Advice please! (1 Viewer)

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

H

Hi Trek

Joined
Jul 13, 2005
Threads
11
Messages
26
Location
Bay Area, CA
Well, I took my '01 LC (90K miles) in to diagnose why I am getting a CEL light and they told me that the code is indicating that there is a malfunction in the 'magnetic clutch' inside the fuel throttle body. They are quoting me $970 for the part and $450 in labor to replace it. Does this sound right? Is this something I can fix myself (clean the body, etc.)? How hard is it to replace?

Also, I had them check for an exhaust 'ticking' noise and they're telling me that the left side exhaust manifold has a crack and needs to be replaced. Cost? $300 for the part and $1300 in labor to replace it. Again, is this something I should fix? Can I do it myself? I searched through past posts and it sounds like a very hard job.

I'm beside myself; $3,000 in potential repair costs and that's on top of the $1,100 I just spent on the 90K service. :crybaby:

Advice anyone?

Thanks in advance...

HT
 
no panic!
I don't know about these specific parts.
However,
Zeroth: get an FSM if you plan on keeping the rig for a while
First, you can always get parts way cheaper through CDan.
Second, you can't always assume that what the dealer tells you is correct / necessary..
Third, just about anything you can do yourself if you're motivated enough.
Fourth, any warranty still available? Or check the TSBs.
 
give a search for "exhaust manifold" and look at some of the other posts and information. lots of
good ideas and lots of people with the same issue.

tonight i'm going to be going over my rig checking for this as i've noticed a small ticking
but haven't done much diag
 
My 01 LC had the same ticking noise a year ago at ~85k miles. The dealer diagnosed it as a warped passenger side exhaust manifold. I've also heard 4.7 manifolds have a tendancy to crack as well. I leaned on my dealer's consumer rep & we ended up with a 3-way split with mother Toyota of the $860 total cost. (Afterward, they wouldn't show me the old part or talk about it, which I thought rather odd.)
The only risk of not getting it fixed according to Toyota is that air can supposedly leak in and foul the O2 sensor, resulting in false readings to the computer - although I wonder how that can be if the manifold is always pressurized????
 
ecocruiser said:
My 01 LC had the same ticking noise a year ago at ~85k miles. The dealer diagnosed it as a warped passenger side exhaust manifold. I've also heard 4.7 manifolds have a tendancy to crack as well. I leaned on my dealer's consumer rep & we ended up with a 3-way split with mother Toyota of the $860 total cost. (Afterward, they wouldn't show me the old part or talk about it, which I thought rather odd.)
The only risk of not getting it fixed according to Toyota is that air can supposedly leak in and foul the O2 sensor, resulting in false readings to the computer - although I wonder how that can be if the manifold is always pressurized????
Click to expand...

There is a low pressure area behind exhuast exhuast pulses. This pulse helps the cylinder evacuate exhuast gasses. This is called scavenging. Say this exhuast pulse travels over a crack with the same low pressure area on the back side of it. It's going to pull in a small amount of outside air.

Ya know.. I wonder if for that reason, we could claim these failures as emissions related. It would throw off the o2 sensor and create an artificially lean condition which the ECU would see and richen the mixutre. This would cause higher levels of HC.
 
aljordan said:
There is a low pressure area behind exhuast exhuast pulses. This pulse helps the cylinder evacuate exhuast gasses. This is called scavenging. Say this exhuast pulse travels over a crack with the same low pressure area on the back side of it. It's going to pull in a small amount of outside air.

Ya know.. I wonder if for that reason, we could claim these failures as emissions related. It would throw off the o2 sensor and create an artificially lean condition which the ECU would see and richen the mixutre. This would cause higher levels of HC.
Click to expand...

If it is, indeed, the cause of emissions failure, shouldn't it covered by federal law (like a cat converter failing before 100K mi)?
 
Get a quote for the install of the exhaust manifold at the local muffler shop. Buy the part online or from C-Dan for around $200.

Do you know a part number or exact description of the other part that is failing?
 
"(Afterward, they wouldn't show me the old part or talk about it, which I thought rather odd.)"

In CA, this would be illegal. They have to give you your parts back.
 
In NC when my front diff blew up and they fixed it under the powertrain warranty, I asked for the part back and they said if it is fixed under warranty they legally do not have to give you the part back.

Maybe they used the same logic since some of it was covered under warranty.

uzj100
 
calamaridog said:
Get a quote for the install of the exhaust manifold at the local muffler shop. Buy the part online or from C-Dan for around $200.

Do you know a part number or exact description of the other part that is failing?
Click to expand...

Thanks, will do for comparison.

