Webasto install HDJ81 (2 Viewers)

[nickw]

How much would one cost for a BJ60?
I only got the little 3B, so I don't think it would need as many BTU's.

I have heard of people buying farm heaters for pretty cheap ($300-500 I think?). They just went down to the John Deere dealer and ordered one. Or maybe you could get one meant for a truck trailer or something. I don't have tons of money, so cost effective alternatives are nice, just as long as I am not compromising quality and reliability.

Thanks,
Nick

 

[lowenbrau]

How much would one cost for a BJ60?
I only got the little 3B, so I don't think it would need as many BTU's.

I have heard of people buying farm heaters for pretty cheap ($300-500 I think?). They just went down to the John Deere dealer and ordered one. Or maybe you could get one meant for a truck trailer or something. I don't have tons of money, so cost effective alternatives are nice, just as long as I am not compromising quality and reliability.

Thanks,
Nick

Farm heaters eh? See if you can find some details, that sounds interesting.

 

[snowcruiser]

Wayne this is a great setup...thanks for sharing your experience. I hope to add a Webasto or Espar heater after a diesel conversion some day. Do you know anyone with any experience using the gasoline version? It seems a little more dangerous to me.

Does this heater heat coolant to a temperature that is warm enough to heat the cabin of the truck with the engine off and perhaps the heater fan on? I am curious if it is warm enough to say run the defroster for 8-10 hours when sleeping in the truck in sub-zero winter temps to avoid condensation and scraping of the interior windows? I will be running a test to see what sort of drain the heater fan puts on a battery. I was hoping to get someone with an Ammeter to get a reading of the amp draw from the fan but so far my previous requests last year have not been answered.

For those of you considering this option there is another product out there that runs on propane. http://www.cp.duluth.mn.us/~hilton/ I wrote up a little descriptionafter speaking with the owner of the company last year in the aux. heater thread in outfitting at this link. https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=13185&highlight=aux+heater No personal experience yet but another great option.

Lowenbrau...I think I have been in touch with you before but could you comment on your specific experience using the Webasto unit to heat the cab while camping? Do you use the heater fan and stock heater core and/or run the defroster? Is this sufficient to avoid condensation on the inside of the truck in sub-zero temps? How much strain does the fan put on your battery? I assume you are running a 24 volt setup.

Thanks for a great thread!

 

[lowenbrau]

Lowenbrau...I think I have been in touch with you before but could you comment on your specific experience using the Webasto unit to heat the cab while camping? Do you use the heater fan and stock heater core and/or run the defroster? Is this sufficient to avoid condensation on the inside of the truck in sub-zero temps? How much strain does the fan put on your battery? I assume you are running a 24 volt setup.

Thanks for a great thread!

Yup I have slept comfortably in the back of my Cruiser in -25C weather. It actually gets quite hot. If you run the heater all night with the fan running you will run the batteries down and it'll barely start after 12 hours. I was going to used a higher efficiency fan (like a computor fan) on a t-stat and run the Webasto through the rear heater circuit. That would be far less draw than the defroster fan with the ignition key on.

 

[rushglen]

Thank you Crushers for posting, I did an almost identical setup, the last pic shows the exhaust.

 

[rushglen]

setup used by Wayne and I pumps the water through the heater hoses, this is fine provided the heater control is set to max heat - so heater valve is wide open.

 

[eleblanc]

I'm a bit disappointed in the result for my webasto install.

For exemple today -12 Celcius, i let the webasto run for 2 hours this morning. after 2 hours the needle of the water temp on the truck cluster had barely move up, not even reaching the low mark. I have connected the webasto so the output operating signal triggers some relay to enable the automatic climate control of the truck. It was hot in the truck but not that much. Seems like the automatic climate control might require higher coolant temps to go into faster fan operations.

And even after 2 hours the fuel pump of the webasto (that is noisy) seems to be running full speed, tic, tic, tic, tic and the fastest rate i've seen it running.

I plumbed the webasto inline after the viscous heater. So i don't see why would this cause a problem.

 

[rushglen]

eblanc I pm you. The webasto thermostat is designed to cut the heat at 30*c as soon as it drops below 30*c it will re-ignite. Check the outlet water pipe from the webasto - it should be quite hot, also the exhaust - careful that is very hot! I found the whole engine becomes noticeably warm though so far this winter we haven't had much cold weather to really test it.

 

[eleblanc]

Rushglen i'll post what i sent you. Might be usefull for others

According to this documentation
http://www.techwebasto.com/heater_main/5000838A.pdf
Page 9, from what i understand the unti will run full capacity until it reach 161 def F (72C) then will reduce heat output until it reach 171 deg F(77deg C) then will enter into idle. I do not know the range of the gauge on the truck cluster but i would think that the thermo stat is around 185 deg F. but the low mark must be somewhere aournd 165-170 deg F.

I might try to get my hand on the pc diagnostic kit.

 

[rushglen]

thats interesting data, could be you're losing too much heat pumping through the heater circuit or maybe the webasto unit is at fault, an infra red temp sensor gun would be useful to record actual temp at the outlet.

Rushglen i'll post what i sent you. Might be usefull for others

According to this documentation
http://www.techwebasto.com/heater_main/5000838A.pdf
Page 9, from what i understand the unti will run full capacity until it reach 161 def F (72C) then will reduce heat output until it reach 171 deg F(77deg C) then will enter into idle. I do not know the range of the gauge on the truck cluster but i would think that the thermo stat is around 185 deg F. but the low mark must be somewhere aournd 165-170 deg F.

I might try to get my hand on the pc diagnostic kit.

 

[aroscow]

Nice install Crushers.

