bilstein/koni shock options and dimensions collected

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by semlin, Jun 7, 2005.

  1. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

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    I have been doing some research on bilstein and konis. It is amazing how hard it is to find out info about these shocks so I thought I would share.

    The OEM replacement Bilsteins b461477 and 1478 are recommended by Bilstein Australia for up to a 2" lift. Bilstein here does not rate them for a lift. You can pick these up online for $65US each including shipping which is less than OME. Their dimensions are:

    b461477 594mm 365 mm front (extended/compressed)
    b461478 591mm 380mm rear

    edit: as of 2011 the part numbers have changed but the shock appears to be the same
    OLD ......................................NEW
    F4-B46-1477-H1......................24-014779 front
    F4-B46-1478-H0 (or H1)............24-014786 rear

    According to specific discussions with Bilstein Australia they are too short for a 2.5" OME lift. However, I suspect they may have picked the 2" cutoff line on purpose to eliminate most lifts from their warranty. If you compare them to the OME specifications below they have the same travel as the n73/74 shocks but are an inch shorter. The question is how much leeway OME has built into their shock length.

    I do not know what you guys mean by "HD" bilstein shocks but all bilstein custom series shocks (5100-9100) are eye/eye fittings which do not fit on an 80 stud/stud front, stud/eye rear setup without adaptors (in which case to compensate for the adaptors you need a shock 2" shorter on the front and 1" shorter on the rear). I udnerstand you can special order from bilstein but I guess price becomes an issue plus I can't get past voicemail at bilstein usa to see if they have anything custom recommended. Bilstein australia has no standard setup sold for larger lifts and the stock shocks apparently get used a lot on bigger lifts.

    Koni has no stock recommended shock for an 80 in north america.
    The Koni Heavytrack and Raid shocks designed for the 80 series can be special ordered into north america from holland. I am still waiting for prices but have been warned to brace myself. Their dimensions are as follows:

    30-1427 353mm 578mm front heavy track gas (no lift)
    30-1426 355mm 584mm rear
    90-5389 368mm 620mm front raid (up to 50mm lift)
    90-5390 384mm 609mm rear

    Note that the first "non-lifted" heavy track is shorter than the bilsteins.
    I have also found additional heavytracks listed for australia only for up to 50mm lift but I have no dimensions and not sure yet if you can get in north america.

    82-2385 front
    82-2386 rear
    82-2385sp1 front
    82-2386sp1 rear

    The Koni Raid series above seems like it would work for a bigger lift than 50mm if you compare it to OME lengths which are as follows:

    N70 ......... 614 .......... 354 f (neutral lift)
    N71E ........ 620 .......... 370 r
    N74E ........ 620 .......... 370 f (2.5" lift)
    N73 ......... 614 .......... 354 r
    N73L ........ 667 .......... 387 f (3.5" lift)
    N74L ........ 667 .......... 387 r

    It is also interesting that the OME zero lift shocks are so long which makes me think length may be a little arbitrary for OME. If someone could measure the length of their OME 73/74s at full extension with a specific spring then we would know how much leeway they have built in and sort out whether the shorter bilsteins might be fine for the medium/heavy ome lifts.

    I do not have stock oem shock measurements other than a recent comment by cruiserdan that they are 1 7/16" (36 mm) shorter than the OME regulars which would be about 584mm. If anyone knows exact length and travel for a baseline that would be great.

    Koni Australia also sells a special "88 series" shock for lifted 80s which is apparently a special custom shock put together by the Austyralian distributor. I am trying to get the exact specs on it because in north america an 88 series Koni shock is a motorhome/commercial shock widely available in numerous models. Unfortunately Koni Australia does not seem to want to share.

    Koni Australia sells the RAID shocks there as a "90 series". In north america a 90 series shock is a heavy commercial vehicle/bus line of shocks one up from the 88 and, again, there are lots of different shocks available.

