Icon 4.6 degree caster correction bushings (1 Viewer)

[leonard_nemoy]

I am wondering if anyone has tried these icon 4.6 degree caster bushings?

ICON 91-97 80 Series Land Cruiser 4.6 Deg Caster Correction Kit

My rig has a 2" iron man lift with some ome caster bushings and I am sitting at -1 degrees of caster. I dont want to use other methods for caster because I will probably be changing the entire suspension in another year. I am just looking for a temporary solution to get my caster a little closer to factory. I dont want to try any of the adjustable or poly caster bushings. I am trying to decide between the 2.5 degree Dobinson bushings and these icon 4.6 degree bushings.
Thanks for the input.

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

2.5 degree Dobinson bushings

Looking at the Icon compared to Dobinson I would question if the 4.6° caster change is accurate.

 

[leonard_nemoy]

Looking at the Icon compared to Dobinson I would question if the 4.6° caster change is accurate.

Who knows. I called metal tech and I was told that these are supplied with the icon lifts. I was told they seem like a very well made bushing compared to OME and Ironman. I figure because I got some old OME caster bushings now with -1 degree of caster, I might as well give these a shot. I will update once I get them installed and alignment redone.

 

[Outsane]

These are the icon bushings after 2.5 years..

 

[Retro LC]

I am wondering if anyone has tried these icon 4.6 degree caster bushings?

ICON 91-97 80 Series Land Cruiser 4.6 Deg Caster Correction Kit

My rig has a 2" iron man lift with some ome caster bushings and I am sitting at -1 degrees of caster. I dont want to use other methods for caster because I will probably be changing the entire suspension in another year. I am just looking for a temporary solution to get my caster a little closer to factory. I dont want to try any of the adjustable or poly caster bushings. I am trying to decide between the 2.5 degree Dobinson bushings and these icon 4.6 degree bushings.
Thanks for the input.

Ok whew. I am a bit relieved knowing that my rig wasn’t the only one that was at -1 castor AFTER the OME castor correction bushings were installed. All I know is that the steering pre-lift felt more precise and predictable, and after the 2” lift it had as best I can describe as a very sloppy/meandering/darty feel to it. Hoping this Icon 4.6 castor correction bushing makes the steering more true like it was pre-lift.

 

[Outsane]

Caster and the delta panhard lift bracket helped make the rig feel much better... then I am a big fan of heavy duty anti sway bars.

 

[Retro LC]

View attachment 2481367

These are the icon bushings after 2.5 years..

Wow. Ok, crossing these off my list.

 

[LandLocked93]

...after the 2” lift it had as best I can describe as a very sloppy/meandering/darty feel to it. Hoping this Icon 4.6 castor correction bushing makes the steering more true like it was pre-lift.

Just IME...and I'll probably miss a bush here or there...
Have all the driveline bushes been replaced? Front and rear?
After my OME3" lift, your description of the behavior I saw was very similar. Began replacing the drive line bushes on the advice of several members here. OEM bushes - no castor correction or anything.

Front LCAs, panhard, anti-roll bar, tie-rod ends, and knuckle rebuild with bearings and drive flanges. This resolved about 50% of the issue.

Then did rear LCAs, panhard, anti-roll bar, and found a set of UCAs with a 100k fewer miles on them and swapped those in. This brought it to about 75% resolved.

Then did steering box with OEM reseal kit and 4120-60180 - VALVE ASSY, W/BALL NUT, and a new ps pump.
This brought it to 90% resolved.

Then added 30mm spacers in the rear ('Smitty' started sagging a bit after the build-out in the rear was finished)
This brought it to 95% resolved.

Guessing the final 5% is most likely - and directly - caster related.
Still waffling over the rear panhard lift bracket from @Delta VS. It appears (per measurement) the bracket will invert the panhard a little bit and I hear that's worse than no bracket. But this could account for some of the tiniest bit of 'wander' remaining.

What's my front axle caster measurement? No idea.
But the driveline shop that did my u/js said caster was hard to measure on an 80 due to its IFS(!). And he spent 10mins under there to come up with that. Good news is that the u/j work has proven solid so far.

