Finish restoration question (1 Viewer)

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TrickyT

Hate that mud...
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I'm a relative newbie when it comes to finish restoration. But I've got a paint problem on my 1997 FZJ80 I'd like to fix. Here's what I'm talking about:

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I tried to do something about the hood this past weekend. I used a clay bar over the whole hood and it did a great job of removing contaminants from the surface, making for a pretty silky smooth surface. Then I applied a synthetic wax. The parts of the hood where the finish is in good shape came out great, but the gray pock marks look about the same as before.

What exactly is the problem here and, more importantly, can I do anything about it short of repainting? I have a random orbit polisher (Porter Cable 7424XP) and a variety of pads, but not sure how to proceed. Are these places where I should use one of the Meguiar cleaning compounds, like M105 or M205? Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks!
 
What you are seeing is the clear coat delaminating or separating from the base, coloured coat of paint. I would suspect that the only proper cure is repaiinting, which is what my HDJ80 has had done, but, being a detailer and keeping such things, I would give a rotary polisher a shot (or an orbital if you've already got one - this is probably not worth buying a new machine for) with a decent compound ( I like Simoniz stuff, but to each their own) and see what happens. Be warned, this may not improve the appearance, and could quite possibly make it look worse. Perhaps don't practice on the bonnet, maybe a less conspicuous area.
 
I was afraid it was the clear coat going bad. Seems to happen a lot on 80-series.
 
Yeah, seems to be common. Mine has had the roof and bonnet resprayed at some time in its life, which according to the PO, was for this reason.
 
Well after staring at my computer screen for 12+ hours I can say I found a lot of good info on the internet about clear coat issues -- you can literally spend days reading or watching videos on the subject. But I think @AussieHJCruza is spot on the money. There's really not much that can be done short of re-painting. The FZJ80 is finished with a two coat paint system, base coat and clear coat, and for whatever reason the clear coat has failed and the underlying "dull" base coat, even thought though it's "metallic", is all that remains. From what I read the proper way to repair this is to sand the complete panel's surface (e.g., the whole hood/bonnet), feather-edging the failing clear coat if possible, and then apply new coats of clear coat. Then as long as the underlying base coat has not also been damaged the shine of the finish will be restored. But doing this requires a paint booth (or at least an enclosed garage) and spray painting equipment. So the project is quickly growing out of my hobbyist hands. :(

If someone thinks I've got this all wrong please do speak up!
 
Here is how I would go about repairing the hood:

Remove the hood, set it up outside on saw horses, and wet-sand it. I'd sand the whole hood in 3 stages: 1000 grit, 1500 grit, and 2000 grit. use a garden hose, and let the water trickle over the hood constantly while you sand. Keep a bucket of water with a couple drops of dish soap to dunk your paper in every once in a while. The soap helps slow the speed at which your sand paper cuts the paint. You want to restore the finish, not remove it.

With the 1000 grit, feather the edges of the clear coat that is flaking off to expose fresh paint and scuff the whole hood. With the finer papers, remove the oxidized paint where the clear coat is failing (don't sand too deep). Stop when the hood looks absolutely beautiful. When you are done sanding, clean it thoroughly with dish soap and water, then let it dry thoroughly.

After it is completely dry, you can move the hood inside, where you will apply new clear coat. Don't worry, urethane clear coat is available in aerosol cans if you don't have painting equipment. Prep is key. Clean the space where you are going to spray the clear coat. Sweep, vacuum, dust the walls, and repeat until you can't find any dust. Hang up any extra lights you can find above the work space. Set up your hood on saw horses in the now-clean garage space that you are going to be painting.

Thoroughly wipe off the hood with an acetone-soaked rag, allow to dry, and apply your clear coat carefully and evenly. Your best results will probably come from using two cans of clear coat. Apply a very light coat (almost like it didn't get complete coverage). After five minutes to get tacky, apply another light coat, but this time with full coverage. As you apply this coat, it is important that you paint in straight lines across the hood and keep a "wet line" of urethane so there aren't stripes in your final finish. If you want/need to add another coat of clear, wait for the recoat time as designated on the label of whatever product you buy before applying the second coat.

Let everything dry for at least a day before touching anything. If you have any blemishes or runs in the new clear coat, it can be wet sanded again. Anything you sand will need to be polished.