    Here is the 2004 Koni heavy duty catalog showing the dimensions for 88 and 90 series individual models but not the valving. You can see these are big twin tube shocks with lots of alternatives for length out there, some of which have the stud/stud or stud/eye combo needed for an 80.

    www.koni-na.com/pdfcatalogs/KONI004Catalog.pdf

    Going back to the part numbers listed above for Koni heavytrack and raids you can now see that the first 2 numbers designate the series. The no lift heavytracks are 30 series (monotube 5/8" piston rod). The australian lifted heavytracks are 82 series (not sure what these are) while the Raids are 90 series (twin tube 17.5 or 18 mm pistons). The www.koni4x4.com site lists a number of features for the RAID shock

    The Koni 88 and 90 series are sold direct in north america at www.konirv.com priced at US$120 and $161 each retail. So far I have not tried to find a discounted price.

    Right now I am leaning towards the bilstein stockers if I am sure they will fit because the price is so good, or else ordering an 88 or 90 seires from koni, possibly with custom valving in case i move up in lift.

    EDIT 06/08/05

    More data points.

    It looks like there is a fairly close match for the OME 73/74Es in the Konis. Here are the specs for the Koni 82 series heavytrack australia (50mm lift shocks) I mentioned above. You can get them in north america special ordered from holland if you allow minimum 6 weeks shipping through koni usa.

    82 2385 617 mm / 373mm front
    Forces rebound = 2600 N, compression = 1050N

    82 2386 617mm / 373 mm rear
    Forces rebound = 2300 N, compression = 1050 N

    Price is US$ 122 ea and US$ 114 ea. The rebound stats are when stroked at 33 m/s. These are roughly same length, same rear stroke, but a 19mm shorter front stroke than the OME 73/74e combo so you could use them with 0 lift up to at least the ome heavy springs. The 82 series has a 16 mm piston rod, 33 mm piston and 50 mm reservoir. Koni says their shocks carry a 40% surplus of oil over design needs.

    For a big lift the following are suggested for the 80 series by Koni at $165 each
    90 5055SP2 - 688 mm 399 front
    90 2367SP2 - 702 mm 424 rear

    Koni "suggests" but will not warranty these shocks on a lifted 80. You can see the stroke is very similar to OME L series but at 21 mm and 35mm longer you would need a lot of spring lift for these big boys plus you might need to mod the shock mounts. According to Koni the pin mounts require a chassis plate that is roughly 10 mm thick. the shocks are 70mm tubes with 80mm dust covers and they need a 30mm dia hole for the pins and the rear eye has a 1" ID and is 1.97" long (my stock eye is 1.25" long but have not measured an OME). Price = US$165 each.

    If interested in these or other 90 series options you need to check the rebound rates in the catalog for these models then talk to Koni about how they would rides. I am not sure I understand the rating system they are using.

    There remains the possibility of tracking down the elusive 88 series Australian Konis. These would be bigger shocks than the 82 series heavy tracks above and in the same US$120 price ranges. I have tried Koni USA and they are sure they do not exist outside australia. I have also tried Koni Australia without success.

    EDit: koni says the 82 series are twin tube single adjustable

    Update

    I have more info on the Koni shocks including the elusive 88 series...

    The $Can price for the 30 series heavytracks and 90 series Raid shocks noted above.

    301427 C$118.26/per monotube
    301427 C$118.26/per
    905389 C$272.91/per twintube
    905390 C$236.52/per

    Plus C$40 freight charge. These shocks are sourced from Holland by Koni North America as a special order. According to Koni Australia these shocks are designed by Koni France. Koni Australia does not sell the 30 monotube series, preferring their 82 heavytrack twintube series line, but they do stock a "few" RAIDS. On an australian forum someone commented it is almost impossible to get koni retailers to give any details about the RAIDs which they do not seem to want to sell.

    Here are the specs on the other "82 2385/86sp1" series Koni australian heavytrack noted above. You can also order this through Koni North America and it will be sourced from Holland. This is a twin tube shock rated for "zero lift" by Koni Australia. I believe it is the same price as the longer 82-2385/86 series noted above.

