Did my turbo die?! (1 Viewer)

[IanB]

Remove your mbc and run the pressure line directly to the actuator. Easy win for safe turbo pressure until you figure it out.

Yup, good starting point, factory wastegate setting is about 10psi which won't help your power situation, but will keep the turbo safe. Also make sure the hoses from the turbo compressor to MBC to wastegate are tight and free of damage, the fact your boost levels are soaring sounds like one of the hoses popped off or the hose got damaged.

 

[mudgudgeon]

I agree, remove the boost controller for now is wise, it will save your turbo, and give you a chance to sort out the other stuff.


The standard crank case breather goes from rocker cover, to the intake pipe just after the intercooler.
It may be worth disconnecting it, and venting into a clear plastic bottle to see if you are losing oil here. Make sure to cap of any open ends if you do.
Also, check that it is not blocked. If there is a restriction in the crank case vent, it can cause oil leaks, or oil consumption by pressuring the crankcase. This can force oil past the rings, or past valve seals

What kind of boost controller do you have?
What happened to the old one? Are you saying the old one caused the engine to run on its own oil? Or that the IP failure caused that?

Its definitely a good idea to check that the waste gate is operating correctly.

the 15psi-23 psi range doesn't seem to add any additional power (increase in speed/RPM) or EGT.

That's because the turbo is spinning too fast, it can't actually pump any more air. I found 18psi was about its limit, even then, that's too much for the stock turbo

Do you think it's possible that my current pump tune is causing this significant oil los

No, I think there is definitely issues with your tune, but it's almost certainly unrelated to oil loss.

When I last checked, oil level was right in the middle between L and F. 500Km later I had barely anything on the dipstick. I would say that is about 1 liter of oil that went missing. Would you agree ?

From memory, from L to F is about 1litre.
If you are losing that much oil, there'll be evidence. Either a wet leak somewhere, or blue smoke if it's being burnt, or a smell of burnt oil from the exhaust.
If compression test was good, this rules out rings, unless there's other issues.
It may be leaking past the turbo oil seal and be being burnt.
It is probably a good idea to check for turbo shaft play.

High boost will also increase peak firing pressure which can lift the head or blow the gasket. Another reason to check coolant.

Possible for sure. But the 1HD-T engines are regularly being boosted to 35psi ++ with stock head bolts and head gasket etc

Good tip on checking the air filter too.

 

[oszkari]

I visually inspected all my air hoses and there are no visible signs of damage. All connections seems to be solid. Probably some of them I wouldn’t be able to take off without cutting it.

I checked my coolant for contamination . The coolant turned a little bit brownish on my radiator cap especially if I fiddled around with it for a bit. I would think it comes from sediments. Other than that I think looks ok. (pic attached)

I checked for leaks around the engine block and under the vehicle.

- the valve cover around the no 4 bearing cap might have a bit of fresh wet spot. I also have a wet spot on the engine block around the starter wiring. (Pic attached)
- there is a wet spot on the turbo where the air hoses connect. (Pic attached) Other than that is bone dry.

I checked my oil level again, and although it is definitely less oil than 5 days ago it isn’t that bad as I initially thought (pic attached). Yesterday I checked the oil level after I tried to fire up the cruiser, hence the oil level was way lower. I should have mentioned that in my original post

I tried to fire up the cruiser again. Rough and smokey start (it’s cold outside) Timing belt, engine check and the red light at the battery stays on so after 4-5 seconds I turned it off. It’s like all the lights that are normally ON during the cranking remain ON even after the engine is fired up?!

If I top up the oil, would it be safe to try to start the engine again?!

Thanks again for all the input!! I really appreciate it!

 

[oszkari]

Yup, good starting point, factory wastegate setting is about 10psi which won't help your power situation, but will keep the turbo safe. Also make sure the hoses from the turbo compressor to MBC to wastegate are tight and free of damage, the fact your boost levels are soaring sounds like one of the hoses popped off or the hose got damaged.

I will do that. Thanks!

 

[oszkari]

I agree, remove the boost controller for now is wise, it will save your turbo, and give you a chance to sort out the other stuff.


The standard crank case breather goes from rocker cover, to the intake pipe just after the intercooler.
It may be worth disconnecting it, and venting into a clear plastic bottle to see if you are losing oil here. Make sure to cap of any open ends if you do.
Also, check that it is not blocked. If there is a restriction in the crank case vent, it can cause oil leaks, or oil consumption by pressuring the crankcase. This can force oil past the rings, or past valve seals

I will try that.

