The Vegtable Garden Thread (1 Viewer)

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BrotherRob said:
Here too. Both soil sulfur and gypsum neutralize salts. I've heard sulfur is a better choice but it's several times the money. Gypsum is also a life saver for breaking up caliche.

I've heard of people using vinegar in gardens but that's always scared me. A little diluted lemon juice might be a cheap and dirty solution.
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It really works with super high PH, and it takes alot to bring the the soil down to neutral. There is a commercial product http://www.martinmidstream.com/site...oads/labels/90_Sulfur_Disper-Sul_PASTILLE.pdf that does the same in granular form. Best is test the soil PH and salts and go from there. Compost is the best way to to do it long term (if you get earth worms, you are there). Some commercial composts are loaded with salts due to whatever is used as green waste, we used a vendor in Phoenix for mulch and several years ago they must have been grinding up truck loads of Salt Cedar (Tamarix). Huge crop fail.
 
splitshot said:
It really works with super high PH, and it takes alot to bring the the soil down to neutral. There is a commercial product http://www.martinmidstream.com/site...oads/labels/90_Sulfur_Disper-Sul_PASTILLE.pdf that does the same in granular form. Best is test the soil PH and salts and go from there. Compost is the best way to to do it long term (if you get earth worms, you are there). Some commercial composts are loaded with salts due to whatever is used as green waste, we used a vendor in Phoenix for mulch and several years ago they must have been grinding up truck loads of Salt Cedar (Tamarix). Huge crop fail.
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I would think composting invasive species would be banned. I don't even compost weeds.
 
Great point, our Counties have done an excellent job promoting recycled green waste, and selling it as mulch, yet they haven't mastered the ability to create enough heat to kill kill the seed. Same vendor, and we are buried in junk that doesn't grow here. Horse tail, Fireweed, and several years ago we grew a fine crop of Alfalfa with no effort on our part.;)
 
Penny wise and dollar stupid. One exotic species can do more damage than ten years worth of biodegradable waste. If we're really so concerned about the stuff, crush it into cubes and burn it for fuel at the nearest power plant.
 
If your soil is high in clay, and or the pH is on the high side, then Gyp is the answer. Most agricultural areas today are lacking in Sulfur, as years ago we all used dusting sulfur several times a year to control several types of insects and pathogens. Put your gyp on in early fall and work it in, a good combo is manure with the gyp, and let it go to work. This is a constant on going process and may not show a difference in the first year. Now go ahead and use dusting sulfur on your crop. Gyp is calcium sulfide, and will not neutralize salts, but will assist in flushing them down into a lower soil profile. If on the other hand your soil is acidic, then look at lime, like those on the east coast. Treat sulfur as a nutrient. Although it does have it's place as an amendment. Some of the best responses I've had to sulfur were from tomatoes and alfalfa.
 
BrotherRob said:
I would think composting invasive species would be banned. I don't even compost weeds.
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Yeesh. I bought some packaged "potting mix" once to start seedlings and got a bunch of this:
dodder_close.jpg

Freaked me the fxxx out.
 
Dodder, a strange parasite of a weed. It has been known to lay dormant for several decades ( in it's seed form). Once it germinates it will detach from the soil, and continue to live off of the host. It will sink it's "roots" it to the host, and will produce a seed head which is like a single balloon head with on seed on top of it. Once the seed is mature the "balloon" will build up osmotic pressure and explode shooting the seed off and away.
Very strange adaptive survival abilities.
 
surfpig said:
Yeesh. I bought some packaged "potting mix" once to start seedlings and got a bunch of this:
View attachment 1100134
Freaked me the fxxx out.
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How'd it taste?