    82-2385sp1 , 600 & 372
    82-2386sp1 , 584 & 373

    Note the dimensions and compare to the bilstein stockers rated to 50mm.

    Here are the specs for the 88 series shocks for an 80 only from Koni Australia. Koni Australia has them specially built locally and is prepared to sell these direct into Canada on one off orders with permission from Koni-North America. You could try and buy them by contacting Koni Australia directly, but weight for the price...

    88-1688, Max, 615 mm. Min. 363 mm.
    88-1689, Max 612, Min 369

    The price is ... Aus$642 per pair front, Aus$632 per pair rear! Plus shipping and any duties from Oz! Koni Australia notes that the special 88 series is designed for desert conditions because of problems with heat they had with landcruisers, particularly with the upper shock mount inside the engine compartment.

    Koni Australia says no "regular" 88 series truck shock would work on an 80 series without valving and fitting changes. They also expressed confidence their shocks will outperform the OME shocks in all conditions. This is borne out by the respect konis get on Australian forums.

    There aren't any longer Koni shocks available because company policy prevents them selling any shock that would stretch stock brakelines or other stock components. You have to go custom if you want bigger. Given the price of their best stock, I will leave that alone.

    So folks, I think this now covers specs and prices for every possible shock available from Bilstein or Koni that is designed to fit an 80. There are plenty of eye/eye custom bilsteins out there.
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2011
  2. woody

    woody the internet is just a fad... Staff Member

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    9,651
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    good numbers to have....

    per your numbers:

    N74E (front) = 250 stroke
    N73 (rear) = 260 stroke

    b461477 (front) = 229 stroke
    b461478 (rear) = 211 stroke

    curious why the Bilstein uses a 18mm shorter rear stroke while OME uses 10mm longer for rear....
  3. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

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    i asked if the guy who gave them to me if that was reversed front/rear and was told no. I wondered as well.
  4. RavenTai

    RavenTai

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    Location:
    Dixie co. Florida
    my shocks are original OEM and need to be replaced, I had been holding out trying to figure out what I want to do, some say they do not like OME shocks for life expectancy and several other complaints, others are very happy with them, info on other shocks was spotty, after the other thread that had dimensions I saw that the bilsteines were not that much shorter than OME's I figured I would go with what I had used in the past and was happy with.

    Ordered the Bilsteins from Autozone.com yesterday free shipping but had to pay tax, total came out to just over $250 for all 4 corners, could not find them any cheaper anywhere else. Should be hear later this week or early the next

    Koni's were not an option due to price and availability,

    the loss of more or less an inch of travel does have me worried about compatibility later down the road, I don’t have any lift right now but plan on standard OME springs later I could not find much info here weather it woudl be a problem or not, I would imagine for most uses you will not get into the extremes of travel, to worry about it.

    When I pull the OEM ones out I can get their dimensions, eye to eye shocks are easy enough to measure, but what about stud style? Where do you measure from?


    Later down the road I may have to modify it to take some 7100 series with custom mounts but bolt on for now.
  5. elum

    elum

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    Inland Empire
    appreciate all the good work! gracias...
  6. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

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    5,152
    Location:
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    Raventai

    stud style measures from the base of the stud. eye style is middle of the eye.
  7. Augie

    Augie

    Messages:
    511
    I been waiting to get Koni Heavy Track for my 100 series for a few months. Koni USA would not even give the price. I managed to get pricing on regular KONI and somebody quote me $84 each with free shipping from a dealer in California.
  8. RavenTai

    RavenTai

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    6,085
    Location:
    Dixie co. Florida

    I would have guessed the middle of the bushing where it meets the mount, now I know better.
  9. TFS55

    TFS55

    Messages:
    101
    as I have posted in other thread about Bils with OME lifts, I will post it here again on our experinces with that combo. The bils thumps during extensions when combined with OME springs with 30mm spacers in the front. therefore you can use it going to the malls on ly if you have more than 2" lift unless you make shock extensions. also being monotube design i think it is the reason why they cannot extend or compress much more than twin tubed designed shocks. as for the ride we did not notice any difference, sometimes it is softer though in some instances.
  10. RavenTai

    RavenTai

    Messages:
    6,085
    Location:
    Dixie co. Florida

    witch springs were you running with the 30mm spacers?
  11. Fochdog

    Fochdog

    Messages:
    224
    So far my combo, 850 & 860 OME springs and B46-1477 B46-1478 Bilstein shocks have been great.

