In tank Fuel Pump conversion

Discussion in '60-Series Wagons' started by rover67, Jun 23, 2010.

  1. rover67

    rover67

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    Has anybody done it with one of these or a similar kit?

    PA-Series Fuel Pumps 40 to 100 PSI

    I'm thinking about doing it to fuel my FJ60 Vortec 5.3 a little bit better. With the stock tank and inline Walbro pump I never had any issues, but I recently switched to an LRA 40 Gal Tank with a 5/16 pickup and it seems to starve more now.

    I am thinking an in tank pump is ideal in my particular setup.
     
  2. rover67

    rover67

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    was also looking at this today:

    Vetteworks

    then it'd all be basically "stock" if I used a GM Truck pump which is available on ebay for around $85 shipped..
     
  3. ntsqd

    ntsqd technerd

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    On the YJ from Hell ('99 LS6/4L60E/D300 combo) we used the Firechicken's original fuel pump in a custom tank. (from Arrow Tanks I believe) That system was plumbed nearly dead-head. I say nearly because the stock fuel plumbing had a 'T' in the supply line about 24"-28" from the tank. The branch ran back to the tank. I can only assume that there was some sort of FPR in the stock pump assembly because there was not anything like one anywhere else.
     
  4. djawahir

    djawahir

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    Hey Rover, I've done this in tank fuel pump on my original FJ60 tank. I've got lots of data on how I did it. I'm still trying to get my V8 conversion all wired up and working, but I know the fuel pump is wired up and works for sure. I also wired up the fuel pump to the Vortec PCM so it kicks on for 2 seconds once the key is turned just to prime the pump before cranking the engine. It is a pretty nice setup and you may want to look into it too. It's just one wire to the pump relay from the PCM.

    I can post pics here if you want to start a thread. Or I can email you what I have.
     
  5. djawahir

    djawahir

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    Don't get the fuel pump from Vetteworks. It won't fit if you've got a stock FJ60 tank. Your fuel pump setup can not be more than about 6 1/2" deep for it to fit.

    Don't ask me how I know.
     
  6. rover67

    rover67

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    Pictures would be SWEET!

    Post them up in this thread or you can email them to me.

    also, just ot note, I am running an LRA 40 Gallon tank that is about 11.5" deep near the front end. Did the Gm pump look like it could streatch to reach that depth? How did you end up doing it?
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2011
  7. 2manyprojects

    2manyprojects

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    Post those pics...

    I'm interested in seeing the in-tank conversion also. I've got a 350 Ramjet with a Bosch external pump and the LRA tank together right now in my 60 and am concerned about it's long term durability. I started with an Aeromotive 11106 external pump and managed to "wear" it out in less than 1K miles. The Bosch seems more durable, but more miles will tell. The right in-tank pump system would be superior for durability and noise, but I'd like to see what's involved as it will be a project to convert.

    Has anyone been able to find out specifics about the baffles and pickup inside the LRA tanks? This could complicate any conversion and I didn't think to check it before I installed my tank. I'm concerned about whether this would complicate installing an in-tank system, and whether there's enough to minimize starvation when the tank nears empty.
     
  8. rover67

    rover67

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    I am doing it for sure with the LRA tank so i'll post up when i'm doing it.

     
  9. djawahir

    djawahir

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    For the gas tank in-tank pump, there is a location on the top of the stock FJ60 fuel tank that has a circular pattern. This will be the location for the fuel pump module. If the 4.5” hole is carefully centered and cut out, the fuel pump assembly from Yogi’s will fit with the least amount of effort. Incidentally, the original FJ60 tank pump reservoir is welded directly under this area. It will be used instead of the bolt-on reservoir supplied with the fuel pump assembly. With a little modification to the fuel pump mount, you can get the setup to fit perfectly. Follow the directions for pipe thread tape and the connectors to mount to the assembly. (See pics)
     
  10. djawahir

    djawahir

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    Here are pics of the location on the stock FJ60 fuel tank for the Tanks, Inc. fuel tank pump.
    Fuel_pump_location_on_tank.jpg Fuel_pump_location_mockup.jpg
     
  11. djawahir

    djawahir

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    Below are pics from the fuel pump that I modified to fit my application. This is not the actual pump setup I finally used, but it gives you an idea of what the physical setup looked like.

