Alternate to PHH? (1 Viewer)

[jginca]

So I am inspecting the PHH and after searching and reading. I do not find it. Then finally pull my head out and figure out that when they did the HG before I bought the LC, they replaced it all the way with 5/8 hose.

Anyone see a potential issue with this?

 

[EricE]

Stock it has a hard line up to above the engine where it attaches to other heater hoses. The PHH is only two inches of soft hose to mate these two hard hoses together (the stub from the block and the hard line). So they replaced that hard line with soft hose all the way to the heater hoses above? Seems like that would be ok so long as the hose is of good quality.

 

[jginca]

The whole way is rubber and there is only one clamp at the block to mess with. It still is a pita, but I think I could get a 1/4 driver rachet on it.

 

[NorCalDoug]

if you're sure it replaces the PHH, then yes, I recall others having done this.
I haven't heard of any issues with doing this.

 

[hfd crusher]

Just did mine this way, put a 1" section of greenstripe around the 5/8" to protect from abrasions. Glad I did it, turned into a much quicker replacement if it ever ruptures. BTW, my old PHH looked really good on the inside for 160k miles.
Jeff

 

[Cattledog]

No issues for the past 15000+ miles. I did use gates silicon tubing though.

 

[Grench]

This is what happens when someone trying to replace the PHH says, "WTF? A bolt way the ____ back THERE?" I was >< close to doing that my self, but decided to bleed instead.

The reasons I didn't?

1. That isn't the way Mr. T. designed it. He's got more engineers on the payroll than I do.
2. It gets hot back there.
3. The longer a hose is the more space it has to fail.

Do I suggest redoing it -right-? Only if that down tube is still there and not frotzed. (Thats a technical term.) If the tube is gone... It wouldn't be high on my list of parts to buy. I would suggest making sure you have 4' of 5/8" silicone heater hose tucked away in the rear quarter panel though. With that long of a hose section... Better to be ready and never need it.

 

[jginca]

thanks for the input

 

[CruisinGA]

The main problem with lengths of rubber hose is abrasion.

If I was to install a rubber hose in such a situation I would encase it with the split wiring loom.

Once thats done, I would forget about it!

 

[Slickspawn]

<...snip...>

1. That isn't the way Mr. T. designed it. He's got more engineers on the payroll than I do.
2. It gets hot back there.
3. The longer a hose is the more space it has to fail.

<snip>

I couldn't resist, even knowing this is an ancient thread.

It's not the engineers you should worry about - it's the manufacturing, finance and purchasing departments that you need to consider.

Speaking from 20 years of direct Auto Industry engineering design to production experience

 

[jcardona1]

I couldn't resist, even knowing this is an ancient thread.

It's not the engineers you should worry about - it's the manufacturing, finance and purchasing departments that you need to consider.

Speaking from 20 years of direct Auto Industry engineering design to production experience

Not only that, but saying "that's how they engineered it" isn't a good enough excuse. You need to remember sometimes things are done for ease or cost. And they don't always get it right (read: recalls). It's just a pipe/hose section that carries hot water. If it makes my life easier to bypass that stupid pipe and route a hose all the way around, I couldn't care less how Mr. T wanted it.

 

[Timpanogos Slim]

Sometimes it was just the most cost effective way to assemble the vehicle originally.

 

[OGBeno]

Sometimes the engine is built on a stand, then dropped into a rolling frame and then the body is placed on it.

Remember, to replace that hose section, the book calles for a removal of the engine!!!

All of the things we do on a concrete, gravel, dirt, rock ground, Toyota does on an assembly line.

 

[DSRTRDR]

holy thread revival batman

 

[greentruck]

SNIP

The reasons I didn't?

1. That isn't the way Mr. T. designed it. He's got more engineers on the payroll than I do.
2. It gets hot back there.
3. The longer a hose is the more space it has to fail.

SNIP

I'm with Grench on this one. That's pretty much why I did mine the factory way -- except for the part about pulling the engine to replace it

I don't think this is random engineering on Mr. T's part. There may be an ease of factory assembly angle, but this is my take. Redoing it with all-hose seems like it should be OK. Probably is in many cases, maybe even for the life of the vehicle, but...

When that hose gets filled with water, it gets a lot heavier and warmer. So it's even more flexible when things are hot, which they usually are under the hood of an 80. Now think of spending a few hours running trails. Maybe it's just a few times a year. Maybe you really need that 80 and it's a daily occurrence. Or somewhere in between. That flexing hose now gets to flopping around a bit.

