Gnarly POP! during hard turn/break (1 Viewer)

[jstouder]

I have a persistent and challenging issue with my FJ80 and could really use some help. Unless off-roading, when it happens consistently, I have a random but harsh POP that comes from the front passenger side of the vehicle. It most often happens when taking a sharp left turn, or braking hard. It's a very loud metal on metal sound.

History:
- Purchased on 7/27
- Service on 9/5
- New front brakes w/ shim
- Repacked front wheel bearings
- Greased front knuckles
- 2.5" OME lift kit installed on 10/2
- Heavies on front
- Mediums in rear
- Sport shocks all around
- Steering dampener

Symptoms:
- POP did not start happening until around the time of the service/lift install.
- During daily use, POP might happen during a hard turn left at moderate speeds (10-20mph).
- During daily use, POP might happen during a hard stop (slam on breaks)
- During daily use, POP does not happen going straight over speed bumps at slow speed.
- During off-roading, POP happens consistently.
- POP resonates in the floorboard and feet, NOT in the steering wheel.
- POP is very loud metal-on-metal sound.

Resolution Effort(s):
- Springs, shocks and dampener inspected by three different sources. Kit install looks good, with one stating the front passenger shock is slightly loose at full tighten.
- One shop mentioned the ABS as the culprit but couldn't articulate exactly why.
- Sway bar greased and tightened. I do not believe it is the sway bar.
- The knuckles and the birfields are completely stock. This includes the trunnion bearings. I had them serviced on 9/5 and apparently they looked just fine.

I suspect something in the hub (bearing, birfield, trunnion) or ABS, but have no idea how to narrow it down and find the actual problem. I don't have a lot of tools and/or time to spend investigating it at home and I'm bordering on desperation (RCV Axle replacement, front end kit from Kurt) or offering a resolution reward...

 

[inkpot]

Fist guess is a broken Birf. Only way to tell/repair is to tear down knuckle & pull Birf out to inspect.

 

[Aggiesdm]

Broken birf is a real possibility. Another thought...Can you feel it through the steering whee? Maybe a broken gear in steering box? Could it be one of your OME springs coming unseated and then popping back into place? What about loose lug nuts on left wheel? Just reaching here, but these are possibilities. Hope you find it. Replacing a birf isn't too bad and you can source a used one to keep costs down.

 

[jfz80]

Check torque on the radius arms on both axle and frame ends as well. Make sure to turn the non staked side (bolt I believe?) Toyota specs these as non reuse able but we always have. But recently a few pairs aren't wanting to retain proper torque.

 

[jstouder]

Fist guess is a broken Birf. Only way to tell/repair is to tear down knuckle & pull Birf out to inspect.

I agree completely. I've had my eyes on the RCV Spline Upgrade set for some time. Didn't want to do it as part of a witch hunt but if I'm going to pull it all apart...

Broken birf is a real possibility. Another thought...Can you feel it through the steering whee? Maybe a broken gear in steering box? Could it be one of your OME springs coming unseated and then popping back into place? What about loose lug nuts on left wheel? Just reaching here, but these are possibilities. Hope you find it. Replacing a birf isn't too bad and you can source a used one to keep costs down.

I do not feel the POP in the steering wheel. I've considered the OME spring seating issue but that doesn't really jive with experiencing the POP during a hard break. Unless it's reseating during aggresive compression. Had a friend look at the tires, lugs are good to go and the POP still happens.

Check torque on the radius arms on both axle and frame ends as well. Make sure to turn the non staked side (bolt I believe?) Toyota specs these as non reuse able but we always have. But recently a few pairs aren't wanting to retain proper torque.

Good idea, will do.

One thing to add to the equation. Rock sliders from Jason at CrusinOffroad. Could it be possible that, during some amount of flex on the frame the sliders are moving enough to create the noise and feeling?

 

[scrowley]

My Rig does the same thing. Driving me crazy. Been searching for a awhile. I also have brand new longfield axles. Did the same noise prior with OEM birfs.

I have tourqued everything possible. Mostly new parts in front axle and steering. Happens when I wheel a lot. Mostly when I hit a ledge head on while turning. Also happens when I make a hard right hand turn, downhill.

Not trying to hyjack just sounds like the same issue.

 

[Tux318]

Mine does it while braking on a hard left...like pulling into an off camber driveway at slow slow speeds. The pop comes from the right front though. Ironman 2.5" lift and matching shocks, swaybar drop spacers. I've tried to figure it out too.

 

[blkprj80]

Something the great "Robbie" taught me that I feel obliged to pass along:

Grab that wheel and shake it in/out at the top as hard as you can. Listen and feel for clunks and noises. Once you get it to be a repeatable sound or feel, have someone shake it while you look to see what it is.

If it pops at a full left turn, crank the steering wheel full left, shut it off, and get out and shake the s*** out of it. Rock the tire fwd/rev also.