In the end, You'll spend $50-70 and have a hood that looks anywhere between "better than it was" to "looks pro" depending on your technique and on your obsessiveness for perfection. People like to say that you absolutely need the same set-up that the pros use to get good results. You don't need all that stuff, as long as you are diligent about cleanliness and willing to apply a little extra time.

I bet you even have some clear left over for the little repair needed on the rear quarter, but that requires blending, which is another skill that you will need to spend another 3 hours learning about on Youtube.

Good luck and have fun!
 
@Heirloom, this is extremely helpful. Thanks! I have a HVLP sprayer and a homebuild paint "booth" (I use the word loosely) that I've used to apply water-based urethane finishes to wood working projects. The gun is similar to those used for auto body work, except the cup is below the the nozzle and fed by pressure from the gun instead of being gravity feed from above. But I'm thinking this sprayer would work well for the hood project.
 
@Heirloom, this is extremely helpful. Thanks! I have a HVLP sprayer and a homebuild paint "booth" (I use the word loosely) that I've used to apply water-based urethane finishes to wood working projects. The gun is similar to those used for auto body work, except the cup is below the the nozzle and fed by pressure from the gun instead of being gravity feed from above. But I'm thinking this sprayer would work well for the hood project.

I do not have any experience with siphon sprayers like yours, however most HVLP guns use a 1.2mm tip or a 1.0mm tip for shooting clear. I would not shoot clear with a tip larger than 1.4mm, personally. Regardless, automotive finish stores will give you a spec sheet for the product you choose that has mix ratios and suggestions about gun settings for HVLP. The mix ratios for clear usually result in a very thin mix.

Like most things, I would assume there is a tutorial on Youtube about how to spray clear using a gun like yours. I'm very interested in knowing what gun settings you used and how this project turns out, so keep this thread updated.
 
The tip on my gun is 1.3mm. There's a smaller tip set available, but it's 0.8mm. So I think I'll try the tip I have. I'm also going to ask around at local body shops to see if they have any discarded body panels that I could use to practice on before doing my hood. But it's going to be a while before I get to this due to upcoming travel and other pressing projects. Regardless, I will report back on how things work out. Thanks again for the great advice!
 
I wouldn't listen to any of the info given in this thread! The clear coat has failed. You must sand it smooth, prime, repaint, and reclear. In the spots next to the squirters and the spot on the quarter panel the clear is gone and the base is open. Usually when this happens the base starts to create a problem called checking. It creates very small cracks that if painted over will just show like a sore thumb. The only way to solve that issue is to sand it smooth, primer and repaint.
Here is what checking looks like after a repaint.
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1440131317.502478.jpg


Painting on top of anything finer than 800grit will result in a delamination problem. That's where the newly applied paint will flake or peel off. It's usually ok until it gets hit with a pressure washer or a rock chip happens. Then all that time and money are out the window.
This is an example of delamination where it was not properly sanded before the paint was applied.
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1440131727.168652.jpg


If your using an HVLP gun than you want a 1.3 tip or a 1.4 tip. 1.0 is too small and will cause orange peel if used with a decent clear. Some of the cheap lower quality cleats are very thin and may spray out of a 1.0 with a small amount of orange peel. I spray clear with a Sata 4000 hvlp spray gun with a 1.3 tip. I spray base with a Sata 3000 rp spray gun with a 1.3 tip.
A pic of me painting an R33 Nissan Skyline with my Sata jet.
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1440131860.133091.jpg


Hope this helps!
 
I'm at least going to try spraying clear on a sanded scrap body panel and see what the results look like. I also should have said in my first post that I'm not trying to achieve a show car finish. I use my LC for expedition trips including some narrow trails and while it's pretty dent-free, I can't say the same about all the scratches from brush and vegetation along the trails. I'm primarily looking for a finish that looks mostly "okay" and will protect the underlying paint and metal. I do have bed liner where the fender flares used to be and low down on the doors, but definitely not ready to do the whole truck that way.
 
If you sand and just reclear you will see the Sand scratches that are put into the paint. At least throw a coat of base down and then reclear!
 
You are still scratching the paint. Where you sand that still has clear will not show scratches. The clear will fill them. But where your clear has come off and is now open paint, that's where your gonna see the scratches. Because you are sanding the metallics in the paint. They will get messed up and that's what will show as a "scratch". Even with that fine of a sand paper. Again like I said earlier anything finer than 800 and your gonna have issues.
 
Ahhhh you fancy cats and your metallic colors. Solid colors only for a 40 series. ...
 

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