How many J4 cruisers were produced in 1960-1985. Frame number investigation (1 Viewer)

[Economist LC76]

I tried to collect information about cruiser production based on the frame data (toyodiy.com).

The assumption is that we have 12 families inside of J4 Cruiser group. (FJ40/BJ40/BJ41/BJ42/BJ43/FJ43/BJ44/BJ45/FJ45/HJ45/BJ46/HJ47).

For each family we need to find the first / the last frame number for each year of the production. The difference is the production for the calendar year. In addition, we need to identify the pauses in the production / change in the format / extra frame numbers for different markets. Sometimes the data base has huge frame numbers in some months of production – so we need to skip these unreliable frames.

Condensed information is in the table

The Frame number we can extract from the plate under the hood

I wonder, how far is this from the real production numbers

 

[Economist LC76]

To prove this calculation, please find data in the separate tables with the frame numbers

FJ40

BJ40

BJ41 (Japan only)

BJ42

BJ43

 

[Economist LC76]

FJ43

BJ44 (Japan only)

BJ45

FJ45

HJ45

 

[Economist LC76]

BJ46 (Hard top in Japan only)

HJ47

 

[1969FJ]

I actually thought there were more Gas Model FJ40's produced . Interesting the actual amount.

 

[JohnnyC]

Numbers are going to be off

Toyota didn’t start as most with 00001 type numbering

The fj40 started with 10001

Some models I believe started with 1000

I am very far from anything I got to look at... @Bear or @Living in the Past might have info handy

 

[Economist LC76]

Numbers are going to be off

Toyota didn’t start as most with 00001 type numbering

The fj40 started with 10001

Some models I believe started with 1000

I am very far from anything I got to look at... @Bear or @Living in the Past might have info handy

1. Fj40/FJ43/fj45 might start from different numbers (for example Fj40 in 1961 have frames around 14000)
2. Bj40/41/42/43/44/45/46/47
HJ47 started from the numbers that are in the tables. I checked it from the books or from the database

PS even if we put 10000 x3 from 1 085 155 it would not change the picture. It would stay 1 055 155.

 

[Economist LC76]

Some books

 

[subzali]

Have you seen the 2F serial number thread? It’s a good start to what you’re after

 

[Economist LC76]

Numbers are going to be off

Toyota didn’t start as most with 00001 type numbering

The fj40 started with 10001

Some models I believe started with 1000

I am very far from anything I got to look at... @Bear or @Living in the Past might have info handy

Some info about starting frame number

 

[viducce]

Where did all the FJ45's go?

 

[Bear]

Undoubtedly a lot of effort has gone into this compilation, but I am not sure about all of this or the reliability of the source(s).

The ultimate source for Toyota production numbers is the Toyota factory. It is easy to deduce yearly ending frame numbers from the factory-reported beginning numbers using each succeeding year's initial start number. I question the source for the ending frame numbers at the close of each production line. Is this a guess, a calculated extrapolation, something actually seen driving the streets?

There have been some questions over the years also about the true actual starting frame numbers, not just the explanation of the theory behind frame numbering. Additionally, as is often the case with other brands, there are various prototypes and initial models produced within the design team that never see the light of day, and may or may not have been destroyed along the way. Often some of these vehicles are close if not exact duplicates of the production model. Should any of these be added to the totals?

An analysis of just the FJ45 production records reported above shows a minimum of 500 chassis not reported here. All other lines reported here could possibly use a careful verification using known figures.

As I have said before, there is undoubtedly a very accurate count of each and every model ever produced by Toyota, with details in the minutae. Yes, it would be nice if that information were available to the public--however Toyota has deemed to not provide that corporate record. Hence approximations abound for the curious among us. Were we talking about Bugattis, Ferraris, or Duesenbergs that were produced in very limited numbers, then investigations for absolute accuracy would be worthwhile for obvious financial reasons amongst others.

One of the useful numbers not divulged so far would be an actual break-out of the FJ45 line as to the number of pickup trucks versus hard- and soft-top Troopies manufactured, and the breakout for the earlier 45 wagons. Nice as well would be a reporting of the fixed-top pickup trucks; and the numbers of RHD vs LHD in each line. How about production statistics on the numbers of specialty models such as the LX versions, the number of vehicles provided with options such as the forward-facing rear seats or triple-wipers; and then the one-offs built for high-value customers--the sheikhs and potentates. Another consideration is that just because a frame is produced, it does not necessarily mean that a body was ever put onto it--as in the CompleteKnockDown(CKD) models produced in satellite countries.

Conversations with Toyota employees can be helpful, but if accuracy is important then only written documentation will prove reliable. As an example, there were a limited number of US-spec 1983 model FJ40s exported to the US. Their rarity in the US results in premium pricing in the current market. The production number often bandied-about is 300 copies imported, but that number came from a conversation few were a party to, and is it exactly "300" or is that an approximation. Yet that statistic is often used by sellers as if it were etched on sacred tablets as a reason for inflated asking prices. And then, because there were a large number of 1983 FJ40 models exported to other countries, when now imported into the US market, how are these vehicles to be valued today? While most folks on this web site do not follow the trials and tribulations of the Land Rover Defender in the US, there are some interesting parallels to all this.

Bottom line: many of us welcome more clarity on the actual production of Land Cruiser models, but I'm afraid that as the years continue to pass, historical accuracy becomes more and more distant. Any archaeologists or forensic accountants here?

As always, just my personal two cents.

 

[GreenBJ]

Hello,

Concerning HJ45 Pick-up (HJ45 P-B and HJ45 LP-B), the starting year is 04/1972 not 02/1974. (maybe a typing mistake).

 

[Economist LC76]

Hello,

Concerning HJ45 Pick-up (HJ45 P-B and HJ45 LP-B), the starting year is 04/1972 not 02/1974. (maybe a typing mistake).

Hello, thanks, yes I’ve mistyped. Just replaced it.

 

[GreenBJ]

Hello,

Yes, 04/1972 is correct.
not 02/1974 as in post #3.

 

[peesalot]

interesting...................

 

[Economist LC76]

Hello,

Yes, 04/1972 is correct.
not 02/1974 as in post #3.

Thanks! Now it’s correct

 

[Economist LC76]

I’ve got an interesting Toyota Land Cruiser book.
Frame numbers in December 1962, based on the official data