I mostly use cheap forest mulch and put in additives. Never had anything funky pop up.
 
splitshot said:
It really works with super high PH, and it takes alot to bring the the soil down to neutral. There is a commercial product http://www.martinmidstream.com/site...oads/labels/90_Sulfur_Disper-Sul_PASTILLE.pdf that does the same in granular form. Best is test the soil PH and salts and go from there. Compost is the best way to to do it long term (if you get earth worms, you are there). Some commercial composts are loaded with salts due to whatever is used as green waste, we used a vendor in Phoenix for mulch and several years ago they must have been grinding up truck loads of Salt Cedar (Tamarix). Huge crop fail.
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Compost is really the only answer to salt and alkali. Watch out for compost that has a lot of manure though, manure is typically loaded with salt because of the urine.
 
FLATU8ER said:
Dodder, a strange parasite of a weed. It has been known to lay dormant for several decades ( in it's seed form). Once it germinates it will detach from the soil, and continue to live off of the host. It will sink it's "roots" it to the host, and will produce a seed head which is like a single balloon head with on seed on top of it. Once the seed is mature the "balloon" will build up osmotic pressure and explode shooting the seed off and away.
Very strange adaptive survival abilities.
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Sounds like something Stephen King would think up.
 
FLATU8ER said:
Dodder, a strange parasite of a weed. It has been known to lay dormant for several decades ( in it's seed form). Once it germinates it will detach from the soil, and continue to live off of the host. It will sink it's "roots" it to the host, and will produce a seed head which is like a single balloon head with on seed on top of it. Once the seed is mature the "balloon" will build up osmotic pressure and explode shooting the seed off and away.
Very strange adaptive survival abilities.
Click to expand...

Kids when they were younger thought spaghetti came from seeds.:lol: I let it grow, around here it likes the stuff I like to weedwack.
Mistletoe on the other hand, I have had good results spraying with Glyphosate (Roundup) when it is actively growing.
 
Mulch and compost, you have to look at where the stuff comes from, and what it's made of. A lot of places around here, or bagged products will mention "locally sourced products". This is a catch all BS statement. In our area this means poultry bedding - this bedding is usually made of or consists of rice hulls. What do you know about rice hulls. In the last 20 or so years plant breeders have increased the amount of silica in the plant. This means a stronger stem that will prevent lodging of the rice head as the plant matures in standing water. Silica doesn't break down very easy, and rice hulls are cheap organic matter/bulk. It is like filler. Now if you live in a dry arid area, like Nev, Az, Cent Calif. Organic matter is very important, but the high temps, along with other biologic activity will eat this up very quickly. Secondly, in order to facilitate the decomposition of organic matter, you need lots of (N) Nitrogen. The bioflora and fauna of soil microbes is fueled by N. In order to get rid of salt and alkali you need to use; Yes, organic matter, AND a good soil amendment. Forest mulch is good in the compost (if particulate size is small). Now let's talk "s***".
Manure is good, but where does it come from. Steer Manure is from feed lot cattle and this is where you can pick up weed seed, based on what is feed to the cattle. Dairy manure, this is where the questions come up. Most all dairies have a manure separator. Liquid from solids. Yes salts can be elevated, but only if you are getting it from "The source", composted should be fine. I have had numerous growers compost dairy manure with (cotton) gin trash. The left overs from processing, cleaning, and seeding the lint after harvest. Additionally, a word of caution about dairy manure is the high amounts of ammonia from the urine, but this will break down to NO3, or was it NO4, ammonic nitrogen.
Test question: a source of N to assist in breaking down organic matter, which was combined with gyp in your application.
It is important to maintain a balance in your soil of organic matter, nutrients, and amendments. One source I've dealt with was a solution of bovine and poultry manures that was enhanced with lab grown beneficial soil microbes, and a sea weed extract. (Cytokines) from the sea weed (prob kelp) are a growth hormone. A lot of my old customers thought I was trying to get them to use a Snake Oil.
Long story short, keep your soil healthy, feed your plants, AND feed your soil. FEED IT, LADDY.
 
Greetings from Sacratomato:
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Yeah, it's starting...

:lol:

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