    Notes:

    My 5.3L Vortec engine is a returnless fuel system.
    I used a Corvette regulator/filter to regulate about 58psi on the line.
    I mounted this under my truck and use a manual shutoff valve in case of emergency and also in case I need to do any fuel line work after the tank.
    I used special Gates hose that is submersible in fuel. It will not degrade in this environment like standard fuel hose. Supposedly, standard fuel hose that you get only has the inside section of the hose fuel resistant.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2010
  12. djawahir

    djawahir

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    Voila!
    fuel_pump_assembly_front.jpg fuel_pump_assembly_back.jpg
     
  13. djawahir

    djawahir

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    A mock list of some parts that I used in my setup:

    4 ½” drill saw (RIDGID #7031 4 ½” bi-metal drill saw) $35
    3/8” Shank Mandrel for drill saw with pilot drill bit (RIDGID #7036) $14
    Drill bit 7/32”
    Fuel pump assembly for in tank fuel pump (Yogi’s TANPA-2) comes with fuel pump, connectors, mount, etc… $215
    Fuel pump (Walbro GSS242) and pump connector and screen (inside the TANPA-2 kit)
    Gates 29093 (5/16”) [5/16” x 1’ SAE 30R10 NAPA part #H209] submersible fuel injection hose. $28
    3/8” Barb x ¼” NPT Brass (SeaFit 1855782) $4
    5/16” Barb x ¼” NPT Brass (SeaFit 1855576) $4
    ¼” NPT Brass Plug (SeaFit 1859917) $3
    5/16” to 7/8” diameter hose clamps Koehler Enterprises (KE-6SS) $4
    Fuel injection hose clamps (Qty. 4) $2
     
  14. ntsqd

    ntsqd technerd

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    Aeroquip FC332 hose will also live submerged in gasoline & diesel too. I've done it.
     
  15. 2manyprojects

    2manyprojects

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    Much clearer now

    Djawahir, thanks for the photos, that makes more sense. Curious, what's the function of the other line (left in photo) on the outlet of your pump?

    I might look for a Toy factory fuel pump assm. for a smaller hole and fit my aftermarket pump (The Bosch pumps are less than 2.5" dia.)

    I like your sig line, and have to ask how long has your conversion been going? I started early 2003 and am finally on the road late 2009. Don't ask about passing WA state emissions...

    Now I'm kicking myself for not studying the LRA tank more while I had it out...

    Rover, any thoughts on where to drill to avoid baffles and locate the pump inlet on the LRA tank?

    As a side note for the LRA tank I found instead of modifying the existing FJ60 fuel level sensor per instructions, one from an '86 XCab Pickup has the same bolt pattern and longer arm, as well as a sensor for low fuel when the tank is near empty. I had to do a little bending of the float arm and the sensor mount to fit the height of the tank, and add one resistor in-line in the circuit to match the output resistance ranges. It works like a charm, and I wired the "choke" light in the gauge panel for the low fuel; seemed appropriate.
     
  16. Elbert

    Elbert SILVER Star

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    walbro external pumps work well..that's what I have.. You can hear it whine though.

    What about adapting the GM in tank unit? I think I still have the one from teh salvage yard that fit the GM truck. IT does look like it might be too tall though.

    Intake pump would be nice and quite and you could clean up the fuel hose mess.
     
  17. djawahir

    djawahir

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    I've been working on this FJ60 for about 3 years now. I've had all 4 doors removed and sitting in my kitchen for about 2 of those years. I don't even notice them. They've been there so long that even the wife doesn't notice them anymore.

