Post up what you pedal (2 Viewers)

[Somebodyelse5]

This might be something more for an MTB dedicated forum, but for those of you who Mountain bike - any suggestions on how to make a chain last? I regularly wipe it down and lube it, but I seem to have pretty severe stretch after about 150mi on my Salsa El Mariachi...the bike starts having difficulty shifting, etc. I don't put in HUGE mileage but that's still a good 2 chain replacements a year. My understanding (or hope) is that they should last longer than that!

Definitely not lasting as it should.

• What kind of chain are you running?
• Wet or dry conditions?
• What type of lube are you using?
• How are you measuring the stretch? (ei, what type of tool)

Give this a read, this is a good article on chain maint. But even doing maintenance wrong, it should last more than 150mi.
MAINTENANCE

Have you verified it is the correct length?
Chain Length Sizing
Javascript Bicycle Chain Length Calculator

 

[Eicca]

This might be something more for an MTB dedicated forum, but for those of you who Mountain bike - any suggestions on how to make a chain last? I regularly wipe it down and lube it, but I seem to have pretty severe stretch after about 150mi on my Salsa El Mariachi...the bike starts having difficulty shifting, etc. I don't put in HUGE mileage but that's still a good 2 chain replacements a year. My understanding (or hope) is that they should last longer than that!

And if you're measuring it with one of those Park Tool swingy tools, don't trust it. Get one of the simple metal plates that you just hook in. The swingy tools are way inaccurate.

 

[Petoors]

This might be something more for an MTB dedicated forum, but for those of you who Mountain bike - any suggestions on how to make a chain last? I regularly wipe it down and lube it, but I seem to have pretty severe stretch after about 150mi on my Salsa El Mariachi...the bike starts having difficulty shifting, etc. I don't put in HUGE mileage but that's still a good 2 chain replacements a year. My understanding (or hope) is that they should last longer than that!

Maybe you are running it too tight? As long as its clean & lubed, it should be good for at least 2k.

If it is a geared bike like I understand, the rear derailleur tensions the chain and it would be unlikely that the tension would be to high.
If it was a SS then the chain tension could be to high.

How many kilometres is on your total drive-train? If the wear on the chain rings and sprockets in the rear cluster is to much, and beyond a certain limit, it would eat up new chains like crazy.
Then unfortunately you'll have to replace your whole drive-train one time. ( front chain-rings, chain, rear cluster and derailleur wheel.)
If you ride a lot of "cross chain" ,with chain on biggest chain-ring front and biggest sprocket rear (or smallest and smallest front and rear) then your chain and whole drive-train will wear out quicker.

I get about 600-800 km out of a Mountain bike chain. (but I am a bit heavy)

Just my 2-cent.
Ride safe.

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Thanks for all the feedback guys, I'll answer below, but I'll preface by saying, I haven't actually measured the chain. I guess my initial post was something of an assumption given increased driveline clatter and difficulty shifting to some gears. My local shop does most of the work on this bike (I'm too busy restoring landcruisers ) but last time I had it in for these symptoms, they'd pinpointed the chain.

Definitely not lasting as it should.

• What kind of chain are you running?
• Wet or dry conditions?
• What type of lube are you using?
• How are you measuring the stretch? (ei, what type of tool)

Give this a read, this is a good article on chain maint. But even doing maintenance wrong, it should last more than 150mi.
MAINTENANCE

Have you verified it is the correct length?
Chain Length Sizing
Javascript Bicycle Chain Length Calculator

Kind of chain:
Honestly not sure, it's usually about $35 installed by the LBS.

Wet or dry:
A mix around here, but mostly wet. Not MUDDY, but not what I'd consider dry either. It's mostly east coast state parks, (wooded creeks and watersheds).

Lube:
Currently Finish Line wet lube. I have both but the conditions have called for wet most recently.

Stretch: I'm not - as I mentioned, chain stretch was something of any assumption based on past experience.

Maintenance - maybe I'm not being thorough enough - I try to wipe it down consistently (every ride or two) and run a bristle brush along it to get some of the gunk out of the inside, then re-lube. However, I know a lot of folks will disassemble the chain, clean it in solvent, and reinstall it. Or use one of those chain cleaner tools (I've heard mixed reviews). In any case - I'm not going to these lengths, I typically just wipe, brush, and lube.

And if you're measuring it with one of those Park Tool swingy tools, don't trust it. Get one of the simple metal plates that you just hook in. The swingy tools are way inaccurate.

If it is a geared bike like I understand, the rear derailleur tensions the chain and it would be unlikely that the tension would be to high.
If it was a SS then the chain tension could be to high.