What kind of boost controller do you have?
What happened to the old one? Are you saying the old one caused the engine to run on its own oil? Or that the IP failure caused that?

Its definitely a good idea to check that the waste gate is operating correctly.

My new boost controller is Hallman PRO RX. The old one was Prosport and was working perfectly until I had the IP failure. After that the boost was going to the roof. I have tried to adjust it but it seemed that either I can do below 10 psi or infinite, that's why I have changed it.

With the new Hallman I was able to set the max boost to around 19-20psi (that was with the MBC turned to minimum).
Not what I wanted but it was certainly better than infinite.

That's because the turbo is spinning too fast, it can't actually pump any more air. I found 18psi was about its limit, even then, that's too much for the stock turbo



No, I think there is definitely issues with your tune, but it's almost certainly unrelated to oil loss.

Got it! Can I say that whatever it is it will be unrelated to my IP?

From memory, from L to F is about ,1litre.
If you are losing that much oil, there'll be evidence. Either a wet leak somewhere, or blue smoke if it's being burnt, or a smell of burnt oil from the exhaust.
If compression test was good, this rules out rings, unless there's other issues.
It may be leaking past the turbo oil seal and be being burnt.
It is probably a good idea to check for turbo shaft play.

My oil loss is is significant but I was wrong when I said one liter/ 500km. Yesterday I checked the oil level right after I fired up the engine.
Before my IP issues the cruiser was burning one liter of oil after 7000km. And it was spot on for 5 years in a row. Now it leaks or burns at least twice of that.

Good tip on checking the air filter too.

The air filter is clean, no sign of anything bad.

 

[IanB]

Start by bypassing the boost controller, and making sure the wastegate holds boost to 10psi, if for some reason the wastegate isn't opening properly then no manual boost controller will work properly. If that works, reinstall the MBC and give the tubing and connections a good once over to make certain you have no leaks or the MBC won't work properly. Ziptie the tubing connections so no air can sneak past, and the hoses can't work themselves off.

 

[oszkari]

Start by bypassing the boost controller, and making sure the wastegate holds boost to 10psi, if for some reason the wastegate isn't opening properly then no manual boost controller will work properly. If that works, reinstall the MBC and give the tubing and connections a good once over to make certain you have no leaks or the MBC won't work properly. Ziptie the tubing connections so no air can sneak past, and the hoses can't work themselves off.

That would be my next step.

Any idea why my TBELT/Engine and Ignition lights stay on even after I fired up the engine?!
Can this be related to the oil loss/MBC issues I'm having or it's more of a newly surfaced starter/cranking/wiring issue?

I'm a bit reluctant to let the engine run with those lights On..

 

[mudgudgeon]

The T belt light will come at an interval of 100k km after it was last reset, regardless of when T belt was actually changed.
Do you know when it was last reset?

Post a pic of the dash lights all lit up and engine running.

Sometimes an alternator or ground problem can cause random lights to come on

 

[EngEngr]

similar issue here on the dash lights:
All warning lights on, no charge, cold start

another thing i've had luck with is putting florescent dye in the leaking fluid of choice (i used mine for PS fluid),your engine oil, and drive around for a bit - break out the UV flashlight and check for where it could be going and sourcing from.

The standard crank case breather goes from rocker cover, to the intake pipe just after the intercooler.
It may be worth disconnecting it, and venting into a clear plastic bottle to see if you are losing oil here. Make sure to cap of any open ends if you do.
Also, check that it is not blocked. If there is a restriction in the crank case vent, it can cause oil leaks, or oil consumption by pressuring the crankcase. This can force oil past the rings, or past valve seals

checking the PCV blowby oil carryover is also a good idea - if your turbine C seal is shot, you can have high blowby from the turbo. (exhaust gas pressure going into the center section, down the drain line, and into the crankcase).

There is a reason why high power turbo engines run open crankcase ventilation to a catch can with a drain back to the pan.

 

[dan1554]

Did you pull the charge pipe to look for oil? After ditching the mbc that is the next thing I would do. This is why:

- turbo run too high
- turbo looks original
- no signs of oil leakage elsewhere
- gunked up wastegate actuator
- ~1L oil loss every 3500km
- it should only take about 10 minutes
- its what I would put money on if I had to
- possible oil smoke at startup?

If there is oil coming from the turbo, you will see dark oil swirls in the charge pipe.

 

[mudgudgeon]

Got it! Can I say that whatever it is it will be unrelated to my IP?

