLXTACY]

Hopefully CARB doesn’t throw a wrench at turbos in a general sense, versus superchargers, due to the more available aspects of tweeking & tuning characteristics of turbo setups.

Dunno, just thinking pessimistically.

I’m sure Wits will provide info & insight with his SEMA status, as it gets going.

Joey, will this kit not be available until CARB certification is obtained? Or do you intend to produce & release the kit when parts kits are available? Then begin the CARB certification process?

Timing runs concurrently

 

[subzali]

For those interested, here is the CARB EO for the Safari system (D-490). I imagine it contains the things that would be typical or to be expected with CARB certifying a turbo system: https://arb.parts/Executive-Order/D-490.pdf

For instance, it gives a basic description of the system and stipulates the boost psi.

I guess I should put a wide band on my 80, and/or fix the wastegate issue. If I'm not careful with my right foot I can creep up on 10 psi with stock everything except the turbo system . The narrow band says it's rich and I don't hear pinging, but still...

 

[yoda-g3]

For those interested, here is the CARB EO for the Safari system (D-490). I imagine it contains the things that would be typical or to be expected with CARB certifying a turbo system: https://arb.parts/Executive-Order/D-490.pdf

For instance, it gives a basic description of the system and stipulates the boost psi.

I guess I should put a wide band on my 80, and/or fix the wastegate issue. If I'm not careful with my right foot I can creep up on 10 psi with stock everything except the turbo system . The narrow band says it's rich and I don't hear pinging, but still...

How is your wastegate setup? Is it the stock Safari one the is supposed to engage at 7-8 PSI? I put one of these Manual Boost Controllers in a few years back and it is very erratic. I was going to bypass it and just run straight from the manifold to the WG. I just wanted to bump it up to a consistent 8 or 9. Stock is more 6-7psi. I didn't know if there is a "set 8psi" replacement out there, or get a microcontroller that adjusts on the fly, but I'd prefer to keep it non electronic.

I can say from experience after installing a wideband.... it can go VERY lean with no noticeable pinging. (I had a Unichip that I'm surprised didn't fry the motor it was running so lean.) But since I pulled the Unichip, it stays rock solid as far as AFR as long as it doesn't spike over 9.5-10PSI. That has been my experience with the manual controller. If I lay on it going up a hard grade while towing, it will cross 10psi no matter how I adjust the dial.

 

[subzali]

How is your wastegate setup? Is it the stock Safari one the is supposed to engage at 7-8 PSI? I put one of these Manual Boost Controllers in a few years back and it is very erratic. I was going to bypass it and just run straight from the manifold to the WG. I just wanted to bump it up to a consistent 8 or 9. Stock is more 6-7psi. I didn't know if there is a "set 8psi" replacement out there, or get a microcontroller that adjusts on the fly, but I'd prefer to keep it non electronic.

I can say from experience after installing a wideband.... it can go VERY lean with no noticeable pinging. (I had a Unichip that I'm surprised didn't fry the motor it was running so lean.) But since I pulled the Unichip, it stays rock solid as far as AFR as long as it doesn't spike over 9.5-10PSI. That has been my experience with the manual controller. If I lay on it going up a hard grade while towing, it will cross 10psi no matter how I adjust the dial.

Mine is just the original internal wastegate, which is supposed to be set for four psi per the CARB certification. It used to boost at four psi all the time but the last couple of years I have seen it creep up. I think the wastegate must be stuck or something.

 

[ThomasMore66]

My only experience to date with boost is the TRD SC on my Tacoma. It was 5-6 psi and with a new fuel pump and a pulley change I’m at 7-8 with occasional 9’s on a cold day. So far that’s the stock computer with a Toyota reflash. There are now two computer upgrades available, one is a piggyback style that ties to the stock Ecu and the other ties to the obd2 port and reconfigures many parameters. The second has been the holy grail of the Toyota ecu.