How many kilometres is on your total drive-train? If the wear on the chain rings and sprockets in the rear cluster is to much, and beyond a certain limit, it would eat up new chains like crazy.
Then unfortunately you'll have to replace your whole drive-train one time. ( front chain-rings, chain, rear cluster and derailleur wheel.)
If you ride a lot of "cross chain" ,with chain on biggest chain-ring front and biggest sprocket rear (or smallest and smallest front and rear) then your chain and whole drive-train will wear out quicker.

I get about 600-800 km out of a Mountain bike chain. (but I am a bit heavy)

Just my 2-cent.
Ride safe.

It's definitely a geared bike - a 10x3

KM on total drivetrain:
About 300 miles (just sub 500km). It's essentially a new bike, bought last summer, ridden about 150-200mi a year. I mostly do 10-15mi rides after work. I travel a lot so it doesn't see as much use as I'd like it to.

I try not to cross chain. In fact, my front gears virtually never leave the "middle" ring, even climbing steep hills (which would be adding stretch). I use the full suite of back gears, but mostly stick to the middle up front.

I'm not sure what "a bit" heavy is in your case, but I'm also not a small guy - about 225lbs, 6'0" so the bike is carrying a lot of weight.

 

[Petoors]

With only 300 miles, your chain rings and sprocket cluster at the back should be like new.
Depending on the quality of the chain, it could need replacing in the next 100 miles or so. 225lbs ( I am 219lbs) wear a chain quicker than a 160lbs guy.

1ste Let your local bike shop reset you gears and so on, and give it a good lube and see if it improves.
With time there is wear and stretch in the shifter cables, this let the alignment of the derailleur, chain and gears go out of optimal ever so silently. This can contribute to a lot of drive train noise. I have had brand new drive-trains make irritating noises even if it works well.
Sometimes it just need that pro adjustment from someone who do it for living.
Make sure the guy at the bike shop knows his stuff. You would not let a new apprentice rebuild your Cruiser's gearbox do you?

Lastly, look at you "gear habits"
Run the biggest three gears at the back with the smallest chain-ring front.
The smallest three gears at the back with the biggest chain-ring front.
The middle six gears at the back with the middle chain-ring.
It is a worth while habit to adopt.

Keep well.

 

[gregnash]

With only 300 miles, your chain rings and sprocket cluster at the back should be like new.
Depending on the quality of the chain, it could need replacing in the next 100 miles or so. 225lbs ( I am 219lbs) wear a chain quicker than a 160lbs guy.

1ste Let your local bike shop reset you gears and so on, and give it a good lube and see if it improves.
With time there is wear and stretch in the shifter cables, this let the alignment of the derailleur, chain and gears go out of optimal ever so silently. This can contribute to a lot of drive train noise. I have had brand new drive-trains make irritating noises even if it works well.
Sometimes it just need that pro adjustment from someone who do it for living.
Make sure the guy at the bike shop knows his stuff. You would not let a new apprentice rebuild your Cruiser's gearbox do you?

Lastly, look at you "gear habits"
Run the biggest three gears at the back with the smallest chain-ring front.
The smallest three gears at the back with the biggest chain-ring front.
The middle six gears at the back with the middle chain-ring.
It is a worth while habit to adopt.

Keep well.

Some good advice here.. With 300 miles on your chain you should definitely be getting more life out of it than that. I probably put close to 500 to 600 miles on my chains before I start seeing degredation in performance but I am pretty anal about my maintenance. I also run a 1x10 so I use my entire range when riding. I weigh about 190-200lbs fully kitted up and I can mash on the pedals, especially in techy sections where I am searching for chain tension while going over obstacles and whatnot.

A more expensive chain may last you a bit longer but that is not a guarantee. Also look at the terrain you are riding in, if you are riding in super sandy/dusty terrain on a regular basis for long miles then that will contribute to chain wear. There are quite a few variables that can play into everything, the need to clean your chain every few rides is really not necessary unless you are leaving heavy chain lube on the chain while riding (big no no) and letting it get gunked up. Also, it is good to go in once a year to get your drivetrain adjusted, because as @Petoors said, the shift cables will stretch a bit which causes things to not shift optimally. This is a good point to learn what you can about tuning your drivetrain, so take a 6pk of beer into the shop late one night (with their permission) and sit with one of their lead techs and have them walk you through it.

