Hey everyone,
Before I get into my tale of woe, this thread is simply to provide you with my experience with trying, and failing, to protect my HJ61 from the dreaded brown cancer. If you have experience (good or bad) with any particular product over time please post them up. I'm keen to hear from people who have been able to see how a product performs over time.
This post relates to:
As usual the family spent some time during January driving around on the beach for the summer holidays. As usual, once we got back this required me to spend hours cleaning the cruiser and getting the sand and salt out of the various places that we know it shouldn't be. The cruiser has been mostly rust free since I bought it 6 years ago but now the cancer has started with fury.
About two weeks after getting back from the holiday I noticed a little brown stain at the bottom of the driver and passenger side front doors, in the quarter panel in the gap adjacent to the bonnet, and a few other places. Awesome. I noted to myself that I should get to that as soon as possible.
Two weeks later (sooner than possible), the rust was literally bubbling through the paint.
So, I have decided to post up my observations about the rust protection that I did, why it seems to have failed, and hopefully provide some useful information so you can avoid being salt schooled like me.
Preventative measures
Within about 3 months of buying the cruiser I researched mud and various other places for what people used for preventing rust - I knew 60 series cruisers were prone to turning brown and losing weight over time.
I decided to get Valvoline Tectyl 506 in bulk containers and set about applying it to every possible cavity and uv protected zone in the cruiser - i decided to put some in areas that could easily be inspected so that if it deteriorated I could see it and do a recoat. Mistake #1.
So, by the time I finished there was Tectyl in the chassis, doors, quarter panels, in behind the hinges over the pillars and everywhere else that you can get to with a 3 foot long atomising wand. Mistake #2.
The underside of the body was already coated in a bituminous paint so I didn't have to deal with this.
The wheel arches were also still fully protected with some sort of poly body deadener, so didn't do anything here either.
What I found when inspecting the bubbles
So, the door cards had to come off, and I was expecting to see that all the Tectyl had degraded and flaked off the panels, I was wrong.
The Tectyl at first inspection looked fine and still had good adhesion to the paint, but...
...this is what happens when it is exposed to sitting water for more than a day or so. We all know that water will get inside the doors past the wiper seals/felts. I clean these areas thoroughly and also use a wand to wash inside the doors to get the salt out.
I have also observed that with new seals, the seal actually obstructs the drain holes (except the forward most hole) and prevents water from coming out unless you open the door. Consequently, water can get in and get stuck in the door cavity - especially if you park on a hill and the water backs up behind the forward most hole.
The rust bubble shown in the first pic in this post appears to have started in one of the holes where the door seal plug pushes through. The rust bubble was so flakey that I could pull the seal plug out with little force and could push a screwdriver handle through it. I can't say for sure, but when looking at the other plugs and the coating that was still on them, I think the Tectyl just flaked off and the plug wore a hole in the paint.
Now, I have no proof of the following but is my best guess at what has happened. At various times I had pulled the door cards off and inspected inside the doors. I have also done inspections in other areas. At times the Tectyl had dried and cracks had started to appear, but it seemed to still be stuck down to the paint. When this happened, I'd spray the area with alcohol and park the car in the sun to make sure there was no moisture in the cracks and then reapply Tectyl to the affected zone while still warm - as recommended by Valvolene. The alcohol was sprayed over all of the area in the image above, and you can see that only the product at the bottom has been affected, so I don't believe the alcohol has caused the issue. I am wondering if the added layers/thickness of Tectyl has caused shrinkage and caused it to crack and peel off the paint. Regardless its annoying.
After inspecting further, and particularly in the quarter panel to see why the rust bubbled up there, I have found that the Tectyl has failed in the same way at the very top of the panels. To be clear, I have not driven the cruiser through 4' deep water, and parked it there, so there is no way that water has pooled in these areas. All I can assume is that condensation has caused the same issue to occur. I am also conscious that the tops of the quarter panels go through significant thermal cycling in our climate. Anyway, the Tectyl failed here also, and I hadn't put any additional product up in these areas as I had in the doors. Due to the location, I am also not sure that my preparation process was as thorough in these areas.
Now what
The rust has been cut out, prep'd, and an alternative product applied (more on that below). But I want to highlight the serious PITA with Tectyl or any other wax based rust proofing product - it is extremely time consuming to remove. It took over two hours per door to adequately clean the product off before applying anything else. I used hot caustic wash (as recommended by Valvolene) degreaser and then wax and bug remover.
Tectyl verdict
If you love your cruiser, don't ever want to sell it, and want to protect it from rusting in salty conditions, find something else. If for no other reason, the wax is so hard to remove if you need to do any panel work, weld anything that it has been applied to, or you need access for any other reason.
To be fair, the Tectyl that wasn't affected by water, was still tacky, it does self heel to a degree as I tested this a couple of times, and it does allow easy reapplication (you have to deal with the fact that any dust or dirt stuck to the previous coat then becomes a permanent feature, unless you clean off the previous coats).