If camping you could install leisure battery and split charge system so it can run independant of starting batteries.

Also two x three way soelenoid valves and you could run with heater circuit isolated so you arent heating the whole engine block, just the heater matrixes. Webasto would i would think run a lot less with less liquid to heat.

Switch over to heat block prior to engine startup.

I would expect better economy from starting warm engine. Cold diesels are poor on economy.

Finally you can source used webasto thermo tops from many diesel audi, vw, bmw and mercedes, range rover and land rover diesels second hand in uk / europe?

 

[crushers]

i have had zero issues with start ups, usually 20 min is all you need even at -35C.
why eleblanc is having problems is beyond me.

i do like your exhaust work rushglen, congrats.

on the troopie build i will be installing a switch to heat just the cab area or both the cab and the block and of course ti will run off the accessories battery only. you don't want to be in the middle of no-where and not be able to start the truck.

thanks for the compliment.

 

[eleblanc]

Wayne what do you mean by start up @ 20 min? starting the engine?

EDIT: and btw if you run every relay from the on signal wire from the webasto, the webasto is set to shut down if battery voltage drop to 10.5V. now would a 1HD start and 10.5V? that mean that someone would need to start the engine right when the webasto shut down to recharge, if it shut down and you wait 2 hours the engine may be too cold for a start @ 10.5V.

I have 2 battery on mine, i plan on letting it run a full night and see what happens.

i have had zero issues with start ups, usually 20 min is all you need even at -35C.
why eleblanc is having problems is beyond me.

i do like your exhaust work rushglen, congrats.

on the troopie build i will be installing a switch to heat just the cab area or both the cab and the block and of course ti will run off the accessories battery only. you don't want to be in the middle of no-where and not be able to start the truck.

thanks for the compliment.

 

[crushers]

i mean, i turn on the wabasto, let run for 20 mins and could start the truck easily in very cold weather...

 

[eleblanc]

Wayne i was looking at your pictures, did you T in the original fuel line then installed the pump? When i called webasto they told me not to do this because the truck engine fuel line is big and the pump might now be able to build proper suction pressure to pull fuel to the webasto. But since most of the fuel line is original and we are talking maybe a 2 feet vertical drop, it probably work anyway. I was planning to do this but because of reason above and the fact that the pump might pull fuel coming from the engine injector pump if a check valve wasn't installed between the T and the engine pump.

But might sight might be wrong and you probably didn't do that.!

 

[eleblanc]

i mean, i turn on the wabasto, let run for 20 mins and could start the truck easily in very cold weather...

Ha yes mine start fine. In fact it will start fine at -35, dual battery air pre heater..etc.. but Ho boy does it sound like it is suffering for the first 5 min....(when there weren't any webasto installed)

What i notice is that lower then -10 deg C the webasto will not reach is maximum upper limit, in fact it will not even reach is lower limit where it start to slow down fuel consumption. It is easy to know if it is running max output or not, the speed of the tic tic tic from the pump is noticable easily.

So i doubt it would be able to keep a confortable 15 deg C in the cabine in real cold weather like -20 deg C and lower.

My guess is that for a hot engine start it is fine (the webasto Thermo top C or TSL-17). there is probably too much heat loss in the coolant through the engine for any hope of real hot coolant for cabine heat. I will do more testing and report back but from the 2 weeks i had the webasto on my truck the thermo top is probably not big enough to have a warm cabing if it coolant goes through the engine, i mean in real cold weahter. It might be ok if it where connected to loop only through the cabine heater cores. But to do this it would need a 3 way valves that would be control in conjunction with the webasto.

If someone would be installing this in hope for cold winter camping and engine heater at the same time, i would probably go with the bigger model.

But when one goes camping in the winter and sleep in the truck i would guess than as long as the temperature inside the truck is more then freezing (0 deg C), it might be just fine.

 

[crushers]

i "T" the original line on all my installs and have had no issues ...

could be i am lucky.

 

[Fromage]

MMM Proheat. That's how this all started. I aquired one ten years ago and ran it in my BJ60. Way too big! Still have it in the shop somewhere. 35000 BTUs heated a ten person hot tub at rubithon '97

Bruce, a bit off topic but I have a similar unit (Webasto DBW2010) that I want to put in the 6BT Land-Rover. The plan is to use a heat exchanger for hot water (shower) and camping heat. I know they are physically huge but this one tucks up into a non-used spot in the rear box so the size does not really matter. Any other problems due to the high BTU output?

 

[lowenbrau]

Bruce, a bit off topic but I have a similar unit (Webasto DBW2010) that I want to put in the 6BT Land-Rover. The plan is to use a heat exchanger for hot water (shower) and camping heat. I know they are physically huge but this one tucks up into a non-used spot in the rear box so the size does not really matter. Any other problems due to the high BTU output?

Nothing you wouldn't expect. The larger units are a bit louder, use more fuel and about 3x the battery power. I'm not sure even the largest units will heat mountain stream water to shower temp at 2gal/minute. You'll probably have to cycle it through a holding tank (rubbermaid bin) first.

<chuckling to myself>I was thinking about using an engine coolant heat exchanger shower. If your Cummins is like mine it runs so cool at idle that the intake heater will cycle while showering. You'd be better off to just get a 100AMP 12V immersion heater and go electric.

 

[SHREDwagon]

Exhaust Routing

Thank you Crushers for posting, I did an almost identical setup, the last pic shows the exhaust.

Won't your exhaust get thrashed in the fender well? (i.e. gravel roads, mud, general offroading, snow/ice build-up in winter, etc......)

I'm installing an Espar D5 in the same place and am sweat'n running the exhaust like you and Wayne. But that is the easiest route.

Or maybe I'm being paranoid?