My normal process is as follows... (mind you I ride about 3-5 times a week with average ride being 10miles, longer rides being 20+)
- beginning of riding season I take bike to shop and have them do a once over on everything. (e.g. tru wheels, check bearings, etc.)
- every couple of rides, wash bike with simple green mix, wipe bike down, clean chain, re-lube chain, thoroughly clean fork/shock stanchions, regrease fork/shock stanchions
- every 100 miles or so check pressures in fork/shock, make small adjustments, check tires (tubeless), make small adjustments, thoroughly clean bike.
- every 4-6 months BIG SERVICE (depending on how hard and how much I am riding)

So for the big service normal check list is as follows...
- thoroughly wash bike, scrub junctions with soft bristle brush (e.g. crank bearing cups, major pivot points, axles, etc.)
- remove seatpost/dropper clean all surfaces and regrease stanchion
- remove wheels, regrease axles, check spokes and rim for damage, check tires for damage and wear, check Stans and top off if necessary
- remove fork and service (this normally consists of disassembling fork, checking seals, replacing seals, redoing oil levels, greasing different items, reassembling fork)
- remove shock and service (this normally is just taking the can off and checking for any stanchion wear, play and checking seals)
- remove brake pads, thoroughly clean surfaces with rubbing alcohol, bleed system (Shimano SLXs) and checking rotors to see if they are tru
- take a look a bearings and pivot points for any slop and wear and if necessary replace.
- remove jockey wheels from rear derailleur and make sure that they are clean, no damage to teeth and check bearings for slop/noise
- remove rear freehub body and check for damage, wear, etc. and regrease inside pawls if everything looks good
- while freehub body is off I take a look at the cassette and see if any teeth or rings look damaged or have excessive where and make sure it does not have more than acceptable movement while attached to freehub body

Since I run a 1x10 system I do not have to worry about my front ring as if there is an issue with it then it is pretty obvious. However, I do clean the ring and inspect, check that all ring bolts are tight and give the pedals and crank arms a quick once over. No matter what, when you are doing work to your drivetrain you want to do it in very small increments as small adjustments can make large differences. A 3x10 system is pretty complex and you will not have optimal shifting in all rings on the entire cassette, as @Petoors said, first few (lowest) gears of the rear cassette should only be used in the big ring, then as you step in further on the cassette you wan to match those steps with shifts of the front chainrings.

(soapbox)Honestly, the need for a 3x10 system, and in some places a 2x10 system, is really not needed anymore. The gearing ratio redundancy you see is pretty major between the systems. As you get stronger you will find that the little bit of top end/bottom end that you would lose with going to a 1x system is really negligible especially with today's wide range cassettes. But like with anything else, that depends on a lot of variables (terrain, health, riding style, area, health, etc.) but I HAVE PERSONALLY found that the switch from a 2x10 to a 1x10, and previously a 2x9 system, was well worth the small amount of top end that I lost. (/soapbox)

 

[RWBeringer4x4]

Wow - thanks all for the responses - lots of awesome information here, which is much appreciated as I'm still pretty new to the sport. Just got my bike back from the shop today. Spoke with them a bit, and a lot of their observations and advice jived with what you guys are saying here.

The Damage:

• Rear brake pads (I knew I needed these)
• Fork Rebuild (I'm going to try to do this at least every-other year - it wasn't giving me issues though)
• New chain - Previous chain was "borderline" per stretch recommendations. Not shot, but definitely stretched. Replaced with a Shimano HG chain.
  
• Derailleur hanger was slightly bent (again) - The first time, I crashed, and bent it. This time I'm not sure what I did...It wasn't nearly as bent as previously.
  
• There's clear wear on the middle sprockets of my Cassette (Shimano Deore, nothing fancy, $30 cassette) - not to the point of warranting replacement yet, but definitely showing the abuse.
  
• Shift cables were OK - but I had to replace one of those after the first 150 or so miles at my last service visit

I talked to the shop about my cleaning habits -

• I almost never remove the chain and "deep clean" but I wipe down the cogs, derailleur, and chain virtually every ride, and re-lube. They seemed to think this was mostly likely not my issue.

The shop seemed to jive with what just about all of you are saying. Essentially they said it's most likely my shift habits, and the fact that I'm a generally all around big dude (6', 225lbs) causing premature wear. For lack of a better description, I'm a "masher" not a "spinner." And it's costing me dearly! I'll chalk the issues up to mashing the pedals, not shifting correctly, and probably having things slightly out of alignment.

• @gregnash - Funny you should make your soapbox comment. I was just talking to another MTB friend of mine about this tonight. I rarely, if ever, shift out of the middle ring. 3x10 is definitely overkill, and the fact that I never shift from the center is also probably resulting in the "cross chain" issues mentioned by @Petoors. If the time comes to replace my crankset, I may very well drop to at least a 2x10.
  
• I'll definitely try to be more cognizant of my shifting. To be honest, the front rings shift SO slowly that usually I'm too late (and under too much load) to shift the front, so I just shift on the cassette. The 10 rear gears are more the sufficient for most of the stuff around here.

