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need headers/exhaust

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by tiorio, Jun 2, 2003.

  1. tiorio

    tiorio

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    Well, at 115k my header has rusted and separated (apparently) and the exhaust has been shot for some time. According to Toyota, the header itself is like $2000! They did say labor was almost nil...

    So what are my options here? I've read some of the other threads but am looking for opinions on the header specifically.

    Thanks!
     
  2. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

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    Todd,

    By header, I assume you mean the front exhaust pipe from the manifolds back to the rear catalytic converter? The OEM pipe does include the front converter. It is a 17401-66090. It lists for $1,314.40. Where is the other 700 bucks? Is the rear cat rusted as well? That is an 18450-66120 ,$408.47 we are still not there yet. What gives? There must be more stuff bad or they are out in Left field. :dunno:


    Dan :beer:
     
  3. tiorio

    tiorio

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    C-Dan...

    Well apparently the exhaust is shot as well. The truck, although not rusty, did a fair bit of time on the east coast and I live ON the coast so it IS possible...

    However, I don't have a clue as to what the actual problem is, and won't be able to see the truck until tonight to verify. I also don't have my FSM handy to reference right now. What is the most common point of failure header-related?

    Is there an option other than OEM?

    Cheers!
     
  4. Keep

    Keep

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    I think I saw some aftermarket headers on the Man-a-fre site a while back... sorry I don't have a link.
     
  5. tiorio

    tiorio

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    What to do, what to do...

    Here's what I saw today, starting at the front:

    Headers: ok
    Header pipe: ok, heat shield on bend loose, needs to be welded (rattles)

    Here's where it gets ugly:

    TWC 2 (cat #2, cat #1 is a part of the header pipe, no?): ok
    Muffler: shot, holes rusted through
    Tail pipe: ok

    THE PROBLEM lies in that fact that every flange connection from the header pipe - cat connection is RUSTED SOLID. Therefore to replace the muffler is NOT and easy proposition! Here are the options as I can see:

    a) replace everything from the header pipe to tail pipe to the tune of $2600 (quoted OEM) installed.

    b) tack weld the rattling heat shield and let the rest rust itself to death

    c) seperate/destroy or cut the flange connection back from TWC 2 and replace the muffler and tailpipe back with modified-for-trail-use Borla or similar ($500 or so).

    I'm leaning towards C, but the main concern is that flange. I'd like to pull the header pipe / TWC 1 and TWC 2 as a unit and clean them up and do something to protect it/them (maybe Jet Black or something), put that back with new gaskets, and the install the new muffler/pipe combo.

    Is this a viable option? What about that flange, it's pretty rusty and certainly won't come apart. I can't really cut it as it would compromise the way the flange mates, right? Any ideas here?

    Any other options?

    Thanks again!
     
  6. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

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    PB Blaster, maybe, on the joints for a while? Photoman had a rusted fastener post on SOR in the general forum that was very good. Maybe he could re-state the highlights.
     
  7. tiorio

    tiorio

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    Dan, they're FROZEN. The heads on the bolts are hardly recognizable, they've rusted beyond the point of release. The heads of the bolts will simply break off, the remainder of the shaft will not come out leaving any threads intact, they are shot beyond shot. Where there should be some indication of the two mating surfaces there is a single mass, no indication that the parts would come apart. Would that I had my camera with me!

    Either way, getting them apart looks like a no go. My thinking is that if I could cut the pipe and use what is left to rebuild a flange? I don't have access to a welder otherwise it might be a different story...
     
  8. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Supporting Vendor Moderator

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    Um, WOW :eek: Sorry, I'm not used to seeing stuff like that in this climate. The dash board cracks, the upholstry disintigrates, the battery toasts, the a/c takes a dump,the lenses haze,....Rust? Waassat? :dunno:
     
  9. Big_Moose

    Big_Moose

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    I haven't really looked at the exhaust system but this idea might / could theoretically work:

    Muffler shop should be able to cut the rusted flange out & install a new flange & pipe; thereby, moving the positon of the flange up or down stream of its OEM location - make sense :dunno:

    If not, my vote is for option C

    Joe
     
  10. Photoman

    Photoman SILVER Star

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    Tiorio,
    First, I vote for "c". Exhaust work is always tough with the rust, and usually shortly after you fight around to replace one pipe the next one goes bad. I will just try to tell you a couple of general things I have done in the past and maybe it will help. Sometimes what's left of the bold heads can be cut off and the flanges separated. Then the flange can be heated where the bolt goes through with an oxy/acetylene torch and vise grips put on the stud part of the bolt that is left and backed out. Another thing I have done is to heat the flange and actually grab the other threaded side of the bolt where it is sticking through and take it out by turning as if I was screwing it in. To do this you may need to cut the bolt off flush on the side where the flanges were mated. One other thought to keep in mind is to preserve the flanges. They are thick metal and another piece of pipe can always be welded to them by a shop. Just watch the orientation. Here is a flange I made for my 97 for a "test" pipe. I had to turn that groove on the lathe as Toyota uses a round gasket between the flanges. Oh, BTW, they use so much salt on the roads here that the oil pan on my FJ62 rusted out. No BS.
    Bill
     
  11. sleeoffroad

    sleeoffroad Supporting Vendor

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    Todd,

    I would go to the local 4x4 shops in your area and ask them who does their exhaust work. Shops that do motor swaps is a good place to start since they always have funny exhaust work and mostly send that out.

    I would just redo the whole thing from the front to the back with aftermarket parts. A good shop can probaby do that for $600-$800. Only catch is that you might have to remove the exhaust manifold if they break the studs where it attaches to the Y pipe.

    I would not go Borla, the flanges on that is pretty bad and they tend to leak easily. Also the muffler hangs down quite a bit. If you get the right shop, you will end up with a better system that is out of harms way.
     
  12. tiorio

    tiorio

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    So ifin I have a new system fabbed, do I expect that they'll reuse the existing cats or go aftermarket?

    What about the actual can, I checked old threads so Flowmaster 50 series sounds popular, any other options?

    Since it looks like I'm doing a custom exhaust, may as well have the best!

    Thanks again (and again),
     
  13. ovrroks

    ovrroks

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    Todd,

    After a trip to the Black Hills I too had to replace my entire exhaust. :D

    A local shop did it for $450.00 in 2001 (including replacing the cat - I now only run ONE cat on my '95 - no smog tests in MN :)) and I had them relocate the muffler into the space where the spare tire used to be. This frees-up a little more space under the frame as the stock muffler tends to hang low.

    The old exhaust was cut off right in front of the #1 cat, and a new cat was welded into place onto the original Y piece, and he was able to remount the #2 O2 Sensor (#1 sensor was not effected) in the same location.

    I have since replaced the muffler to run a quiter one (the flowmaster tends to "echo" in the new location and seems kinda loud inside the truck).

    I have just now this past week noticed an exhaust leak at the Y pipe and have purchased new "donut" gaskets from the dealer, but have not had time to get to it yet. I'm afraid I may run into the same issue of rusted on bolts. :-/ But the best way to go is a local exhaust shop that can bend-up something new for you.