Your truck will throw around a lot more weight than you can by doing this, so you won't hurt it.

This works on both front and rear wheels.

 

[jstouder]

My Rig does the same thing. Driving me crazy. Been searching for a awhile. I also have brand new longfield axles. Did the same noise prior with OEM birfs.

I have tourqued everything possible. Mostly new parts in front axle and steering. Happens when I wheel a lot. Mostly when I hit a ledge head on while turning. Also happens when I make a hard right hand turn, downhill.

Not trying to hyjack just sounds like the same issue.

Mine does it while braking on a hard left...like pulling into an off camber driveway at slow slow speeds. The pop comes from the right front though. Ironman 2.5" lift and matching shocks, swaybar drop spacers. I've tried to figure it out too.

That's exactly what I'm dealing with. More symptoms that I've just realized could be related:
- At highway speed, if I let off the accelerator and coast, every now and then the front right hub will whine. It sounds like the small wind-up engine in a toy car when you release it in the air.

My plan of attack is as follows:

RCV Performance Axle replacement w/ kit from Kurt at CruiserOutfitters

 

[terra durus]

mine had a pop after suspension was done, repacked the bearings, and only popped once when turning slow full left. I then read that it may be the panhard bolt under torque spec, found it to be about 90ft lbs or so instead of the 127ftlbs (IIRC) that it should be. that fixed it for me. it was only on the PS too.

I've also read that as jstouder mentioned something may be making contact with the sliders, in that case you should be able to see some wear on the front edge by the sway bar if that's happening

I know it may not be the case for you but its inexpensive to confirm before you dive into expensive parts replacement.

 

[inkpot]

mine had a pop after suspension was done, repacked the bearings, and only popped once when turning slow full left. I then read that it may be the panhard bolt under torque spec, found it to be about 90ft lbs or so instead of the 127ftlbs (IIRC) that it should be. that fixed it for me. it was only on the PS too.[/QUOTE

Recently went thru that myself. Replaced both bushings on the panhard and no more problem. John

 

[scrowley]

My panhard is tourqed. And wheel bearing are extra tight (25 ft lbs.) and greased too. also have all new steering rod ends.
I have one worn spindle on pass side that i will be replacing soon along with new bearings. Crossing my fingers.

 

[inkpot]

My panhard is tourqed. And wheel bearing are extra tight (25 ft lbs.) and greased too. also have all new steering rod ends.
I have one worn spindle on pass side that i will be replacing soon along with new bearings. Crossing my fingers.

If the panhard bushings are worn out it allows the end of the parhard rod to bang around inside the pocket/bracket on the lower end. Have to get a good light in there to see if the rubber is shot. John

 

[jstouder]

mine had a pop after suspension was done, repacked the bearings, and only popped once when turning slow full left. I then read that it may be the panhard bolt under torque spec, found it to be about 90ft lbs or so instead of the 127ftlbs (IIRC) that it should be. that fixed it for me. it was only on the PS too.

I've also read that as jstouder mentioned something may be making contact with the sliders, in that case you should be able to see some wear on the front edge by the sway bar if that's happening

I know it may not be the case for you but its inexpensive to confirm before you dive into expensive parts replacement.

If the panhard bushings are worn out it allows the end of the parhard rod to bang around inside the pocket/bracket on the lower end. Have to get a good light in there to see if the rubber is shot. John

10-4 on the Panhard. Got a friend with a torque wrench and will investigate tomorrow and holler back.

Would anyone be so kind as to share a picture of the panhard rod? Remember, I'm a complete noob.

 

[richardlillard1]

Panhard is the lower of the rods pictured. Pay no attention to the shape of the drag link, which should be straight on yours.

I'm somewhat destructive.

 

[basalt51]

Sounds like one of you arms/bushings to me. Check them all. If you can really recreate it going slow, have someone drive it and watch each bar individually. You will see it pop. Check the paint around each washer/bolt for signs of shifting.

 

[cruiserdan]

We had a loose panhard on an 80 at Cruise Moab a couple years ago. We could get it to happen stopped and turning the wheels lock-to-lock.

The truck was RHD and the RH end was loose. At first it sounded like it was comming from the steering box.

 

[retrofive]

I spent some time tracking down a vibe issue to the panhard has well. I really had to give it hell in the driveway to find the upper bolt loose.

 

[scrowley]

I will prob just order some panhard bushings and see what happens. I have a press so no big deal to change.they are def original with 217k.

I cannot get anything to move/ slop while inspecting. Using a 3' pry bar. Also cycling steering both ways lock to lock.

A liitke off topic. ...Funny thing though...looking around I can see some marks on panhard from hitting pass side radius arm mount. Must be at full stuff o

 

[fumann]

Panhard is the lower of the rods pictured. Pay no attention to the shape of the drag link, which should be straight on yours.

I'm somewhat destructive.

View attachment 1026231

Nice of you to move it out of the way, so we could get a better look.