Kind of depends on exactly how much slack there is and how it's hanging... on any particular truck when this is done, but I see opportunities for it to rub a hole in itself or flop against other stuff.

We're planning a trip that will include the Trans-Labrador Highway after my diss defense in September -- well maybe not this year, but after the snow melts next spring. Hundreds of miles long gravel roads are exactly the kind of thing that might cause an issue with the all-hose replacement. So that's me, YMMV.

BTW, for the OP, I'd think finding another tube should be pretty easy in the Mud Classifieds, because so many folks do dicth the tube, but maybe it's affordable at Toyota, too? Like I noted, it could be good for life the way it is or maybe you want to consider restoring it, depending on your needs.

 

[Slickspawn]

Funny...if only you knew how often we say "That should be good to go, throw it on there and have the durability team put 150k on it and see if it fails."

That is exactly how the PHH came about. That 150k was accumulated in less than 6 months and it was good when evaluated and didn't fail on the test track.

 

[Timpanogos Slim]

I plan on doing the PHH this summer. As well as the short hoses at the heater valves, including the rear heater core which does see some use in Utah.

It looks like 2-ply reinforced silicone heater hose is relatively cheap (few bucks a foot) depending on where you get it, but damn those breeze constant torque clamps are expensive. Best deal I've seen is $42 for qty10 via amazon prime.

I'm gonna go ahead and keep using the hard lines. I have big hands and big arms but my fingers are very nimble. I'll get it done somehow.

 

[Grench]

I plan on doing the PHH this summer. As well as the short hoses at the heater valves, including the rear heater core which does see some use in Utah.

It looks like 2-ply reinforced silicone heater hose is relatively cheap (few bucks a foot) depending on where you get it, but damn those breeze constant torque clamps are expensive. Best deal I've seen is $42 for qty10 via amazon prime.

I'm gonna go ahead and keep using the hard lines. I have big hands and big arms but my fingers are very nimble. I'll get it done somehow.

That all depends on how persnickety you want to be. Those crazy constant torque clamps are overboard in my book.

Look up stainless steel worm gear clamps for soft hose. They work fine with normal green silicone hose. They have an extra long tab to cover the gear section so it doesn't push through.
http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-hose-clamps/=n6xnan

5/8 silicone hose is ubiquitous. I paid close to $9 a foot for mine from CarQuest. This one doesn't look bad though:
http://www.amazon.com/High-Performance-Silicone-Heater-Hose/dp/B009PZRJD2

 

[BrotherRob]

Sometimes the engine is built on a stand, then dropped into a rolling frame and then the body is placed on it.

Remember, to replace that hose section, the book calles for a removal of the engine!!!

All of the things we do on a concrete, gravel, dirt, rock ground, Toyota does on an assembly line.

Exactly, if Toyota had to stick two hands plus tools in a five inch hole in the dark and attach a two inch hose to two nipples and inch apart, they'd have redesigned it long ago.

 

[BrotherRob]

I'm with Grench on this one. That's pretty much why I did mine the factory way -- except for the part about pulling the engine to replace it

I don't think this is random engineering on Mr. T's part. There may be an ease of factory assembly angle, but this is my take. Redoing it with all-hose seems like it should be OK. Probably is in many cases, maybe even for the life of the vehicle, but...

When that hose gets filled with water, it gets a lot heavier and warmer. So it's even more flexible when things are hot, which they usually are under the hood of an 80. Now think of spending a few hours running trails. Maybe it's just a few times a year. Maybe you really need that 80 and it's a daily occurrence. Or somewhere in between. That flexing hose now gets to flopping around a bit.

Kind of depends on exactly how much slack there is and how it's hanging... on any particular truck when this is done, but I see opportunities for it to rub a hole in itself or flop against other stuff.

We're planning a trip that will include the Trans-Labrador Highway after my diss defense in September -- well maybe not this year, but after the snow melts next spring. Hundreds of miles long gravel roads are exactly the kind of thing that might cause an issue with the all-hose replacement. So that's me, YMMV.

BTW, for the OP, I'd think finding another tube should be pretty easy in the Mud Classifieds, because so many folks do dicth the tube, but maybe it's affordable at Toyota, too? Like I noted, it could be good for life the way it is or maybe you want to consider restoring it, depending on your needs.

Really?
Try 65k and thousands of hours on the trail in one of the hottest places in the country. No issues.

Not only would I never consider putting the hard line back in, it's pretty much impossible w/o pulling the motor or at least the head.