    I did some moderate off road this past weekend with no ill effects due to ride travel.

    When I installed my Bilstein shocks I compared them to the OE take offs and they measured (roughly) the same travel within a few millimeters.

  12. TFS55

    TFS55

    Messages:
    101
    ome 50mm springs with super pro 30mm spacers front, ome 50mm rear springs
  13. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

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    what model # are these OME 50mm springs? We don't use that designation in north america.
  14. CharlieS

    CharlieS

    Messages:
    483
    The OME med I have are 50mm lift... 860/851 I think....

    Charlie
  15. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

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    Location:
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    More data points. I will update the first post to include this info:

    It looks like there is a fairly close match for the OME 73/74Es in the Konis. Here are the specs for the Koni 82 series heavytrack australia (50mm lift shocks) I mentioned above. You can get them in north america special ordered from holland if you allow minimum 6 weeks shipping through koni usa.

    82 2385 617 mm / 373mm front
    Forces rebound = 2600 N, compression = 1050N

    82 2386 617mm / 373 mm rear
    Forces rebound = 2300 N, compression = 1050 N

    Price is US$ 122 ea and US$ 114 ea. The rebound stats are when stroked at 33 m/s. These are roughly same length, same rear stroke, but a 19mm shorter front stroke than the OME 73/74e combo so you could use them with 0 lift up to at least the ome heavy springs. The 82 series has a 16 mm piston rod, 33 mm piston and 50 mm reservoir. Koni says their shocks carry a 40% surplus of oil over design needs.

    For a big lift the following are suggested for the 80 series by Koni at $165 each
    90 5055SP2 - 688 mm 399 front
    90 2367SP2 - 702 mm 424 rear

    Koni "suggests" but will not warranty these shocks on a lifted 80. You can see the stroke is very similar to OME L series but at 21 mm and 35mm longer you would need a lot of spring lift for these big boys plus you might need to mod the shock mounts. According to Koni the pin mounts require a chassis plate that is roughly 10 mm thick. the shocks are 70mm tubes with 80mm dust covers and they need a 30mm dia hole for the pins and the rear eye has a 1" ID and is 1.97" long (my stock eye is 1.25" long but have not measured an OME). Price = US$165 each.

    If interested in these or other 90 series options you need to check the rebound rates in the catalog for these models then talk to Koni about how they would rides. I am not sure I understand the rating system they are using.

    There remains the possibility of tracking down the elusive 88 series Australian Konis. These would be bigger shocks than the 82 series heavy tracks above and in the same US$120 price ranges. I have tried Koni USA and they are sure they do not exist outside australia. I have also tried Koni Australia without success.
  16. TFS55

    TFS55

    Messages:
    101
    oh sorry

    front OME 851
    rear OME 860
  17. Darwood

    Darwood

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    Does any one know if the Koni's monotube or twintube shocks?
  18. Cruiser Jimmy

    Cruiser Jimmy SILVER Star

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    Raid's are twintubes.
    Heavy Track could be TT or Mono.
  19. Augie

    Augie

    Messages:
    511
    Semlin,

    Where did you get the pricing from. I been trying to get this in the last 3 months and KONI-NA would not even give me the pricing.
  20. semlin

    semlin rocker SILVER Star

    Messages:
    5,152
    Location:
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    the 82 series heavytracks are twin tube single adjustable. just confirmed that today.

    the 30 series heavytracks are monotube and the 88/90 series are twin tubes.

    the pricing was from koni tech support. I am thinking about the 82 series now over the bilstein since they are twintube and adjustable. they are a lot more money so tough call.

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