100-series modification differences and evaluations (by John Shotts): (1 Viewer)

[ShottsUZJ100]

Hey great write-up! I just got a "new" used 100 and came across this in my research. Also in my research I have found a lift by extremelandcruiser.com that will do 4, 6, 8" lifts in a method similar to say a Procomp Chevy IFS lift moving the whole front-end down essentially. Has anyone seen it or tried it or heard anything about it? I called the guy and it's about $5k for the 4" kit.

Another lift I found is by justdifferentials.com which adds to the typical torsion bar/coil spring kit by adding upper control arms and longer shocks to add down travel. It looks pretty sweet. They have spec'd some King shocks (or bilstein's) for this application. Have you or anyone heard about, seen, tried this setup?

Thanks!

Congrats on your buy!

***I don't know of anybody who's tried one of those extreme kits. I'd have to know more about them before I could draw a conclusion.

***The other option I'd not use if the parts were given to me. The 100 doesn't need new upper arms. And using one that does not offer a sealed bushing would never be considered by me. The cost to that combo is a rip-off in my opinion. Adding a bit more droop (1") does very little and compromises CV angle as well. If you want more overal articulation then add it in the rear where it's cheap, reliable and available with up to 2"+ more travel.

There might be a better shock than OME for some people but not for many. Very hard to beat OME and OME-L.

 

[brevitything]

Okay so first I want to say: Great thread and great 100! Wow the development and testing you did was way cool. I have done some similar customizing and testing on my Jeep and my old truck. Like you, I like to research and hear what people are saying, then modify and test for myself.

Trying to summarize: I'm impressed that you did not regear, run aftermarket skids (other than bumpers and sliders), did not run UCA's, and went to 35's. These seem to be things that people say not to do, but you went ahead and trail tested and found out what worked.

I am *stunned* by what the Hundy is capable of, with what really to me seems like a moderate amount of modifications and $$$. Seeing the trails that you run, and the level of prep of the other vehicles on the trail, it's impressive. It looks like you are running trails with Jeeps on 37's and bigger.

For comparison, before I recently bought my LX470, I have been building and running a 1995 Jeep Wrangler 2.5L on the road and trail. To run 33"-plus tires on a 2.5L Wrangler reliably, I needed at least 4" of lift, 4.88 gears so the poor engine could spin the things, a Muncie transmission swap, and a *complete rear Dana 44 axle conversion* to take the strain. This setup is pretty much bulletproof, and works terrific. As you can imagine, having to replace so much of the drivetrain to be able to handle what some would call mild wheeling was very expensive (to me). I did most of the work myself but it was still a large investment. I tell my wife that it keeps me out of the bars

Compare that to a 100 series Land Cruiser. To run 33" tires, you just go bolt them on. Then hit the trail. Maybe as you demonstrated, weld on some scrap to brace the rear arms and brackets, and buy sliders or have them fabricated.

To go to 35's, just buy suspension for $1000 dollars and bolt it on. Incredible.

Anyway thanks again for the thread and showing what these vehicles can do! Oh and good score on the new arms, they look BEEF!

 

[Landbender]

OK....with my 100 being basically "completed" I continually tried to imagine what other changes could be made to improve off-road performance. One thought that kept naggin' at me was:

"OK, why do they have long-travel L-shocks for the 80-series and not for the 100?"

The answer in the front is obvious! IFS! Travel could not be improved by just adding a long shock (without wrecking something else).

"What about the rear though?" "The rear suspension is very similar in the 80" "I have L-shocks with 863 springs on my 80-series...why can't I slap them on my 100?"

The answers I got over and over to the above questions was "they don't fit". When I'd ask why I'd also get the following:

"The parts fit differently, plus it's a different truck"
"On an 80 the L-shocks were made for taller springs than the 863"
"Why do you want them?" "What will you gain?"
"Nobody is running this setup"

I would him-and-haw at the answers, though every trip out in the 100 this topic kept nagging at me. "If the 863 and N74 L-shock work so well on my 80-series, why can they not work on my 100?"

Finally, Mr. Slee had some extra time after I pushed him pretty hard to tell me "what it would take to put the L-shock on the 100 so I could try the setup out" and he came through. Here's the details:

"For John. N74L vs N101

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

John, the N74L should work by swapping some of the bushings.

Measurements:

N74L compressed vs N101 = 1" longer
N74L extended vs N101 = 2.6" longer

The bottom bushing ID is 19mm but on the N101 the width is 45mm and the N74L is 40mm. So you would need to use the N101 bottom bushing.

The top pin is 17mm on the N101 and 14mm on the N74L. The index washer lip is 26mm on the N101 and 22mm on the N74L.

So on the top you need to use the N101's washers and hardware, but you need to use the poly bushings from the N74L.

So there you go, send the check."

FINALLY....I HAD A SOLUTION! I had the parts...because I had 100 shocks. I "sent the check" and ordered a pair of N74L shocks. On they went in an hour.