I get that the LC computer isn’t sophisticated enough for that, but can you add a different ecu and still maintain the reporting function of the stock ecu for obd2? I feel flames already coming my way...

 

[scottryana]

Ok I am done being a smartass for a little while.

@ThomasMore66 I understand you are trying to help, and you are also asking questions because you are trying to learn, but you are still comparing apples to oranges. There are no reflashes for the 80 ECU. No one has successfully been able to get a piggyback ECU to work with the 80 ECU. When you wire a standalone in parallel with the stock ECU you are essentially capturing and sending the signals that the stock ECU is not capable of understanding (i.e. the stock computer has no idea what a MAP signal is, it has no idea what to do when the MAF voltage is over 5v, it doesn't know what to do when you are commanding wider injector pulse widths and it knows the narrow band O2 sensors are out of operating range) So no there is no way to use a standalone and have the OBDII read properly. There are ways to fake OBDII signals but you are on your own with that since it is kind of criminal, I certainly wouldn't encourage someone to sell it.

@yoda-g3 I would not worry about lean conditions unless they are under boost. If you are lean on decel etc that is totally fine. It also depends on where you are at 10psi. The good part about the turbo vs the supercharger is you can tune higher boost levels at higher RPMs where the stock fuel map will give you more fuel.

 

[ThomasMore66]

Ok I am done being a smartass for a little while.

@ThomasMore66 I understand you are trying to help, and you are also asking questions because you are trying to learn, but you are still comparing apples to oranges. There are no reflashes for the 80 ECU. No one has successfully been able to get a piggyback ECU to work with the 80 ECU. When you wire a standalone in parallel with the stock ECU you are essentially capturing and sending the signals that the stock ECU is not capable of understanding (i.e. the stock computer has no idea what a MAP signal is, it has no idea what to do when the MAF voltage is over 5v, it doesn't know what to do when you are commanding wider injector pulse widths and it knows the narrow band O2 sensors are out of operating range) So no there is no way to use a standalone and have the OBDII read properly. There are ways to fake OBDII signals but you are on your own with that since it is kind of criminal, I certainly wouldn't encourage someone to sell it.

@yoda-g3 I would not worry about lean conditions unless they are under boost. If you are lean on decel etc that is totally fine. It also depends on where you are at 10psi. The good part about the turbo vs the supercharger is you can tune higher boost levels at higher RPMs where the stock fuel map will give you more fuel.

But you could go Haltech or equivalent and eliminate the stock ecu, right? Just no longer emissions compliant.

 

[NLXTACY]

But you could go Haltech or equivalent and eliminate the stock ecu, right? Just no longer emissions compliant.

Worthy discussion on a new thread

 

[LINUS]

What is the target gasoline / octane minimum you guys are tuning for?

Did I miss that somewhere in here already?

@scottryana , @NLXTACY
Really was serious.

I'm just making sure whatever your target fuel, it's commonly available to all who want a turbo but maybe don't have the minimum octane at a pump reasonably close to them.
As a former refinery operator, gas is as varied by states as CARB / emissions.

And I don't want to open my fat trap & commit w/o knowing.

92 octane? 89 octane (either w/ or w/o 10% methanol)?
______________________________________

-Beyond the fuel issue, I've still got that 3) - 2 1/16" gauge A - pillar unit here.
Retains the A-pillar grab handle as it is.

I have it being quoted for copies made, and maybe it's a complimentary piece for this as a whole (wanted a $$$ before I ask / poll the forum as to interest).

 

[Mudder]

@LINUS, I'm willing to bet it'll be 91 to 92 octane minimum due to the compression of the motor and avoiding pinging when under boost.

 

[LINUS]

@LINUS, I'm willing to bet it'll be 91 to 92 octane minimum due to the compression...

Totally agree.

And I favor turbos to S/C's (S/C was meant to run 91-92 octane from memory).

My asking is really more a "know before I commit all gung-ho" - and either I'm a seriously dumb A-DD guy or it wasn't yet mentioned.