The CEL code generated was 'P1126' --> Magnetic clutch. Advisor didn't give me a part number but said that the whole throttle body would need to be replaced and then after that they would recheck the codes. He quoted me $970.00 for the part alone which I think is pretty high considering I put a high-performance aftermarket throttle body on a Boxster S I used to own and it was only $479.00.

Also, I don't have another LC for comparison, but I feel a slight vibration from the engine all the way through the steering wheel at idle which they dealer says is probably due to the magnetic clutch since that item regulates the air/fuel mixture. Is a slight vibration normal?

Thanks again for the input.

HT

Does anyone else feel a slight vibration from the engine at idle
 
Come to think of it, I recall a few posters on the Lexus forum who said they had to replace their TB's on their LX470's, too. Wonder if this is becoming another common problem w/ the 100 that appears at 100K miles? (along w/ the cracking exhaust manifolds, starter contacts, throttle position sensors, and lesser extent, electric brake booster pump) Makes me wonder if the 4Runner V8's will also show the same problems at similar mileage (and if they do, if the repair bills are just as expensive).
 
Sorry to tell you but the throttle body is going to run you about $750. Screw those dealer prices on the install though. Ask for a recomedation for a mechanic in your area perhaps?

...

I've been looking at the FSM and it says replace the Throttle Control Motor, it doesn't say replace the whole damn throttle body. I tried to look up the part but I'm not sure if it is sold separately or not. PM Parts Dan and see if you can get the Throttle Control Motor separately.

So this slight vibration thing, how bad is it? Every vehicle I've ever owned has a "slight vibration". Does the motor run fine otherwise? I'm not buying this. If the throttle motor is failed then your driveability should suck and the truck should run like crap. Vibrations can be caused by all sorts of things, heck, even broken/damaged motor mounts can cause vibrations. What about the rpms? Does the motor idle fine?

p1126:

Open or short in magnetic clutch curcuit
Magnetic clutch (inside the throttle control motor I think)
ECM

They should be running diagnostics on the curcuit and tcm before replacing anything to rule out the ECM being bad, not just replace the throttle body and HOPE that it works. And the damn magnetic clutch thingy does not regulate the air/fuel mixture unless I'm missing the boat here completely.

BTW, $1100 for the 90k service? What the hell did they do?
 
Thanks for the reply;

calamaridog said:
BTW, $1100 for the 90k service? What the hell did they do?
Click to expand...

Heh, heh. There's an earlier post of mine titled '90K Service Costs' which detailed a bunch of work I had done parts and labor including the plugs, timing belt, water pump, tensioners, pulleys, flushes/fluids, etc., etc... Quite a bit of work all in all, and I had hoped it would have my LC back running in tip-top shape. Actually, it's running beautifully right now; the CEL light only comes on at random moments and only when the vehicle is cold, never when it's warmed up. As for the ticking sound, it doesn't really bother me except when I start thinking that it may lead to something more serious.

As a side note, whenever I buy used vehicles, I always perform whatever maintenance is needed to bring them up to date. I've always looked upon Toyota (and Lexus) as being the epitome of automotive engineering excellence so I have high expectations from their vehicles. I guess I'm a little surprised that these two particular seemingly minor annoyances have such a high price tags attached to them and I'm disappointed my PPI didn't reveal them prior to my purchase.

It adds a little salt to the wound when I read that other people have experienced the similar types of problems indicating that there may be some design flaws or product weaknesses, that in my opinion, Toyota should acknowledge and fix either free of charge, or at some reduced cost to their customers.

I also acknowledge that most vehicles have their own unique set of 'quirks' that most owners grudgingly fix themselves, pay someone else to fix, or simply put up with.

However, it's irritating nonetheless. I'll definitely look into any and all suggestions posted here on the board.

Cheers,

HT
 
Some here have suggested "Brazing" the cracked manifold at a exaust shop but I don't know if that will work. The Toyota FSM details removing the entire intake manifold and cylinder heads to R&R the manifold. This is probably why the dealer estimate seams soo high. I doubt that is really necessary.
 
I had my LC throw a code . The crooked dealer tried to say I needed a whole new throttle body for $1300. The code was for the TPS not the motor clutch. My guess is this is a common ruse the dealers use to pad their wallets. Looking for big ticket parts to replace. A lot easier than earning it the legit way. The vehicle ran fine by the way and is still running fine three months later WITHOUT the repair. While these vehicles are very reliable for the first 4-5 years, they seem to have a lot of expensive issues crop up afterwards. A lot of this expense is due to poor design in my opinion as relatively minor issues cost big bucks to repair thanks to the failing parts being very hard to access.
I don't know if other Toyota models have these type problems, but I for one didn't expect them when I bought a Toyota and thats why I'm getting rid of my Land Cruiser. The rather fragile electrical system, cracked manifolds, $1500 master cylinders, and quite a few rattles and creaks from a 65k mile vehicle leaves me unimpressed with Toyota. That and the Hideous network of crooked dealers. Years of having a good product that sells itself has corrupted Toyota dealers and made them all too willing to screw their own customers for every extra nickel they can squeeze.
I have yet to talk to anyone I know who likes the dealers. The vehicles yes, dealers no.
Anyone can make a vehicle reliable for the first 4 years or so. Its how they do in the long run that I judge them by. I've had more problems in the first 4 months of owning a LC than every other vehicle I've owned combined. And I've owned probably 25 or more for over 25 years. I probably just got a lemon, but from reading other posts on this forum, I think a lot of Toyotas reputation is just hype and they are resting on their laurels. V6 sludge problems, blown head gaskets, etc, " Oh what a feeling!"
 