We took the thing out to a very familair nearby play area we always hang at. We tried it on a hill where we always lifted wheels in the deep holes. We were SO EXCITED....the wheels swallowed the holes right up and this thing felt like it was my 80 out there. Here's my first two pics:

Slee mentioned to me that I might want to retain the 863 spring being that it was shorter than the L-shocks usually get matched up with. My 80's 863 spring/N74L shock setup was not retained and in 3-years I have never lost one. Knowing though that the 100 is a different vehicle and this experiment had not been tried yet, I took his advice and retained them. Here's the before shot and one of the retainer:

At this point our install was complete. It was quick tested. After 5 minutes we were amazed at the improvement. So how would it do on real word trails? FANTASTIC!

The following Saturday we went to Chiva Falls. It's a trail I've run with every suspension setup I've had. A better test didn't exist for me. Here's my observations from this first trip:

WOW! THIS THIS FEELS LIKE MY 80-SERIES! It flexes!

OK....what about that one really twisted spot where I used to WHEEL LIFT?

Man! The thing felt like the front compressed better. Possibly because the rear stayed up higher away from the ground due to the added droop/travel. ???

Just compare to my other picture here. Note that some of the difference in this comparison is due to the fact I had also added the rear bumper which balanced the weight, though most is from the shock change no doubt.

OK...WHAT ABOUT THE BIG N74L DEBATE ON IH8MUD?

There's been intense debate about the beneifts of this modification. It's easy to visualy confuse the travel debate in one's mind. I'll try to explain why this made such a difference ON MY 100. Before we start, everyone does agrees that the N74L shock has 2.6" more travel than the N101. Please keep that in mind.

My personal truck:
N101 shock - 2" bump stop reduction (to stop the rubbing) = N101 - 2" travel
Using N101 as "x", the equation is:
x - 2 = -2 (in other words I was down 2" travel from a "normal" N101 install)

OK....Keeping EVERYTHING THE SAME and add in 2.6" more travel that the N74L offers (down, up, whatever...it's travel).....so what is "everything the same" plus 2.6? IT'S 2.6" MORE TRAVEL THAN BEFORE! Follow me?

Now, to look at this another way (which is NOT my scenario and here's where some have targeted me incorrectly):

N101 travel = N101 travel (The typical 100-series setup)
N74L travel - 2" bumpstop reduction (my setup) = +2.6 - 2 = 0.6 increase.

In other words if you compare MY 100 setup with bumpstopped N74L's to a everyday lifter 100 with N101 and without bumpstop reduction (lots of rubbing) then my 100 only gains 0.6" over the norm which isn't much. That I agree with . The trouble is that the 35's rub too much without lowered bumpstops.

Now....the ideal travel setup....N74L and 33-inch tires! With 33's you don't need to lower your stops to eliminate rubbing, however you do need to lower them by 0.5" to protect the shock. With this outfit the math is easy. Compared to N101:

N74L adds 2.6" travel less the 0.5" for the required bump stop lowering. This nets the user an increase of 2.1" travel over the typical N101 setup. That's a great advantage! One would have to opt for this setup would they not? Yes!

BOTTOM LINE: Regardless of critics, measuments, numbers, and the like, this swap change TRANSFORMED my 100 out on the trails. It's MUCH more stable, remains level, articulates, and handles MUCH better than it did with the N101 100-shocks. There is NO WAY I would EVER go back to the N101! It takes ONE TRIP to compare the setups. Trust me...the N74L is the ONLY way to go if you have the taller spring to match (863/864 by themselves or 865/866 w'20mm trim packs atop).

I have travelled on trips with other lifted 100's. On each trip the other drivers could see that my 100 just flexed better and was more stable. I'm no physicist, but I am the owner of this fine vehicle that I've driven on so many trips and with different suspensions. It's not rocket science to tell the difference this made off the pavement. My challenge for those who are considering this shock option: Don't listen to the forum folks who have never even tried it! They are wrong. Dead wrong. There is a difference! The longer L-shock is used 24/7 on the 80-series. It works on the 100-series too!

Here's more pictures of the 100 since the N74L upgrade:

COMMENTS:

*There is no more travel to be added on the rear with 35's and an aftermarket bumper. I am at the limit now! At full compression the rear tire will just touch the Slee bumper. Any more and there'd be trouble.
*Because of the above situation you would have to lower those rear stops the 2" like I did if you run the 35" tires. If not, the tire and Slee bumper would stop progress.
*If you don't mind rubbing the 35's and wanted more travel, you could lessen the bump stop reduction though you'd not be able to have an aftermarket bumper. This scenario I have not tested....it might be OK with a stock bumper, though you might need to cut it some. I think this scenario would push you into territory where negatives come into play?

DO THIS MOD!

More N74L flex action shotts:

Hey what did you do for retaining the coils? like the clamp; what did you use? thanks

 

[paflytyer]

I have been waiting like 2 years to use this technical photo. When I was doing the L shocks, @bluecruiser sent this super tech diagram to me via text message. It was the blueprint for his very elaborate coil retention system and the basis for my own design which has held up for a very long time now. This isn't fly by night, johnny come lately stuff....... this is high tech and proven.

