Easy hack for Active TRAC (2 Viewers)

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Joined
Mar 15, 2006
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Location
Albuquerque, NM
Looking at the wiring diagram for the 2007 FJC it looks like A-TRAC can be used with the rear locker engaged by disconnecting the signal wire betwen the Transfer Indicator Switch on the rear differential and the Skid Control ECU. There is a possiblility that it could set a code C1248 (open circuit in rear differential lock) in the VSC system but the DTC detecting condition seems unlikely in normal 4-wheling situations: "At vehicle speed of 31mph or more, 3 seconds elapse after rear differential changes from free to lock".


I don't have one of these FJ Cruisers (yet), does somebody want to try this hack on their own? The easiest place to disconnect this circuit looks to be at connector LA2, pin 11 in the left kick panel. It will be a light blue/yellow wire. If this hack works like I hope it will, the ABS and VSC OFF warning lights won't illuminate when the rear diff lock is turned on and the slip indicator light will only blink when the A-TRAC system is controlling wheelspin.



5/19/2006

An update with corrected information on the A-TRAC+rear locker hack. Disregard the wiring instructions above and use the update below.

I incorrectly assumed the Skid Control ECU supplied the signal voltage to the diff lock position switch, and then to ground. The signal voltage actually comes through the rear diff lock indicator LED in the combination meter, reaching ground at the diff lock position switch. The Skid Control ECU simply reads the 12v or 0v signal. No reference voltage is supplied by the Skid ECU to the light blue/yellow wire.

There are several ways of making this work, the key is to disconnect the Skid Control ECU from the rear diff indicator LED/switch circuit and supply battery voltage to the Skid Control ECU at connector A5, pin 1 when the ignition is on.

A possible way of making this work is to disconnect the light blue/yellow wire at connector LA2 and put a jumper wire at the Skid Control ECU (master cylinder and pump) between connector A4, pin 26 (light blue/yellow wire) and Connector A5, pin 1 (black/orange wire) to supply the 12v signal with the key on.
 
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wow..sounds like you know what you're talking about. So I'll ask you this:

WHY does toyota insist on all these traction control goodies being only operable in 4lo?

Took me a little while to figure out why the locker in my tacoma wasnt working:doh:

But then you can buy a tacoma pre-runner with a locker.....and no 4lo.

I realize theres some links up for re-wiring the switch, but I'd like to understand toyotas reasoning for it.
 
Enigma said:
wow..sounds like you know what you're talking about. So I'll ask you this:

WHY does toyota insist on all these traction control goodies being only operable in 4lo?
Took me a little while to figure out why the locker in my tacoma wasnt working:doh:
There are 2 ways a wheeled vehicle gets down the trail: momentum and traction. You have to keep in mind that really don't need the extra traction unless you are in a situation where you need 4low already. On the FJ Cruiser you have the following traction aids avaliable at higher speeds:

High range 2wd (or AWD): TRAC and VSC
High range 4WD: TRAC & 4WD
Low range 4WD: 4WD and your choice of A-TRAC or rear locker is available

I can only think of one reason why anyone would need a locker on a 2WD vehicle...
But then you can buy a tacoma pre-runner with a locker.....and no 4lo.

I realize theres some links up for re-wiring the switch, but I'd like to understand toyotas reasoning for it.
Supposedly Toyota made that combination available as a (slightly) more fuel-efficient option for people towing boats. The extra traction comes in handy when pulling a boat up a wet ramp.

I understand wanting to get your money's worth out of your e-locker but I can't think of any situation where you would be traveling more than 10mph and needing a locked axle.
 
This is not an experiment I would try.
Engage the locker, and apply brakes to one side?
I can hear axle shafts snapping from here.


By all means, try it on your truck tho, and report back;)
 
Chef said:
This is not an experiment I would try.
Engage the locker, and apply brakes to one side?
I can hear axle shafts snapping from here.


By all means, try it on your truck tho, and report back;)
ATRAC applies the brakes to a slipping tire. The rear tires won't be the ones slipping with the center and rear diffs locked.
 
But.....

Alex H said:
ATRAC applies the brakes to a slipping tire. The rear tires won't be the ones slipping with the center and rear diffs locked.

I've retyped my post about 4 times, and right before I hit submit, I think of something else that dubunks my theory. I'm just trying to think of every possible scenario (before) I hit both switches and press down on the accelerator while there is a heavy load on 2 or 3 of the wheels. I don't want to hear a really loud pop unless it's a Toyota flaw...It's ok If it was me pushing it too hard, but not if I enabled something that Toyota figured out while testing (snapped axle, gear teeth, etc) and decided to put a dummy switch in to keep us from activating them together.

Anyway - I'll just think out loud for a minute and listen to everyone's feedback and experiences.

A-TRAC detects wheel slip and "brakes" the wheel that don't have traction, while transferring torque to the wheel that does...or hopefully does.