I've been following this forum for a couple of years (and before that, mostly the 80 forum) and noticed that back then, there were virtually no problems w/ 100's, and that discussions have mostly centered around mod's, equipment, etc. Once vehicles start approaching that 100K mi point, it seems their quirks start to appear. With the 80's, it seems blown HG's, the PHH, and clicking birfields are the main culprits (and 2 of the 3 are costly to replace/repair). At least they are not electronic. It's scary how virtually all cars these days are so sophisticated electronically, yet a small failure can cause an otherwise reliable vehicle to fail. Toyota still does build extremely reliable vehicles, but the "legendary" reliability is really found on vehicles sold to developing countries (e.g., LC 105, hilux pickup). Those have simpler, underpowered engines, manual everything (transmission, windows, seats), no fancy electronic gadgets. Toyota knows that people in those countries not only can't afford to fix electronics, but they also tend to keep their vehicles for 30+ yrs while customers in North America can afford to buy a new vehicle every 5 yrs and are willing to pay for dvd players and leather seats. Back in the 1980's, we also were able to buy those same basic vehicles (remember the $4995 4-cyl mini pickups w/ 22r & diesel engines & 4spd manual trannies?). Unfortunately, no longer...toyota is resting on its past laurels. Despite the extra build tightness of the LC 100, will it outlast say, a Camry, 4runner, or Taco? All rely on complicated electronics.
 
Last edited:
Well said Jim. Electronics are the achilles heel of all modern vehicles. I truly wish automakers would make good quality yet simpler vehicles. Like a Land cruiser without all the bells and whistles. Even part time 4WD. Just give me a tough no nonsense vehicle that will stand up to bad roads as well as my three brats. Instead they keep pushing the envelope( because Americans buy it I guess) of technology and cars never really get more reliable, just more sophisticated. I'd gladly make do with less luxury and more reliability. You can't buy a cheap full size SUV anymore. They're all so loaded with electronic crap, sunroofs, leather seats, and other stuff we really don't need. The only cheap vehicles are puny. And size actually has very little to do with the manufacturing costs. The extra steel and plastic involved isnt' that much. Its the constant development costs to keep adding do-dads that drives the cost way up. Of course, I know, they are going to do what is most profitable and thats the American way. But I really think an automaker could hit paydirt making a simple, large SUV for around $20,000. They'd clean up.
 
Perhaps something like an FJ Cruiser but bigger?
 
Let's keep in mind that we mostly hear about the problems in a forum like this. With respect to the 100 being more or less robust than the 80, let's keep in mind that the rest of the world gets the utilitarian cruiser without all the electronic crap that the US market demands. In general, I think electronics make products more reliable, but the trade-off is when a circuit goes sideways, you may really be in a jam. I also think a lot dials back to luck. I've got 120,000 miles on this truck ('98) and my alternator is still fine. I'm sure you'll find people that have alternators go sideways at 40,000 for no quantifiable reason. It sounds to me that rule303's truck is just a troublesome truck. Maybe the previous owner beat the crap out of it. Maybe it's bad karma....I don't know, but I think you'll find most land cruiser guys have had less trouble from LC's than other vehicles and hence the reputation.
 
the general consensus out there appears to be that solid-state electronics are somewhat prone to early failure (likely showing manufacture defects) but after that are probably more reliable than mechanical systems in the long run... unfortunately, of course, if it's a serious piece of equipment (e.g. ECU), a failure could be very costly since they can't be fixed piecewise usually...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

100d ua
Road Trip Prep & Advice (Yosemite)
2
Replies
25
Views
1K
Live to Ski
Live to Ski
Foehammer
Need some Advice...suspension cost
Replies
14
Views
720
Land Shark
Land Shark
R
Help please - full A/T malfunction
Replies
3
Views
397
bigredmachine
bigredmachine
cpainter
Radiator advice needed
Replies
10
Views
2K
Wilsil
Wilsil

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)

Share this page

Back
Top Bottom