I want to lower the CG of my SOA wagon. Ideas? (1 Viewer)

[Randy88FJ62]

I like my spring over for the clearance I gain on the trail but I really don’t like how top heavy / tippy it is. I would like to do my best to lower the lift as much as possible without reducing its rock crawling ability.

I remember seeing someone french their shackle and spring pack mounts into the frame to lower the lift an inch.

Are there any other options done here on mud to lower the CG? I don’t mind trimming wheel wells or creating tube fenders in the front. This is a weekend only truck that gets driven to the trail and wheeling. As long as it is street legal I’m interested in possible options.

Lowering the CG will also provide more safety when travelling on the freeway with an RTT mounted.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

What springs are you using? Do they have AALs?

Unless your springs are already flat, then the easiest option is to swap out for flat springs. If you don't like that route, then you're looking at some significant modifications to the spring mounts to get the spring higher into the frame.

 

[snowboardonsnow]

What springs are you using? Do they have AALs?

Unless your springs are already flat, then the easiest option is to swap out for flat springs. If you don't like that route, then you're looking at some significant modifications to the spring mounts to get the spring higher into the frame.

X2


You can also chop the roof off. Or pull a leaf or two out, Wider axles, wheel spacers, better offset rims. Doing mods to the mounts is time consuming I have done it, and at that point my as well upgrade to better springs.

 

[CruiserHappy]

too bad you live so far away, I would give you my flat 60 springs. Taking up room!

 

[Randy88FJ62]

I have extra spare leaf packs in my garage. Right now I have AAL's front and rear. The front is already getting flat after the M12000 winch install so i'll be adding another leaf to the front packs. I also have 1.5" wheel spacers front and rear at the moment.

I don't want to spend money on a set of custom Alcan springs. I prefer to do everything myself on the cheap.

Two years ago at SnT I bent my stock front leaf springs. They could not handle the weight and abuse I dish out.

Here are my thoughts on lowering the CG:

1: French leaf spring and shackle mounts into frame or even higher.
2: Trim fenders to handle the tire stuff due to the frenched mounts.
3: Replace springs with thicker springs that won't sit as high but still give good flex. (suburban springs in rear?)

Any other ideas? I have no problem bringing out the plasma cutter to make room in fenders.

Cutting off the roof is a long term goal. I plan on installing a full cage and then installing a canvas top.

I know the drivetrain sits pretty tight up against the underbody of the truck. Has anyone ever done a body lower? I'm sure my body mounts could use new pucks. I wonder how much lower you could go without hitting the drivetrain.

 

[ntsqd]

Um, put it back to SUA in the rear, link the front and go with coil springs?

Flat springs ride great, but have very little travel before you invert them and reversing the spring arch is the best way to kill them dead. Longer springs with some arch to them are the solution to both dilemmas. Not much room up front for that, hence the linkage & coils suggestion.

Could also replace all of the glass (except the windshield) with plexiglas.

 

[lehiguy]

There is one other solution, go wider. I'm six inches wider WMS to WMS plus the ten inch wheels. It's nice and stable. Bobby Long will made you a set of custom length shafts in 30-spline for relatively little money. Rough Stuff makes a killer housing in any width you want or you can self-stretch like I did. Just a thought...

 

[Kurtis]

I went with 2.5 backspace 10in rims and needed 1.5 spacers to run them. The difference is night and day compared to stock width. I feel extremly stable especially offroad.

 

[muddogbob]

There is one other solution, go wider. I'm six inches wider WMS to WMS plus the ten inch wheels. It's nice and stable. Bobby Long will made you a set of custom length shafts in 30-spline for relatively little money. Rough Stuff makes a killer housing in any width you want or you can self-stretch like I did. Just a thought...

This is the route I'm taking. I've already got the 80 series rear axle and spacers up front, but I'm dreaming of a diamond or RS fabricated front housing!

 

[Kynot62]

Um, put it back to SUA in the rear, link the front and go with coil springs?

Flat springs ride great, but have very little travel before you invert them and reversing the spring arch is the best way to kill them dead. Longer springs with some arch to them are the solution to both dilemmas. Not much room up front for that, hence the linkage & coils suggestion.