RR Diff Lock - Lock the rear diff (I assume) like any other locker. Both wheels are forced to spin together. I agree that the A-TRAC "should not" cause the A-TRAC to "brake" a wheel on the rear diff while RR-Dif is engaged. I can't see a case where this would happen.

But i'm still thinking and I'd like to hear a little more about other possible scenarios of Locking the Rear Diff and Engaging the ABS to one wheel (A-TRAC) while the other 3 are under stress.

So far, I see no problems with it and think it may work.

:confused:
 
didn't the team that ran the rubicon with the FJs use ATRAC and the locker simultaneously?

there were no reports of breakage from them...
 
How would this scenario play out?

FJC in a gravel bed (river bed, sand,etc...) going up against and trying to get over a rock. The rear wheels are in the gravel/sand (not really slipping, but spinning) and the front passenger wheel is up against and going over the rock. The front drivers-side wheel is spinning and the A-TRAC kicks in.

Is the ABS software (system computer) aware that the all-3 wheels (front drivers and both rear) might be spinning at the same rate of speed ?

I'm sure the A-TRAC will sense this and brake the front left, but what about the other 2 wheels in the rear that are also spinning at the same RPM in the gravel ? Does it try to ABS-brake them as well ?

How does the A-TRAC know FOR SURE that this scenario does not apply and there is no need to apply the brakes to the rear wheels ?

for the A-TRAC system to totally ignore (both) rear-wheels I think that there would have to be 2 separate A-TRAC systems; one monitoring the front wheels and one monitoring the rear wheels.

Front A-TRAC - ignores rear wheel slippage
Rear A-TRAC - ignores front sheel slippage

Confsed yet ?

I am.

My point: There is only one A-TRAC system monitoring all 4 wheels for slippage, and if the front left was slipping along with both rear (locked and in sync); Does the A-TRAC know not to get involved with the rear ?
Does A-TRAC only work on the front wheels ?

Is this why they put an (Either / Or) switch in line with A-TRAC and RR Diff lock ? Just curious and open for feedback ?
 
garrett1478 said:
didn't the team that ran the rubicon with the FJs use ATRAC and the locker simultaneously?

there were no reports of breakage from them...

Maybe, and I'm not against testing it on a trail rig; The cost of a new axle is not what I'm worried about, it's the fact that I'd be buying a new axle for my "Future Ex-Wife's" new FJC that I only got to drive for 2 weeks :eek:

Just kidding of course. I'd like to see if they did use both, I'm all about learning.

After reading the FJC-Rubicon story (read below), it's not clear if they actually activated both of them at the same time or he was commenting that there was no obstacle that the FJC could not conquer with either the A-TRAC or Diff Lock.

----copied from the FJC Rubicon article on fron page of IH8MUD.COM----
The rear locker in combination with the traction
control and real transfer case made the FJ easier to drive, and more capable when it came
to overcoming tough rocks, climbs, steps and muddy sections with ease.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
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check this out

4WD Toyota Owner Magazine said:
It's one or the other with the FJ Cruiser. However, the FJ that Joe Bacal was driving on the Con had been "tweaked" by Toyota--it COULD use both at the same time! So it is possible--now someone needs to figure out the secret!

From the FJ tech manual:

B20N type locking rear differential
a. Electric actuated locking mechanism
b. Driver-actuated via dash-mounted switch
c. Operation speed of 5mph or less
d. When locked-- will prevent A-TRAC operation.

Dave

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showpost.php?p=878503&postcount=22

oooh yeah. :bounce:
 
It would be interesting to see if they just went with it by disconnecting the wire between the rear diff sensor (detects that txfer case is in 4LowLock) and the Skid Control unit (would be nice if this were the case), or if they separated the A-TRAC into 2 different units (front and rear).....or (even better) if they had a mod that (when activated), would allow A-TRAC to be active on all 4 wheels until the driver decided that they wanted the Rear Dff Locked. If the A-TRAC is active and RR-Diff Lock is activated, A-TRAC (skid control) would bypass the rear diff and only control the front Wheels.
 
garrett1478 said:
didn't the team that ran the rubicon with the FJs use ATRAC and the locker simultaneously?

there were no reports of breakage from them...

correct, they wired it to use both.
 
What I understand about A-TRAC is that it simulates an LSD, and an LSD checks wether a wheel is slipping or not based on the torque it is getting( a lot more complicated but that's the bottom line) so if the rear is locked then the wheels get or atleast they're suposed to get 50-50 torque split (which in practice rarely happens but atleast the engine/computer thinks it does, there's a huge thread in www.fjcruiserforums.com about this go check it out) . So if the computer/engine thinks it's getting 50/50 torque then A-TRAC should never even bother to apply brakes to the rear wheels?

