Something timing belt-ish failed (2 Viewers)

[chopperjamie]

Tuesday morning I was happily driving to work and all the sudden, the truck just quit. I pulled over to the side of the freeway. It would crank but not start. I got it towed home and put the scanner on it and it returned a P0340 code. Camshaft Position Sensor Circuit Malfunction. I looked at scottm's fantastic timing belt write up :Timing Belt for Dummies writeup
and found the picture of the drivers side cam sensor, then my heart hit my shoes. It could be a knackered timing belt.
Last night I got the drivers side inspection cover peeled back enough to find the timing belt is all floppy on the cam gear. Great.
1998 Land Cruiser with 230K on the clock. I have owned it for almost exactly a year and have put 16K on it in that time. The PO told me the timing belt had been changed "recently" but had no paper work and I was going to change it out this spring. I guess I waited too long.
I have done a bunch of lurking and research on this site and it seems the consensus is most of the time valves don't crash when timing belts (or pulleys or whatever failed) fail.
Unless someone can convince me differently, I am going to go about my business buying all the parts for a timing belt service and put it back together to the point I can crank it and do a compression test. I figure if the engine is junk and I have to replace it with a used one, I will use all that stuff anyhow.

I have another car and a few motorcycles to get me around, so it may be a bit before I post what is going on, but I know you guys appreciate closure so I will keep you informed. More than a few times I followed a thread that the OP just fell off the face of the earth and that sucks!

Comments or suggestions are always appreciated.
Jamie

 

[rjones]

Bummer, sorry to hear about the inconvenience. I think you have a good plan though. Please do report back because it would great for us to be able to add one more to the non-interference column!

Best of luck,
rjones

 

[JPS]

Curious to how fast you were traveling when it happened? .

 

[2000UZJ]

Always change out the timing belt on these. It doesn't matter when they said it was done, redo it with OEM Toyota parts. It's cheap insurance.

 

[vipergrhd]

Get an Aisin kit which comes with everything you need, replace cam seals and crank seal and forget about it. Let us know what happens.

 

[REZARF]

I agree, I just did mine a few weeks ago, its a job at most it just takes a bit of time... like 10 hours.

However, if it is flopping around inside the inspection cover then something went really really wrong. We have seen lots of folks say that the cruisers have fired right back up after this... leading us to believe it is a NON interference motor when Mr. T says it is.

I think your plan is solid. I found an awesome (OEM parts) kit on amazon for under $200. I would recommend replacing the Thermostat, tstat gasket, any coolant hoses that need it, all your radiator coolant (Toyota red) and the pesky heater "T's" while you have it drained.

You'll be up and running again. It can only go up from here boss, keep your chin up.

 

[chopperjamie]

Bummer, sorry to hear about the inconvenience. I think you have a good plan though. Please do report back because it would great for us to be able to add one more to the non-interference column!

Best of luck,
rjones

Thanks rjones,
An inconvenience it is, but that is all. I love this truck and it has gone from Daily Driver status to project. I will keep you informed and I hope I am in the non-interference column!!!!!

Curious to how fast you were traveling when it happened? .

JPS, I was doing about 50mph at the time. I didn't hear any noise, but then again I was listening to my stereo at a rather high volume at the time.....

Always change out the timing belt on these. It doesn't matter when they said it was done, redo it with OEM Toyota parts. It's cheap insurance.

I know....I know. It was on my list but I blew it. If I was a betting man, I would lay money on me pulling it apart and finding a dayco belt or Chinese idlers or something.

Get an Aisin kit which comes with everything you need, replace cam seals and crank seal and forget about it. Let us know what happens.

A loooonnnnngggg time ago I used to work for a wholesale auto parts giant and we carried Aisin stuff. I don't remember it being bad. A quick search found a kit for $180. Would you really do this over OE?

I agree, I just did mine a few weeks ago, its a job at most it just takes a bit of time... like 10 hours.

However, if it is flopping around inside the inspection cover then something went really really wrong. We have seen lots of folks say that the cruisers have fired right back up after this... leading us to believe it is a NON interference motor when Mr. T says it is.

I think your plan is solid. I found an awesome (OEM parts) kit on amazon for under $200. I would recommend replacing the Thermostat, tstat gasket, any coolant hoses that need it, all your radiator coolant (Toyota red) and the pesky heater "T's" while you have it drained.

You'll be up and running again. It can only go up from here boss, keep your chin up.

HA! Thanks for the words of encouragement! I will look on Amazon for that kit.
Funny thing is I did the heater hose T's about two weeks ago thinking I was way ahead of the curve on keeping this thing alive to 500K.

 

[JPS]

JPS, I was doing about 50mph at the time. I didn't hear any noise, but then again I was listening to my stereo at a rather high volume at the time.....

I had this happen to me at 65mph - 70.... I heard animal from the muppets beating drums under my hood. I think you would have heard no matter what if there was engine killing damage..... hopefully that’s a good sign.

 

[chopperjamie]

I had this happen to me at 65mph - 70.... I heard animal from the muppets beating drums under my hood. I think you would have heard no matter what if there was engine killing damage..... hopefully that’s a good sign.

Funny, I used to like animal from the muppets before this. HA! I hope you are right.