If it runs 89 gas then there's a long-term payoff that a few hundred $$ in purchase price can be offset relatively quickly.
Whichever way you look at it, I just am asking.

We only vendor 91 octane at regular/common pumps in WA, but we can find methanol-free 91 here for $3.99 /gal as of 2/19 when I gassed the Tundra. Real intended market is boats, but I do it in both my 'Yotas.

 

[Heckraiser]

Common sense would be to use whatever is considered "premium" in your area. For me, that's 91 octane. Filling the tank with 91 is really the only "fuel mod" I made in conjunction with my turbo.

 

[scottryana]

Heckraiser is right on the money, you would want to run premium fuel so 91 in CA, CO, etc 93 in other states. And it’s not like you couldn’t run 89 you would just want to be careful about going crazy with the boost. You can still drive a turbo truck for the most part out of boost just using the throttle pedal

So the argument that someone might go to an area where premium fuel isn’t available doesn’t really exclude them from a turbo unless they are there more than 50% of the time and while there they HAVE to have the extra power from forced induction, and if that’s true they have to do an engine swap.

@scottryana , @NLXTACY
Really was serious.

I'm just making sure whatever your target fuel, it's commonly available to all who want a turbo but maybe don't have the minimum octane at a pump reasonably close to them.
As a former refinery operator, gas is as varied by states as CARB / emissions.

And I don't want to open my fat trap & commit w/o knowing.

92 octane? 89 octane (either w/ or w/o 10% methanol)?
______________________________________

-Beyond the fuel issue, I've still got that 3) - 2 1/16" gauge A - pillar unit here.
Retains the A-pillar grab handle as it is.

I have it being quoted for copies made, and maybe it's a complimentary piece for this as a whole (wanted a $$$ before I ask / poll the forum as to interest).

 

[subzali]

Totally agree.

And I favor turbos to S/C's (S/C was meant to run 91-92 octane from memory).

My asking is really more a "know before I commit all gung-ho" - and either I'm a seriously dumb A-DD guy or it wasn't yet mentioned.

If it runs 89 gas then there's a long-term payoff that a few hundred $$ in purchase price can be offset relatively quickly.
Whichever way you look at it, I just am asking.

We only vendor 91 octane at regular/common pumps in WA, but we can find methanol-free 91 here for $3.99 /gal as of 2/19 when I gassed the Tundra. Real intended market is boats, but I do it in both my 'Yotas.

I think you mean ethanol? Up to 10% ethanol (E10) as is standard in most gasoline around the country shouldn’t make a difference for most people. Premium E10 or premium ethanol-free could both be used, in other words.

 

[yoda-g3]

... You can still drive a turbo truck for the most part out of boost just using the throttle pedal

Wait, what??? I've yet to experience this.

 

[yoda-g3]

@yoda-g3 I would not worry about lean conditions unless they are under boost. If you are lean on decel etc that is totally fine. It also depends on where you are at 10psi. The good part about the turbo vs the supercharger is you can tune higher boost levels at higher RPMs where the stock fuel map will give you more fuel.[/QUOTE]

Regular cruising is totally fine now. It stays pretty close to 14.7 across the board. 6-7 psi on a level grade hits the 11-13afr. Where I see creep is when pulling a hard grade, especially between shifts if I get on it. Just this morning it's below 10 degrees here and on a slight incline I gunned it to get into traffic, it hit 10-11psi, then on the shift it jumps to 15+psi. My gauges are too far apart to safely monitor both of them, but I think my AFR jumped over 15-16 briefly. No ping though. Probably due to the cold temps.

What controller are you running to hit that higher boost mark? Pretty much piggyback is the only option right? I discovered that my Uni-chip was regularly running in the 15-18afr range once i got my wide-band on.... It's now on a shelf. My only other experience has been a custom programmable SMT6 variant from URD way back in the day for a SC'd 3.4. Drove me crazy trying to get the map down though.

 

[FJnotCJ]

Please put me on the list. Sounds like fun...