Point being, there is no magic bullet to resolve an issue that is dependent upon so many other parts IF those other parts have not also been r&r'd. And now that you are lifted, any vintage/untouched bushes referenced here are now "stretched" - partly due to the lift, and partly due to the process involved in installing the lift.

At '95% resolved', I can drive with hand resting on leg, using 3 fingers, and not have to move my hand from my leg during normal road/highway driving. (turn-offs notwithstanding of course).
This is a yuge diff compared to your description/my start point post-lift.

 

[Retro LC]

Just IME...and I'll probably miss a bush here or there...
Have all the driveline bushes been replaced? Front and rear?
After my OME3" lift, your description of the behavior I saw was very similar. Began replacing the drive line bushes on the advice of several members here. OEM bushes - no castor correction or anything.

Front LCAs, panhard, anti-roll bar, tie-rod ends, and knuckle rebuild with bearings and drive flanges. This resolved about 50% of the issue.

Then did rear LCAs, panhard, anti-roll bar, and found a set of UCAs with a 100k fewer miles on them and swapped those in. This brought it to about 75% resolved.

Then did steering box with OEM reseal kit and 4120-60180 - VALVE ASSY, W/BALL NUT, and a new ps pump.
This brought it to 90% resolved.

Then added 30mm spacers in the rear ('Smitty' started sagging a bit after the build-out in the rear was finished)
This brought it to 95% resolved.

Guessing the final 5% is most likely - and directly - caster related.
Still waffling over the rear panhard lift bracket from @Delta VS. It appears (per measurement) the bracket will invert the panhard a little bit and I hear that's worse than no bracket. But this could account for some of the tiniest bit of 'wander' remaining.

What's my front axle caster measurement? No idea.
But the driveline shop that did my u/js said caster was hard to measure on an 80 due to its IFS(!). And he spent 10mins under there to come up with that. Good news is that the u/j work has proven solid so far.

Point being, there is no magic bullet to resolve an issue that is dependent upon so many other parts IF those other parts have not also been r&r'd. And now that you are lifted, any vintage/untouched bushes referenced here are now "stretched" - partly due to the lift, and partly due to the process involved in installing the lift.

At '95% resolved', I can drive with hand resting on leg, using 3 fingers, and not have to move my hand from my leg during normal road/highway driving. (turn-offs notwithstanding of course).
This is a yuge diff compared to your description/my start point post-lift.

Spoke with Slee on Wednesday and they suggested the SPC (Specialty Products Company) 3 Degree Camber/Caster Adjustment offset bearing kit. Fits 80 Series Land Cruiser – 1 Kit per knuckle. If it got me to +2 degree Castor reading, I would probably be a happy camper. But I hear your point—it’s time to start with the basics first and do new OEM rubber bushings all throughout before even thinking about other variables in the suspension—panhard, etc. PS gearbox rebuild already done so that’s crossed off my to do list. Part of my rationale in going with the mild 2” OME lift was that it wouldn’t set off a chain reaction of other required suspension modifications/upgrades, but at this point I’ll do whatever it takes to get my castor back to +2 to +4 degree factory spec range. Slee arms would over correct the lack of castor on my 2” lift so these are not an option. I just saw that Delta VS makes a 2” lift compatible radius arm (thought they only made a 3” one) so it looks like it might be SPC 3 degree castor adjustment offset bearing kit versus Delta VS radius arm made for 2” lift.

 

[alia176]

Just a random input here. When it comes to correcting caster, using bushings to do this, is a "band aid" at best. I know it's a cheaper way to regain some caster but in most cases, bushings don't have the longevity that one desires. Think about it, those caster correction bushings are under a constant pre-load by always resisting the twisting motion of the front radius arms.