Just putting this out there. obviously a lot more research is needed before attempting this but I definite see it working..

another crazy idea would be to sort of fool the rear A-TRAC sensors(which I believe are different from the ABS ones or at least more accurate) with some sort of electric signal.. but this is way out of my league, so I'll leave it up to you guys to take this idea further if you'd like to.

my 2 cents
 
Alex H said:
Looking at the wiring diagram for the 2007 FJC it looks like A-TRAC can be used with the rear locker engaged by disconnecting the signal wire betwen the Transfer Indicator Switch on the rear differential and the Skid Control ECU. There is a possiblility that it could set a code C1248 (open circuit in rear differential lock) in the VSC system but the DTC detecting condition seems unlikely in normal 4-wheling situations: "At vehicle speed of 31mph or more, 3 seconds elapse after rear differential changes from free to lock".
:zilla:

Alex -
Thanks for your insight and help so far.....I have a few questions:

1.) Is the C1248 code related to the "dynamic" rear proportioning function (ABS solenoids that are used to reduce pressure to the rear brakes) ?

2.) Will the code clear itself when the sensor is reconnected and/or the engine is restarted ?

My thoughts would be to switch (disconnect the signal wire) it whenever doing heavy off roading and switching back in when on normal terrain / driving faster speeds.
Thanks
 
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Mike:
1.)No. It is for checking the rear diff lock position switch, which cancels A-TRAC when the rear diff lock is engaged. Like I said originally, the detecting conditions seem really unlikely, but we won't know until someone tests the hack out on an actual vehicle.

2.)No. You can clear it with a scan tool or with a jumper wire at DLC3- the diagnostic connector under the driver's side of the dash. Disconnecting the battery won't clear it. The jumper wire procedure follows:

Ignition key off.
Locate the 16 pin DLC3 under the left side of the dashboard.
It has 2 rows of 8 terminals, one above the other.
With a jumper wire, connect terminals TC and CG of DLC3.
CG is the 4th pin from the left, top row.
TC is the 5th pin from the left, bottom row.
Turn key on.
Press the brake pedal 8 times or more within 5 seconds.
Verify that the ABS and VSC/TRAC warning lights flash on-off at .25 second intervals.

My thoughts on it... As long as you leave the locker unlocked at speeds above 30mph it should not set a code. This is only my theory until someone can actually try this.
 
Alex H said:
Mike:
1.)No. It is for checking the rear diff lock position switch, which cancels A-TRAC when the rear diff lock is engaged. Like I said originally, the detecting conditions seem really unlikely, but we won't know until someone tests the hack out on an actual vehicle.

2.)No. You can clear it with a scan tool or with a jumper wire at DLC3- the diagnostic connector under the driver's side of the dash. Disconnecting the battery won't clear it. The jumper wire procedure follows:

Ignition key off.
Locate the 16 pin DLC3 under the left side of the dashboard.
It has 2 rows of 8 terminals, one above the other.
With a jumper wire, connect terminals TC and CG of DLC3.
CG is the 4th pin from the left, top row.
TC is the 5th pin from the left, bottom row.
Turn key on.
Press the brake pedal 8 times or more within 5 seconds.
Verify that the ABS and VSC/TRAC warning lights flash on-off at .25 second intervals.

My thoughts on it... As long as you leave the locker unlocked at speeds above 30mph it should not set a code. This is only my theory until someone can actually try this.

You're knowledge is indespensible - I'll give it a try
Thanks :cheers: :beer:
 
Alex H said:
Mike:
Clear it with a scan tool or with a jumper wire at DLC3

Ignition key off.
Locate the 16 pin DLC3 under the left side of the dashboard.
It has 2 rows of 8 terminals, one above the other.
With a jumper wire, connect terminals TC and CG of DLC3.
CG is the 4th pin from the left, top row.
TC is the 5th pin from the left, bottom row.
Turn key on.
Press the brake pedal 8 times or more within 5 seconds.
Verify that the ABS and VSC/TRAC warning lights flash on-off at .25 second intervals.

You must not be the same "Alex" that works at Whataburger :D
 
Enigma said:
WHY does toyota insist on all these traction control goodies being only operable in 4lo?

The average college chick / yuppy-in-the-making driving one (all present company EXCLUDED!) will never use 4-LO. Locking the rear up accidentally / just to see what the switch does could cause loss of vehicle control if used at the wrong speed in 4HI/Normal, so they make sure you're only using the traction goodies if you are in 4LO. Same reason you cannot lock the center diff in a stock FZJ80 without the center diff switch.
 
I don't have a copy of the wiring diagram and need to know where the connector "LA2" is located.

Is it the second big blue connector from the (bottom or top) in side the left kick panel ?

Thanks
 
Alex, your knowledge truely amazes me. Wheres it coming from?

And did you realize, "Easy Hack for Active TRAC" rhymes?

Anyway, keep up the R&D, maybe a FJC can be a great 4x4 with no hard-mods!
 

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