the Sandlot a Bantam T3C resto-mod (1 Viewer)

[half k cruiser]

I also received several of my suspension pieces in the mail today. Before I get the floor secured down I will need to figure out my upper shock mount brackets and get those welded in along with the final two crossbeams. More to come.

 

[half k cruiser]

Everything needed to retrofit shocks onto the T3C minus the upper shock mount plates that I will have to fab and locate onto the frame. I have an idea of how to tie the upper shock mount back into my #2 cross member. The way I have planned will transfer a lot of unneeded stress off of the thin wall of the L-channel. Unfortunately there does not appear to be any information out there as far as how much distance from eye to eye on the shocks so I will just have to wing it. I'm thinking the shocks need to be under slight compression when I install them rather than maxed out. If anyone has any input on this it would be very welcome.

 

[cjmoon]

You have the right idea on shock placement. Assume In a Dynamic situation the Leaf spring will extend a little more than static. Although in reality it really doesn't matter. Most vehicles I've worked on travel is limited by the shock.

 

[love2fly]

I have used the truck or trailer stake pockets that are sold at many trailer supply company's for the upper mount supports, as for setting up the shock and travel its pretty easy, 1st measure with the weight on the axle the distance from the lower to upper eye for the shock, then raise the trailer were the weight is off the axle and spring(s) have the load, measure that distance. From that you can find a shock with at least 1" more travel on both ends, compressed and extended. The web has some good places to go to to calculate new shocks for cars and trailers that have been modified or new. How to Measure Shocks - Shockwarehouse - Shockwarehouse.com

 

[StucknKS]

What are you doing for wheels and tires? Going to use the original axle?

I have a small enclosed trailer that I am considering swapping out to FZJ80 wheels just haven’t looked into yet.

Trailer is looking fantastic by the way.

 

[love2fly]

Also worth thinking about - Quote Taken from a gents on the web.

One way to look at it, is that when you consider the role of the shock, it is to damp oscillations of the suspension. The oscillations occur when the spring cycles more than one time, i.e. bounces. Now, consider that on most trailers, a high spring rate is employed to carry heavy loads; then, when a trailer is loaded, the load doesn't move, only the wheel moves (ideally). The mass of the load actually dampens the movement of the wheel. This is obvious if you consider the following: remove the rear leaf springs for a 1 ton truck, and put them on a stock samurai. The springs will not really move very much, and its almost like there is no suspension. This is the unloaded trailer. Then, put the samurai springs on the truck; here the springs will compress and the truck will not really move at all (provided the truck hasn't maxed the suspension to the bump stops). This is the loaded trailer.

Now, the reason the shock would be useless in most situations, is that on the unloaded trailer, the suspension doesn't move, therefore there is no movement to damp, and the shock just sits there (i.e. no cycling of the suspension).

On the loaded trailer, the load acts as the damping force for the system, and a shock would be redundant.

Keep in mind also, that ride quality is not a factor. In that respect, a trailer suspensions only two duties are to carry a load without compressing completely, and to allow the driver to maintain control of the trailer. Cost is also a factor. Finally, realize that a suspension where shocks play pivotal role (i.e. a vehicle) is not able to carry much weight. Compare a truck, even a 1 ton, to a trailer that easily haul 5000lbs. Then think how much more it would cost to make that trailer suspension feel and perform like the trucks in terms of ride quality.

 

[half k cruiser]

I have used the truck or trailer stake pockets that are sold at many trailer supply company's for the upper mount supports, as for setting up the shock and travel its pretty easy, 1st measure with the weight on the axle the distance from the lower to upper eye for the shock, then raise the trailer were the weight is off the axle and spring(s) have the load, measure that distance. From that you can find a shock with at least 1" more travel on both ends, compressed and extended. The web has some good places to go to to calculate new shocks for cars and trailers that have been modified or new. How to Measure Shocks - Shockwarehouse - Shockwarehouse.com



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The stake pocket idea is brilliant and could save me some significant time.

 

[half k cruiser]

What are you doing for wheels and tires? Going to use the original axle?

I have a small enclosed trailer that I am considering swapping out to FZJ80 wheels just haven’t looked into yet.

Trailer is looking fantastic by the way.

Thanks brother. Not sure yet on wheels, but I am staying with the five lug bolt pattern. As for tires I'm thinking a 31x10.50 Kumho AT51. The current tires are a 28'' so I should see some lift out of it.

 

[ntsqd]

I partly agree with, and partly disagree with that quote about shocks on a trailer. It is true that trailer specific springs are deliberately made with a high spring rate and as such don't deflect much even with a load on/in the trailer. This is intentional because then the ride height of the trailer doesn't vary much loaded vs. unloaded. A collateral action of this is that high spring-rate springs in this application don't need much damping. Which saves the mfg of the trailer additional parts and cost.