The next trial
Given the experience with Tectyl, I have researched a number of alternative products and admit that I'm not happy with anything on the market. They are either too tricky to apply (or reapply) for vehicles that spend their lives being covered in mud, salt, sand and other unclean things, or they need constant reapplication and are prone to getting salt/water inclusions. With this in mind I have settled on using two bituminous products by Septone: chassis black, and rust shield. Both of which are sold at the local auto parts store. They are essentially the same product, one is just thicker than the other.
The reason for my decision was that I have been using the chassis black on my rear bar for the last 3 years, and while it rubs off and degrades in UV, there has been no rust on the bar at all where it is covered in chassis black. The other thing is that because it is bituminous it is easily removed, or simply reapplied over the last coat. See image below.
Right hand side: chassis black removed from using bar as a step (twice a week for 15 months).
Middle: chassis black rubbed off with Mineral Turpentine and paper towel (took about 1 minute).
Left hand side: chassis black removed with unleaded petrol (took about 20 seconds).
Note: you can see how thin the product goes on, there is 3-5 coats on this bar, depending on the location.
Rust Proofing - take two
I have now used the rust shield in a number of places, including the doors where I had to clean out the Tectyl, the diff casings, wheel arches, and others. There are a number of places I am yet to get to and will post up some more information and images once I get back to do a second pass (and remember to take photos).
When applying the rust shield to the inside of the bar shown above, I managed to get some water caught inside and sprayed over the top - I was really happy about this. However, I worked out how to fix it using a mix of unleaded petrol, alcohol and my preferred anti-explosive hydrocarbon additive (diesel). The unleaded dissolves the coating, the alcohol absorbs the water and as the mixture evaporates, the coating settles back onto the surface and resets. With my experiment it took about 1 hour to evaporate and reset. WARNING: USING THESE INGREDIENTS IS EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND YOU DO SO AT YOUR OWN RISK!
I am currently considering what I am going to do now that the rust has started, as it is popping up everywhere. I am thinking it is time to do the job (that I have been avoiding) properly and strip out the body, sand blast the areas with brown spots, and put some real paint on it. With the good reviews on mud, I think I've convinced myself to try U-pol Raptor inside and out and go through the process of replacing the rear sliding window frames, and other bits of trim that now go crunch when I touch them.
I hope the information above helps someone.
Before I get into my tale of woe, this thread is simply to provide you with my experience with trying, and failing, to protect my HJ61 from the dreaded brown cancer. If you have experience (good or bad) with any particular product over time please post them up. I'm keen to hear from people who have been able to see how a product performs over time.
This post relates to:
- Product: Valvolene Tectyl 506, applied with schutz gun and atomising wand.
- Preparation: degrease cavities, chassis and panel gaps with aerosol degreaser, and ~20 degrees celcius tap water, scrubbing brush and high pressure water in accessible areas.
- Problem: rust caused in areas where Tectyl flaked and salt f$)ked my cruiser.
- Timeline: 6 years total, 2 years since last application of product.
As usual the family spent some time during January driving around on the beach for the summer holidays. As usual, once we got back this required me to spend hours cleaning the cruiser and getting the sand and salt out of the various places that we know it shouldn't be. The cruiser has been mostly rust free since I bought it 6 years ago but now the cancer has started with fury.
About two weeks after getting back from the holiday I noticed a little brown stain at the bottom of the driver and passenger side front doors, in the quarter panel in the gap adjacent to the bonnet, and a few other places. Awesome. I noted to myself that I should get to that as soon as possible.
Two weeks later (sooner than possible), the rust was literally bubbling through the paint.
So, I have decided to post up my observations about the rust protection that I did, why it seems to have failed, and hopefully provide some useful information so you can avoid being salt schooled like me.
Preventative measures
Within about 3 months of buying the cruiser I researched mud and various other places for what people used for preventing rust - I knew 60 series cruisers were prone to turning brown and losing weight over time.
I decided to get Valvoline Tectyl 506 in bulk containers and set about applying it to every possible cavity and uv protected zone in the cruiser - i decided to put some in areas that could easily be inspected so that if it deteriorated I could see it and do a recoat. Mistake #1.
So, by the time I finished there was Tectyl in the chassis, doors, quarter panels, in behind the hinges over the pillars and everywhere else that you can get to with a 3 foot long atomising wand. Mistake #2.
The underside of the body was already coated in a bituminous paint so I didn't have to deal with this.
The wheel arches were also still fully protected with some sort of poly body deadener, so didn't do anything here either.
What I found when inspecting the bubbles
So, the door cards had to come off, and I was expecting to see that all the Tectyl had degraded and flaked off the panels, I was wrong.
The Tectyl at first inspection looked fine and still had good adhesion to the paint, but...
...this is what happens when it is exposed to sitting water for more than a day or so. We all know that water will get inside the doors past the wiper seals/felts. I clean these areas thoroughly and also use a wand to wash inside the doors to get the salt out.