 

[bluecruiser]

I have been waiting like 2 years to use this technical photo. When I was doing the L shocks, @bluecruiser sent this super tech diagram to me via text message. It was the blueprint for his very elaborate coil retention system and the basis for my own design which has held up for a very long time now. This isn't fly by night, johnny come lately stuff....... this is high tech and proven.

Damn. That was a mind blowing sketch. I impress myself sometimes.

 

[Landbender]

I have been waiting like 2 years to use this technical photo. When I was doing the L shocks, @bluecruiser sent this super tech diagram to me via text message. It was the blueprint for his very elaborate coil retention system and the basis for my own design which has held up for a very long time now. This isn't fly by night, johnny come lately stuff....... this is high tech and proven.

thanks for the elaborate art and exquisite simplification

 

[cj007sd]

ShottsUZJ100. I enjoyed watching your build and coping a lot of your modifications. The one I didn't see or I missed was Skid Plates. Have you used them or are thinking of using them? If so Slee makes aluminum and steel. Which material would you choose ( I live and travel next to the ocean the majority of the time & Aluminum doesn't rust but steel is strong and heavier. Also of the three pieces that you can buy to cover the bottom from front to back maybe you would only recommend certain pieces. Interested in your opinion and advice. This question for Help goes to all members who have experience with the skid plates and your suggestions, they would all be appreciated. Thanks. CJ

 

[DSRTRDR]

Shotts isn't on here very much anymore "last seen in 2013", so I wouldn't expect an answer anytime soon

 

[fengler]

wow, this is an amazing thread - makes me want to push my 100 even harder.

 

[inkpot]

wow, this is an amazing thread - makes me want to push my 100 even harder.

Push it hard enough and you can be privileged to replace the rack&pinion steering about every 20-25000 miles like Mr Shotts.

 

[nzfjz100]

Hi Shotts or anyone else who can answer:
I've just started modifying my 100 series first up I've installed an EFS lift (2"), springs +150kg, torsions, shocks (XTR), diff drop. I was soo keen to get it in I forgot to take before measurements and even photos! I did how ever work out all the necessary measurements for the front.
I want to know of other guys 100's the measurement they have (if running factory 16" wheels and no body lift) between the bottom of the rim to the fender (guard edge). Especially on Shotts 100 if you've fitted 35"s. Layonn might also be able to help me here.

Thanks

 

[fengler]

Push it hard enough and you can be privileged to replace the rack&pinion steering about every 20-25000 miles like Mr Shotts.

I have zero problems with that

 

[DSRTRDR]

. . . . Especially on Shotts 100 if you've fitted 35"s. Layonn might also be able to help me here.

Thanks

neither Shotts nor Layonn are much on MUD anymore, so don't expect an answer from them

 

[artwerks]

My steering rack is starting to go. I may have to replace it in the next couple of years. I wheel it hard and have to get about two alignments/year - One during the summer, one after the summer of beatings is over.
I was going to give you my bottom-of-rim-to-fender measurements, but I don't think they'd help, because I'm using the 2.5" OME/SLEE heavy lift and 18" stock wheels (tire size doesn't matter for this measurement).

Aj

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

Shotts was banned from MUD a couple years ago

 

[nzfjz100]

My steering rack is starting to go. I may have to replace it in the next couple of years. I wheel it hard and have to get about two alignments/year - One during the summer, one after the summer of beatings is over.
I was going to give you my bottom-of-rim-to-fender measurements, but I don't think they'd help, because I'm using the 2.5" OME/SLEE heavy lift and 18" stock wheels (tire size doesn't matter for this measurement).

Aj

You could measure from hub centre to wheel fender then? I ordered a 2" lift with 150kg rear springs so the rear went up approx. 3" and the front ive wound up until ive got 55mm of droop, just interested to see where other trucks are sitting.

Thanks

 

[devildogcruiser25]

Wondering why aftermarket UCA's were poo pooed so badly in this build? From what I have read they are a very common/valuable upgrade nowadays.

 

[DSRTRDR]

this forum has officially been dead for a while - it's very likely that nobody will respond to your tech questions

 

[devildogcruiser25]

this forum has officially been dead for a while - it's very likely that nobody will respond to your tech questions

Thanks. Got linked here from another site and wasn't sure if it was active. Guess I'll post in the 100 series section

 

[BMX and CRUISERS]

ShottsUZJ100. I enjoyed watching your build and coping a lot of your modifications. The one I didn't see or I missed was Skid Plates. Have you used them or are thinking of using them? If so Slee makes aluminum and steel. Which material would you choose ( I live and travel next to the ocean the majority of the time & Aluminum doesn't rust but steel is strong and heavier. Also of the three pieces that you can buy to cover the bottom from front to back maybe you would only recommend certain pieces. Interested in your opinion and advice. This question for Help goes to all members who have experience with the skid plates and your suggestions, they would all be appreciated. Thanks. CJ

I've survived without them C.J. Those Slee skids look amazing. They also look heavy which is the main reason I passed.