I've been using a set of Slee caster plates for over a decade with various 3" and 4" suspension lifts and the caster they provide is superb. Additionally, i'm part time rear wd so that additional caster feels really good. Most part timers complain about the steering a tad on the "light" side so a decent amount of caster helps. One downside to correcting caster using plates is that you're making the front springs bow just a tad. This is because the caster plates are twisting the front axle in order to regain caster and this causes the springs to bow. During hard nose dive situations, the inside of the front spring bump stop does tend to scrape the inside of the front coil springs. This is about the only time I hear this contact sound.

 

[landtank]

One downside to correcting caster using plates is that you're making the front springs bow just a tad. This is because the caster plates are twisting the front axle in order to regain caster and this causes the springs to bow. During hard nose dive situations, the inside of the front spring bump stop does tend to scrape the inside of the front coil springs.

This is a none issue with my plates.

 

[alia176]

This is a none issue with my plates.

Never said this was a plate issue, only a bushing issue.

 

[landtank]

Never said this was a plate issue, only a bushing issue.

Ahh yes you did. Reread my quote of you. You stated a downside of using caster plates and my caster plates don't have that issue.

 

[leonard_nemoy]

Spoke with Slee on Wednesday and they suggested the SPC (Specialty Products Company) 3 Degree Camber/Caster Adjustment offset bearing kit. Fits 80 Series Land Cruiser – 1 Kit per knuckle.

Listen to slee, I constantly recommend trunnion bearings as a great way to adjust caster but everyone always decides to go with bushings.

I used trunnion bearings to adjust the caster on my 91 and it gave me zero issues for 4 years. I personally believe this is one of the best solutions to caster.

Even slee agrees and they sell the stupid bushings ...

 

[leonard_nemoy]

@landtank

Can you please explain how your caster correction plates can adjust caster without rotating the axle?

 

[landtank]

@landtank

Can you please explain how your caster correction plates can adjust caster without rotating the axle?

of course they rotate the axle, they just do it with out inducing all the ill effects that other plates have.

 

[slow95z]

i will say i am the oddball here and went with drop brackets for the arms. been happy so far and way cheaper than other options.

 

[LandLocked93]

Spoke with Slee on Wednesday and they suggested the SPC (Specialty Products Company) 3 Degree Camber/Caster Adjustment offset bearing kit. Fits 80 Series Land Cruiser – 1 Kit per knuckle. If it got me to +2 degree Castor reading, I would probably be a happy camper. But I hear your point—it’s time to start with the basics first and do new OEM rubber bushings all throughout before even thinking about other variables in the suspension—panhard, etc. PS gearbox rebuild already done so that’s crossed off my to do list. Part of my rationale in going with the mild 2” OME lift was that it wouldn’t set off a chain reaction of other required suspension modifications/upgrades, but at this point I’ll do whatever it takes to get my castor back to +2 to +4 degree factory spec range. Slee arms would over correct the lack of castor on my 2” lift so these are not an option. I just saw that Delta VS makes a 2” lift compatible radius arm (thought they only made a 3” one) so it looks like it might be SPC 3 degree castor adjustment offset bearing kit versus Delta VS radius arm made for 2” lift.

Well the consensus used to be that 3" or less lift yielded the least amount of additional mods needed to retain OEM handling characteristics. It's why I opted to go no higher. Given my experience, I'd say the consensus is correct.
Slee performed my lift and installed the OME caster-correction bushes (yellow, polys I think). All I can say is the situation improved after replacing them with OEM bushes about 18mos later. Also have nothing but good to say about Slee Offroad. They are awesome.

My hunch is that the majority of your drive line bushes are perished if only a 2" lift began the issues you are seeing.
You could do all bushings except the FCA's , then re-eval?
Wouldn't matter if your caster is correct sitting stationary while remaining vintage bushes divest themselves of rubber on every movement going down the road. lol

 

[dsmud4u]

for reference, these are my numbers with the Icon bushings and Icon “3 inch” lift. I must have yielded more then 3”. Second Pic are my numbers with Delta VS arms

 

[leonard_nemoy]

for reference, these are my numbers with the Icon bushings and Icon “3 inch” lift. I must have yielded more then 3”. Second Pic are my numbers with Delta VS arms

View attachment 2853415

View attachment 2853416

More proof that the icon bushings are crap