It is not true that ride quality of a trailer doesn't matter. Those who subscribe to that idea in off-road trailers must only like their eggs scrambled and their beer very foamy. Use supple springs with dampers on an off-road trailer and enjoy liquid beer and whole eggs. Just know that the loading can vary the ride height or attitude.
The load is never, ever a damping force - no matter what the observer thinks he/she saw happen.

 

[half k cruiser]

I made a lot of progress on the trailer yesterday. Pulled the axle out from underneath and got it and the leaf packs cleaned and POR-15 brushed on.

 

[half k cruiser]

Then I ran smack into my first problem of the day. I had previously ordered a set of front CJ2 spring plates from Rockauto. I should have inspected them better because the passenger side plate is not drilled correctly for the application. I really didn't feel like putting my project on hold for 3 days so I welded up the two offending holes and drilled out correct ones. Problem solved, problem staying solved.

Then I used @love2fly 's suggestion about stake pockets. I picked these up for $1.25 ea at the local trailer supply. Drilled a 1/2 hole direct center, welded in the Dorman shock studs, and we're off to the races.

 

[half k cruiser]

Locating the upper shock mounts was a crap shoot. I can find no information out there as to how many inches into the frame the stud sits. So using some pictures and my own measurements I went 6.5'' from the nearest cross beam to the center of the stud. This is as vertical as I can get the shock and not bottom it out at full compression of the leaf.

 

[half k cruiser]

Since the upper mounts are 3/16'' and they are only attached to a 1/8'' piece of L-channel I decided to tie them back to the 2nd crossbeam. Before I could move them slightly by hand and I didn't want the shock cycling to fatigue the box frame. After burning these in the upper mounts are completely solid.

Finally I top coated everything that will be difficult / impossible to get to with the floor installed.

 

[half k cruiser]

One last test fit of the floor before I tack it down.

 

[half k cruiser]

I then turned my attention to the trailers bodywork. Both forward lower corners were in bad shape having sheared away during the removal process. I was able to clean the lower inch of the perimeter inside and out and then repair the corners with some 18ga patches that I made. I think with a little skim of bondo none will be the wiser.

 

[half k cruiser]

With the tongue of the trailer supported by a section of lawn timber on end, and no one to help me, I decided to do the smart thing and test fit the tub by myself. This required carefully climbing onto the trailer bed while standing inside the body tub.

Everything is lining up rather nicely, but I still have a bit of bodywork to do before I tack the tub back in place.

 

[half k cruiser]

A couple of things I'm currently debating on and am open for input / suggestions.

1) Floor - I think I will just drill two small holes through it over the middle cross beams, then tack it down there. When I removed the original this seemed to be how it was installed.

2) Seams - after everything is welded up I thought about taking seam sealer all the way around the inside of the bed and the outside where the tub meets the frame.

3) Paint - I'm currently debating whether I want to try my hand at spraying this with a single stage paint or use tintable raptor liner like I did with my 80 series. Also debating on color since it could be pulled behind any combination of my 3 vehicles, white 80, red 80, silver 120. So far the following OEM Toyota colors are under consideration.

- Toyota 4V6 Quick Sand
- Toyota 1H5 Cement Grey

 

[StucknKS]

Raptor Liner and Quicksand.

That’s my vote. It would look good behind any of your vehicles and be durable.

 

[half k cruiser]

The tub is tacked in place and level. There is a slight outward bow in the middle of the tub. The stake pockets in the center measure 5/8'' further apart then the ones front and rear. I'm not sure if they came from the factory like this or mine got overloaded at some point.

 

[half k cruiser]

So I discovered something interesting about this trailer design. It is incredibly susceptible to torsional forces. This makes sense as the crossbeams are merely set into two pieces of 1/8 L-channel for the frame rails. I first noticed the issue when I finished burning in the crossbeams and went to lay the floor. There was a visible warp and my tape measure confirmed it. The DS front was just over an inch higher then PS and the DS rear was an inch lower.

At first I thought I would have to cut the crossbeams back out in order to straighten. I decided to try a simpler approach first by putting a lawn timber under the short side and then pressing my weight down on the tall side. Amazingly it worked ! In fact I was able to tweak it multiple times until everything lined up. Then I got to thinking, if I can do this with my body weight, imagine what might happen off road. Not wanting to pull into camp and discover a warped floor or twisted frame I came up with a solution.

You see the main problem is the L-channel. At 1/8'' thickness it just can't resist the torsional loading. However, 1'' by 1/8'' wall square tube has a great deal of rigidity. So I started measuring and came up with the two pieces above.

The only big consideration is mounting them far enough inboard to clear my shocks when I go to install. I came in 5 inches from the bottom inside edge of the L-channel.

Using a floor jack up front I torqued the trailer to level and even while I tacked everything in place.

Then I gave everything an initial single pass with the welder.

I've double checked and the corners are hitting spot on at the same heights. I will probably go back and blast the seams again at a higher voltage in order to keep everything squared up.