At some point I definitely intend to do more of my own maintenance, but right now I'm sticking to cleaning and lubing, and letting the shop keep it dialed in. But just like with my 40, I'm sure my desire to tear things apart and "fix things" will get the better of me with bikes too..

 

[Foothill80]

Just built this beastie up after spending two seasons on the aluminum version. Need to hit Downieville and Toads in the coming weeks.

 

[retrofive]

Several years ago my bikes were stolen. Sort of dropped out of biking after that. Anyway decided to start back at it. Built this up over the last month.

06 (I think) specialized s-works epic.

Pretty much assembled from the ground up. Most new parts minus the brakes and fork.

Sram 9 shifters and derailleurs
SRAM 9 p980 9speed cassette
Avid juicy 7
Shimano center lock rotors
Fox brain rear shock
Fox talas front fork
Race face 60mm stem and atlas bar cut to abou 735.
Race face bb and cranks
Mavic 719 wheel set.

Nothing fancy but rides nice and gets around.

Still need to make some minor tweaks like bar position etc.

 

[Somebodyelse5]

Just built this beastie up after spending two seasons on the aluminum version. Need to hit Downieville and Toads in the coming weeks.

View attachment 1295094

Curious to hear how the Al vs. Carbon frames feel, especially on a similar frame, Report back please!

 

[Whitfimb]

I started racing the local MTB series this year Beginner Men @ 43 yrs old. and I'm a bit of a bike slut
~ These are a few that currently occupy space in the living room.



Specialized Fuse




Niner Air 9 RDO




1982 Schwinn King Sting (clunker)

 

[Foothill80]

Curious to hear how the Al vs. Carbon frames feel, especially on a similar frame, Report back please!

Hey there, frames are both great and i should mention that i am ran a Cane Creek DB air and the carbon has the Push coil, so that will have some effect on the overall trail characteristics. The carbon definetely has a more deadned feel and feels more like a lazer through corners. Very precise feedback when pushing hard into corners or fast offcamber sweepers is where i noticed it. My ability to finesse some good drifts or predictability when the back end gets loose is better as well. Overrall pleased; massive difference, no. I had upgradeitis.

D

 

[Disasterman]

Old guy former racer and bike snob - I built this up early last year - Yeti Arc Carbon XS w/ Magura brakes, Racing Ralph, Stans no tubes, Cane Creek, Sram XX1 weighs in around 16.5 lbs.

Love it.

 

[Whitfimb]

Nice ride ~ Dang that Yeti is an ULTRA LIGHT! Riding my Carbon hardtail is like strumming a well tuned guitar. How are you liking the Magura's? I struggled to get good feel feedback on my 13 EPIC with Magura MTS brakes. I am suspecting there were some MFG compromisesto the MTS line to meet Spesh's bid. These may have compromised performance.

 

[Disasterman]

I find the brakes incredible in wet or dry, good modulation. These are the Magura MT8 carbon brakes. I also went with titanium crank brothers pedals.

 

[gregnash]

Just built this beastie up after spending two seasons on the aluminum version. Need to hit Downieville and Toads in the coming weeks.

View attachment 1295094

Always wanted to try a Knolly but for me, aesthetics play a part in the bike and I find their linkage design and specifically the rocker arm absolutely hideous..

 

[gilamonster]

Knollys ride like a dream, I bet it's even better with that 11-6 on there.

 

[Tigerstripe40]

DW Link seems to be the bomb currently.

Though Treks 'full floating' shock design has been working awesomely for me.

I am considering selling my DH Bike (Yeti303RDH), and my 2 XC bikes (Gary Fisher Mt Tam, Raleigh XXIX+G) to get a newer DH Bike. The consideration is between a Canfield Jedi or a Pivot Phoenix.
Though, to be honest, I am a little spooked about using carbon for a DH bike.

 

[Petoors]

I do not think you'll have to worry about carbon frames DH bikes . . . .
If world championship guys like Aron Gwyn, Danny Hart and Greg Minnaar rides them, I think you'll be OK.

 

[Tigerstripe40]

I do not think you'll have to worry about carbon frames DH bikes . . . .
If world championship guys like Aron Gwyn, Danny Hart and Greg Minnaar rides them, I think you'll be OK.

Those guys are pro's and if there is a problem with the frame(ie they crash and the frame cracks), they have several bikes built up ready to go. Likely there are new frames in the box in the mechanics van as well.

I don't have the kind of scratch to be able to afford that.

Also, my ride ready weight (230#) is much higher than those guys ride ready weight. The carbon manufacturers can say what they like, I don't believe that anything in the high end bike industry is designed for people over 175lbs.