I have also observed that with new seals, the seal actually obstructs the drain holes (except the forward most hole) and prevents water from coming out unless you open the door. Consequently, water can get in and get stuck in the door cavity - especially if you park on a hill and the water backs up behind the forward most hole.
The rust bubble shown in the first pic in this post appears to have started in one of the holes where the door seal plug pushes through. The rust bubble was so flakey that I could pull the seal plug out with little force and could push a screwdriver handle through it. I can't say for sure, but when looking at the other plugs and the coating that was still on them, I think the Tectyl just flaked off and the plug wore a hole in the paint.
Now, I have no proof of the following but is my best guess at what has happened. At various times I had pulled the door cards off and inspected inside the doors. I have also done inspections in other areas. At times the Tectyl had dried and cracks had started to appear, but it seemed to still be stuck down to the paint. When this happened, I'd spray the area with alcohol and park the car in the sun to make sure there was no moisture in the cracks and then reapply Tectyl to the affected zone while still warm - as recommended by Valvolene. The alcohol was sprayed over all of the area in the image above, and you can see that only the product at the bottom has been affected, so I don't believe the alcohol has caused the issue. I am wondering if the added layers/thickness of Tectyl has caused shrinkage and caused it to crack and peel off the paint. Regardless its annoying.
After inspecting further, and particularly in the quarter panel to see why the rust bubbled up there, I have found that the Tectyl has failed in the same way at the very top of the panels. To be clear, I have not driven the cruiser through 4' deep water, and parked it there, so there is no way that water has pooled in these areas. All I can assume is that condensation has caused the same issue to occur. I am also conscious that the tops of the quarter panels go through significant thermal cycling in our climate. Anyway, the Tectyl failed here also, and I hadn't put any additional product up in these areas as I had in the doors. Due to the location, I am also not sure that my preparation process was as thorough in these areas.
Now what
The rust has been cut out, prep'd, and an alternative product applied (more on that below). But I want to highlight the serious PITA with Tectyl or any other wax based rust proofing product - it is extremely time consuming to remove. It took over two hours per door to adequately clean the product off before applying anything else. I used hot caustic wash (as recommended by Valvolene) degreaser and then wax and bug remover.
Tectyl verdict
If you love your cruiser, don't ever want to sell it, and want to protect it from rusting in salty conditions, find something else. If for no other reason, the wax is so hard to remove if you need to do any panel work, weld anything that it has been applied to, or you need access for any other reason.
To be fair, the Tectyl that wasn't affected by water, was still tacky, it does self heel to a degree as I tested this a couple of times, and it does allow easy reapplication (you have to deal with the fact that any dust or dirt stuck to the previous coat then becomes a permanent feature, unless you clean off the previous coats).
The next trial
Given the experience with Tectyl, I have researched a number of alternative products and admit that I'm not happy with anything on the market. They are either too tricky to apply (or reapply) for vehicles that spend their lives being covered in mud, salt, sand and other unclean things, or they need constant reapplication and are prone to getting salt/water inclusions. With this in mind I have settled on using two bituminous products by Septone: chassis black, and rust shield. Both of which are sold at the local auto parts store. They are essentially the same product, one is just thicker than the other.
The reason for my decision was that I have been using the chassis black on my rear bar for the last 3 years, and while it rubs off and degrades in UV, there has been no rust on the bar at all where it is covered in chassis black. The other thing is that because it is bituminous it is easily removed, or simply reapplied over the last coat. See image below.
Right hand side: chassis black removed from using bar as a step (twice a week for 15 months).
Middle: chassis black rubbed off with Mineral Turpentine and paper towel (took about 1 minute).
Left hand side: chassis black removed with unleaded petrol (took about 20 seconds).
Note: you can see how thin the product goes on, there is 3-5 coats on this bar, depending on the location.
Rust Proofing - take two
I have now used the rust shield in a number of places, including the doors where I had to clean out the Tectyl, the diff casings, wheel arches, and others. There are a number of places I am yet to get to and will post up some more information and images once I get back to do a second pass (and remember to take photos).
When applying the rust shield to the inside of the bar shown above, I managed to get some water caught inside and sprayed over the top - I was really happy about this. However, I worked out how to fix it using a mix of unleaded petrol, alcohol and my preferred anti-explosive hydrocarbon additive (diesel). The unleaded dissolves the coating, the alcohol absorbs the water and as the mixture evaporates, the coating settles back onto the surface and resets. With my experiment it took about 1 hour to evaporate and reset. WARNING: USING THESE INGREDIENTS IS EXTREMELY HAZARDOUS AND YOU DO SO AT YOUR OWN RISK!
I am currently considering what I am going to do now that the rust has started, as it is popping up everywhere. I am thinking it is time to do the job (that I have been avoiding) properly and strip out the body, sand blast the areas with brown spots, and put some real paint on it. With the good reviews on mud, I think I've convinced myself to try U-pol Raptor inside and out and go through the process of replacing the rear sliding window frames, and other bits of trim that now go crunch when I touch them.
I hope the information above helps someone.
A full stainless body and chassis is possible, just not with the contents of my wallet.