Yes. There is no way for oil to enter the injection pump.

 

[mudgudgeon]

There is a reason why high power turbo engines run open crankcase ventilation to a catch can with a drain back to the pan.

Yep, agreed.

There was a member who recently had excessive oil consumption in a 1HD-T, the cause was a catch can that was too restrictive, the solution, vent to atmosphere

 

[oszkari]

This is how my instrument panel looked like. The door was actually open when I took the picture so that was the only thing that was working as expected.

That part is fixed now. One of the wires somehow got loose overnight and the alternator couldn't charge the batteries. I would never expect a behaviour like this, but what do I know..

I will make a list out of what was recommended here and next week I'm going to pull out the turbo, MBC and do a thorough inspection of all lines.

I would like to thank you all for your help!! you have no idea how grateful I'm!

 

[IanB]

Glad you got the dash light stuff figured out, when it rains it pours eh?

Don't pull your turbo out just yet, you can check shaft play with the inlet hose removed, and by removing the MBC you can check wastegate function and confirm everything's working as intended there. If the turbo check out, then you can move on to checking other things.

 

[mudgudgeon]

Glad you got the dash light stuff figured out, when it rains it pours eh?

Don't pull your turbo out just yet, you can check shaft play with the inlet hose removed, and by removing the MBC you can check wastegate function and confirm everything's working as intended there. If the turbo check out, then you can move on to checking other things.

Agreed. Usually pours cats and dogs too!

Removing the turbo is a bear of a job. Lots of swearing, and little child sized hands, and next level contortionist skills required!

Remove the inlet hose from the front of the turbo to check for play. A little side to side movement is OK, but it should be barely evident. Play in/out (or front to back) is no good. Any play in/out means the compressor can potentially contact the housing. Boosting to the point of choke flow (15psi +) increases the risk of this exponentially.

 

[Tapage]

Maybe I miss it .. but did you have a catch can .. ?

 

[IanB]

Agreed. Usually pours cats and dogs too!

Removing the turbo is a bear of a job. Lots of swearing, and little child sized hands, and next level contortionist skills required!

Remove the inlet hose from the front of the turbo to check for play. A little side to side movement is OK, but it should be barely evident. Play in/out (or front to back) is no good. Any play in/out means the compressor can potentially contact the housing. Boosting to the point of choke flow (15psi +) increases the risk of this exponentially.

That's the best description of how to check for shaft play and what to look for I've seen, thanks.

 

[oszkari]

Maybe I miss it .. but did you have a catch can .. ?

No catch can yet. Is there any off the shelf product that I could get?

 

[oszkari]

Updates...

I have redone my MBC and after a test run there is a significant improvement. Lot more power and the MBC seems to be doing its job.

My previous MBC was installed using a T in between the turbo compression side and the waste gate actuator. (pic attached). I have removed the T, capped the compression side of the turbo (where the clamp is on the pic) and went directly from the wastage actuator to the mbc output. I T-d the intake manifold air hose for the mbc input.

Did I do it right? I don't really understand how my previous mbc was working with the T there?! How was the mbc controlling the pressure if there was a direct path between the compression side and the wastage ?

I have also checked the:

- Intake manifold is clean.
- Crank case breather had a thin oil film in it but nothing that would drip.
- Hose from turbo to air box had a thicker oil film but no drip. Air box is clean.
- Turbo shaft has a little (barely can feel it) side movement. No in/out movement.
- Wastage actuator is working (the rod is moving when under pressure). If MBC is removed wastage kicks in at 10 psi.
- MBC wasn't clogged but the the ceramic ball had a bit of oil on it.

I have also cleaned the engine block couple of days ago, I have no new wet spot since then. I guess it could mean that the oil was burnt and not leaked or just I didn't have enough pressure to cause leak. ( I have tried to be really careful not to over boost)

I have changed oil and I plan to monitor the oil consumption. Is there anything I missed and should do?

Thanks again!

 

[oszkari]

Agreed. Usually pours cats and dogs too!

Removing the turbo is a bear of a job. Lots of swearing, and little child sized hands, and next level contortionist skills required!

Remove the inlet hose from the front of the turbo to check for play. A little side to side movement is OK, but it should be barely evident. Play in/out (or front to back) is no good. Any play in/out means the compressor can potentially contact the housing. Boosting to the point of choke flow (15psi +) increases the risk of this exponentially.

Today I understood why you didn't recommend taking the turbo out..I would definitely need work on my contortionist skills first