Could also replace all of the glass (except the windshield) with plexiglas.

Unless you run old chevy springs that were designed with a reverse camber.... I seem to remember solid axle Chevy trucks/Blazers and Suburbans from the late 70's and early 80's that had front springs that were arc'ed upward from day 1

If you do replace the windows with plastic, use Polycarbonate (Lexan and other brands) Not Acrylic (Plexiglas) Plexiglas can still shatter with an impact, Polycarbonate will flex. Both of them work (sanding, polishing and cutting) the same.

Tony

 

[ntsqd]

Both of my Suburbans ('79 & '91) came with those OE reverse arched springs under the front when I bought them. Maybe in some other truck they'd work, but under those trucks they sucked. They had about 1" of up travel before hitting the bump-stops. I used a set of K5 "Pre-Runner" springs from Rancho under both trucks and those worked most excellent!

My point was that flexing a spring from a positive arch to a negative arch and back is what kills them. My own RoT is that metal to metal happens with 1" of 'normal' arch left in the springs. I never intentionally allow them to go completely flat or further.

Good catch on the plexiglas. I tend to confuse all of the trade names, but polycarbonate is definitely the material to use.

 

[Tapage]

My springs are almost flat .. I'm using as short as possible shackles ( revolvers in the rear ) and cut some of my fenders to keep she as low as possible ..

Also ran 2" wheel spacers .. to keep a decent track which helps a bit too ..

But you can't go less than 6" that it's more less what you gain with the sole housing ..

 

[lcwizard]

there are lot's vehicles with high CG's that travel well and safely on the highway. Maybe there is
something that can be done with steering geometry for handling and heavy sway bars for tippiness.
Without knowing more A higher spring rate will reduce roll but too much will inhibit flex

 

[snowboardonsnow]

Like LCwizard is saying it takes a lot to tip one on the road, my tire would fold before I tipped (resulting in a roll over). I am pretty tall and have very long travel flexy long springs, very skinny track width with very skinny tires and I have buried her into corners without my swaybar on and only once scared myself, but again it was more about my tires giving first.

 

[Elbert]

I like my spring over for the clearance I gain on the trail but I really don’t like how top heavy / tippy it is. I would like to do my best to lower the lift as much as possible without reducing its rock crawling ability.

I remember seeing someone french their shackle and spring pack mounts into the frame to lower the lift an inch.

Are there any other options done here on mud to lower the CG? I don’t mind trimming wheel wells or creating tube fenders in the front. This is a weekend only truck that gets driven to the trail and wheeling. As long as it is street legal I’m interested in possible options.

Lowering the CG will also provide more safety when travelling on the freeway with an RTT mounted.

Got any pics of the way the truck is sitting now?

 

[Randy88FJ62]

I'm not at a computer at the moment so pics will have to wait until Monday. I just checked the front springs and it seems I have bent them flat again with a slight S shape. I guess the stock pack with a MAF long AAL can't handle the weight of an ARB bumper with a warn M12000 winch installed.

The rear springs are stock with an extra long stock leaf added and an extra MAF Long AAL added (so stock rears plus two leaves.)

The rear is handling alright. I guess the main issue I'm facing is the flat bent springs in the front. Ill have to rebuild them with some extra leaves sitting around.

I guess I'll start by putting the sway bars back on and fixing the front leaf pack and see where that put me.

 

[too tall]

You could see if there is enough room in the spring hanger to flip the top two leaves in the packs upside down . That would give you 1" less of a lift .

 

[ntsqd]

'S' shaped bent springs isn't caused by too much weight. It's normally caused by torque-wrap. 'W' shaped springs usually are the result of going into negative arch.

 

[lcwizard]

Are you shackle rear or forward up front ? Have an alignment shop give you a printout of caster, camber and toe. Without this info it's tough to tell whats going on with handling.

 

[Randy88FJ62]

LCWizard,
I have a stock setup with shackles up front.

Ntsqd,

The recent trip wheeling in the rocks probably torqued the front springs a bit much. This exact situation happened at SnT two years ago.