 

[nissanh]

I bought AISIN (be careful with lettering, fake brands may have a name like AISIA or something) and it is good because AISIN is the toyota's parts division. The OEM is the best and the next is AISIN. I never doubt AISIN products. You'll have to buy cam and crank seals and STAY with TOYOTA seals. If the radiator/hoses are old get those replaced with OEM or DENSO radiator and OEM radiator hoses. Did you do the heater T joints? if not, get those done as well. While the radiator is out, ask the technician to clean the AC condenser fins with air to remove debris and flies and what not trapped in there.

 

[chopperjamie]

I bought AISIN (be careful with lettering, fake brands may have a name like AISIA or something) and it is good because AISIN is the toyota's parts division. The OEM is the best and the next is AISIN. I never doubt AISIN products. You'll have to buy cam and crank seals and STAY with TOYOTA seals. If the radiator/hoses are old get those replaced with OEM or DENSO radiator and OEM radiator hoses. Did you do the heater T joints? if not, get those done as well. While the radiator is out, ask the technician to clean the AC condenser fins with air to remove debris and flies and what not trapped in there.

OK. Thanks for the heads up.
You are talking to the technician that will be doing the work, I will make certain he cleans the AC condenser fins out!! HA!

 

[REZARF]

@chopperjamie here is the kit I bought for my 1999, you can set up a "garage" with your vehicle year, specs etc. then filter your results.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008EEYWKI/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1&tag=ihco-20

 

[chopperjamie]

@chopperjamie here is the kit I bought for my 1999, you can set up a "garage" with your vehicle year, specs etc. then filter your results.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008EEYWKI/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1&tag=ihco-20

Fantastic! Thank you very much for that info. I will get one ordered and I think I will start the triage this weekend.

 

[Tres Toys]

I had a similar experience a while back and was in a bit of disbelief as I had changed the timing belt, water pump, tensioner and all idler bearings out with factory toyota parts about 70k mi previously. I must have gotten a not so good bearing in the water pump as it went out and the play in the bearings allowed the belt to push to one side and finally jump out of time. I put a new water pump and timing belt in and it was good to. Your PO may have given you the straight scoop on the recent timing belt replacement, however if some other timing belt connected component such as the water pump goes out, it can cause even a new timing belt to fail. Just be sure to check all your bearings and tensioner to figure out if there was some other failure that made the belt either break or go slack. Hope you get it back on the road soon.

 

[JPS]

I had a similar experience a while back and was in a bit of disbelief as I had changed the timing belt, water pump, tensioner and all idler bearings out with factory toyota parts about 70k mi previously. I must have gotten a not so good bearing in the water pump as it went out and the play in the bearings allowed the belt to push to one side and finally jump out of time. I put a new water pump and timing belt in and it was good to. Your PO may have given you the straight scoop on the recent timing belt replacement, however if some other timing belt connected component such as the water pump goes out, it can cause even a new timing belt to fail. Just be sure to check all your bearings and tensioner to figure out if there was some other failure that made the belt either break or go slack. Hope you get it back on the road soon.

I think that was what happened in my case. The hose on the water pump came off/loose causing the new timing belt to jump/slack. The spray from the pump didn't make it out form under the hood to the windshield and being my first 10 mins in the vehicle, at night, didn't help either.

 

[joseywales]

If I was a betting man, I would lay money on me pulling it apart and finding a dayco belt or Chinese idlers or something.


A loooonnnnngggg time ago I used to work for a wholesale auto parts giant and we carried Aisin stuff. I don't remember it being bad.

I bet you’re right on the off brand (country of origin) parts.


Someone please correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m pretty sure Aisin is connected with Toyota and actually builds the OEM part which is stuck into baggies with red and white stickers and a 100% mark-up?

 

[Pighead]

Incorrect...it's a 200% mark-up

 

[2001LC]

From the Aisin kits I've used both from @cruiseroutfit & Amazon, they seem to be identical too the Toyota. Except the belt doesn't say Toyota, it reads Mtsuboshi CD298 made in USA. I've not sliced the belts open to do a side by side comparison but I'll bet they're the same. With Cruiser Outfitters you know it's not a bootleg.

A few tips you may find helpful;
A chain wrench makes short work of the crank bolt. Protecting the crank pulley with old drive belt is nice touch.

I like to support the chain wrench with my floor jack as pull on my 3/4 breaker bar (big boy, one of my favorite tools).

Even shops mistakenly use the "T" as time mark. To be clear the "T" is not your timing mark.

 

[2001LC]

Follow the FSM to the letter. There's one thing (IIRC that's not in the FSM clearly) so often left out, it's these two tiny plastic pieces (shield). We had a report of one mud member leaving these out. A mouse got in belt area through the opening and took out the belt. Yes that's right Mickey took out a Cruiser!

Oh don't forget to protect your radiator.

A Paint & Rust removal wheel (fine or medium probably best), makes short work of clean off block.

 

[chopperjamie]

Incorrect...it's a 200% mark-up

Like I said, a long time ago I worked for a very large import wholesaler. If you drive any import and have bought parts someplace other than the dealer, there is a 75% chance you have bought parts through this company.
The story they told us is OEM's go to manufactures like AISIN and tell them they will buy 10 thousand water pumps but they are only going to pay something like $50 for each. AISIN knows it will cost them $60 each to make them, so they make 100 thousand of them. They put 10 thousand in an OE box and send them to Toyota who sells them for $170. The put the other 90 thousand in their own boxes and sells them for $90 each to the aftermarket and that is how the make their money.
True or not, I am not sure but that was the story we go.