    In the pictures of my fuel pump, I was trying to use a fuel pressure blowoff valve from a 2007 silverado fuel pump that I disassembled. It would have allowed me to just have one tube exiting the fuel tank. (The blowoff valve would just open once pressure in the fuel line got to over ~58psi and push extra fuel back into the tank.) But, since I was having a helluva time getting all of that together and feeling comfortable about the reliability of my setup, I trashed it and went with an external filter/regulator setup from a Corvette. So now, my fuel pump assembly has 2 tubes: an output tube and a return tube.

    I looked at trying to adapt the GM unit to the FJ60 tank. First off, the one that I got was a plastic assembly. I think most of the GM fuel pump assemblies are going to be plastic. Next, I couldn't get the locking ring to try and weld to my FJ60 tank for the fuel pump assembly to securely hold and seal to the fuel tank. I don't know where to find them and I believe that the GM fuel tanks are plastic, so you can't really remove the locking ring from the GM tank and attach it to your LRA tank. And since the GM fuel pump assembly was plastic, I wasn't about to drill it and bolt it down to my FJ60 fuel tank. Too scary for me to mess with possible stress fracture, air in tank, explosion, etc...

    So, I started looking at other options. The Tanks, Inc. fuel pump assembly was metal and well designed for me. I just needed to modify it to fit the FJ60 tank. And it was pretty easy to install. (I wasted about 2 months time trying to figure out how to get that GM pump assembly fitted to my tank and I just gave up.

    By the way, if you want to give the GM fuel pump assembly a try, I'll let you know that there is some flexibility in the depth of tank that this fpa will fit. It has the ability to squash down a couple inches to fit a couple different depths of tanks.

    Hope that helps.
     
  18. zebrabeefj40

    zebrabeefj40

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    Seems to me that a tank from an FJ62 would be easier than all that custom stuff. Swap the pump to match whatever motor you're running and go...

    djawahir, you can get the metal GM seal rings from old GM tanks. Most GM tanks through the mid-90's were still metal. A lot of the car fuel pump assemblies are the right depth to fit a Cruiser tank too (and they're pretty easy to modify if not). One of the projects on my list is to swap an in-tank pump from a GM car to a FJ40 tank to feed a TPI motor. I have several tanks to chose from on hand.

    Jim C. also swapped in a tank from a domestic van of some sort to gain more fuel capacity in the stock location. Since he's feeding a carb he chose an early tank. There's a write up of his process/results somewhere here in the 60 section. If you chose a tank from a later EFI van you're back to using stock in-tank stuff that matches your motor.

    :cheers:

    Nick
     
  19. ntsqd

    ntsqd technerd

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    That tank that we used in the YJ project at our request came set-up for the '99 Firechicken's fuel pump assembly. The tank's mfg had to machine the "socket" for the assembly and then weld it into the tank. The socket was similar to, but not the same as earlier GM parts.
    This fuel pump assembly is pretty trick, no need to set things to the right height(s) etc., it was spring loaded. Uninstalled it was taller than the tank. Installing it to the tank was just a matter of dropping it in and then pushing it down far enough for the lock ring to be fitted into place.
     
  20. rover67

    rover67

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    well, I just got a used pump from a friend from a 2002 Silverado 1500 HD. Looks like it will reach the depth of my LRA tank but it won't collapse enough. SImple mod though.

    I ordered a new one from rock auto and the rings from vetteworks to install it into the tank. I chose the pump from the 2002 Silverado because it has no FPR on the return, I'll be using the corvette FPR and filter combo near the tank to regulate down to 58psi. SHould be a nice clean setup.

    I am glad I was able to get the junker pump from my friend because I was able to see what the regulator (or lack of) assembly was like and check the depth that the pump can reach. I wanted to use the corvette regulator so this pump will be perfect. I'll post up as I go along.

    Pump is a Delphi PN FG0053
    Using Dorman Connectors DOR-800-121 for the 3/8" quick connects (Pressure line on pump and filter)
    Using Dorman COnnectors DOR-800-120 for the 5/16" quick connects (return line on pump and filter)
    Using Dorman fuel line PN DOR-800-155 double bead line (for the fuel filter outlet)
    Using a C5 Corvette filter from Napa PN 3737
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2010

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