T-case help on '76 FJ40 with a Ford 302 and C4 trans (1 Viewer)

[GreenGoat]

First off, this is my first 40 (04/1976 to be exact) and first forum thread creation. I never imagined something like this could be so much fun to drive, even with manual steering and a less than smooth ride.

So here's the scoop: it has an early 70's Bronco 302 and '69ish C4, 3 speed transmission. I realize this is probably the least common SBC, but that's what the PO installed so that's what I got. The transfer case is leaking from every possible pore available - front gasket where transmission and transfer case meet (paper gasket is hanging out of the bottom), rear output seal, and random bolts (not the fill or drain bolts though). The obvious solution is to rebuild the transfer case; at the least an entire reseal/regasket.

My questions:

1) Since the C4 transmission is a 3 speed, does that mean my t-case is a 3 speed?
2) Could the PO have installed a 3 speed transmission while using the original 4 speed t-case?
3) The existing Hurst t-case linkage doesn't quite match up to the t-case piston - is there any longer linkage I can purchase as a replacement or am I stuck fabricating something?
4) Does anyone have a trusted recommendation for a local (Reno, NV) mechanic to rebuild the t-case for me?

This is a little above my skill set and available tools, and my wife's patience for the time spent in the garage doing it. This is also my daily driver so I can't have it out of commission for more than a few days.

Any help is appreciated!

 

[pbgbottle]

no the t-case could be a 3sp or a 4spd one depending on the adapter that the PO used .does the t-case need a rebuild . it doesn't take much to reseal the case . u could do it in a few hours .

 

[Josie'sLandCruiser]

Hi all,

GreenGoat, welcome to MUD and the old Land Cruiser madness!

Post-up some pics of the t-case so we can figure out which version of the pre-1980 one piece t-case your rig has (probably the one that came in the rig.)

The adapter between the C-4 and the Land Cruiser t-case is probably this one from Advance Adapters:

http://www.advanceadapters.com/prod...to-toyota-land-cruiser-16-spline-adapter-kit/

Though it could be this version:

http://www.advanceadapters.com/prod...-to-toyota-land-cruiser-10-splineadapter-kit/

For a t-case rebuild, I'd suggest shipping it to trusted MUD venders like Mark's Off-Road or Valley Hybrids (both in Cali.)

Regards,

Alan

 

[GreenGoat]

Thanks for the welcome! I have a feeling this Cruiser is going to test the patience and fortitude of my marriage for sure.

Here are pics of my transfer case and adapter. I also included one of the linkage issue I currently have.

 

[Josie'sLandCruiser]

Hi all,

GreenGoat, not seeing any transfer case is leaking from every possible pore available leaks in these pics. Yeah, the t-case is grimy, probably a mix of engine oil and road dirt. That red gasket material you see peeping out here and there is factory Toyota gearbox sealant.

Regards,

Alan

 

[shelfboy1]

leaking is when you park it and there are puddles on the floor if there is i would check the fluid level as you drive it .check it now before you put miles on it or you may need more than gaskets .also there will be gear lube all over the bottom of your 40 kind of like spray undercoating .if not then i dont think your in serious trouble yet .put the case in neutral get under it and see if the d shafts wiggle up or down or side to side if not you may be good .chalk the wheels though so you dont get hurt .go with the forum recomendations for a mechanic if needed good luck
.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

I'm a GM guy, and I don't do Fords.... unless they came in a Land Cruiser - but luck of the draw I've owned 2 of them (with 302s, 8 total). I've not dealt with a C4 (stock 3 speed and top loader 4 speed), but leaks were simply the Ford marking its territory. The trick to them is knowing when the leak should be dealt with - the old adage, you know you need to add oil is when it stops leaking - really does apply here. Re-sealing isn't too difficult, the problem is (my experience), you reduce the flow but don't really eliminate it.

With that said, the 302 is an awesome motor for the '40 - just be sure that if you go mud puddle hopping that you put a plastic bag over the distributor (and remove it when you're done).

 

[pbgbottle]

Where is your tcase E brake. ?
That looks clean to me
The linkage looks tweakable also.

 

[GreenGoat]

Thanks for all of the replies and input - what a phenomenal community!

I have taken some time cleaning up the underside and, while it's not perfect, it's a lot better than it was. When I park, there are small puddles beneath the t-case (small to me is considered a 2" diameter spot in 3 locations beneath the t-case area). I understand that it isn't a 2" spot of sitting fluid, rather 2" that have spread out. The amount of gunk build up before cleaning was incredible. The amount of gear grease still stuck to the cross members is crazy thick. But I digress.

The gear lube is dripping from 2 or 3 places at the lowest point on the t-case, but not spraying everywhere, yet, after driving that I can see. I know the rear output seal is leaking - that's obvious. I know the front plate area where the tranny and t-case meet up is leaking - that's obvious by the fluid leaking and the gasket that is hanging out. The other spot appears to be coming from one of the t-case bolts at the bottom of the of t-case. To top it all off, after crawling under there tonight it appears the PO used locktite on the fill bolt and rounded the bolt head- I can't get the bolt off to check/fill the stupid thing.

As for the e-brake, there isn't one that I am aware of. Nothing on the t-case at least and no internal pedal/lever anywhere.

And regarding the t-case rebuild, quite honestly I just don't know what to listen for or feel for when driving to know if the bearings/gears need attention. There is a whining noise when I accelerate, but I imagine some of that is normal. Vibrations are slight and minimal, but present nonetheless. Are these things normal for a 38 year young machine with a shackle lift and all-terrain tires? Or, is it more an issue of a rear axle (semi float) or wheel bearing needing attention?

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

howling on deceleration is a good sign things are going bad because the gears are moving around inside the case (and not in a good way)... it's actually pretty rare you'll get howling (and it is more than just an annoying whine) on acceleration because of how the gears are cut.

2" overnight, or 2" since you bought the car 20 years ago?

As for the plug, weld a nut to the bolt, the heat will loosen it, the nut will allow you to get a socket on it.... generally that gets it hot enough to loosen the bond between it and the t-case... and it won't light on fire (the grease on the outside is another story, so be careful). I teach kids camping, and one of the first things we do is boil water over an open fire in a paper cup.... it does good things to get them to think outside the box.

I have some of the e-brake stuff, but the stuff I have I'm going to use (I've none of the transfer case stuff) - but I highly recommend you put the brake back on, it's one of those safety devices that really can be a lifesaver.

 

[GreenGoat]

Well that's not what I was hoping to hear. If I understand correctly, I should consider the t-case rebuild sooner than later? This thing just got expensive...

The dripping is 2" overnight. It started after I pressure washed the underside, which obviously knocked off the grime that was holding things in place.

Thanks for the help!

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

either that or simply get another transfer case, there's plenty of them out there so they're not unreasonably priced.

 

[Downey]

When you get the transfer-case rebuilt, have your rebuilder install the top transfer-case oil seal backwards (with open spring side facing the tranny fluid, not facing the thicker transfer-case gear oil). Also, have the rebuilder lay a path of silicone/RTV around the nose of the top transfer-case input gear (where it noses into the back side of the input bearing). This will hold tranny fluid in the tranny and not let it seep rearward into the transfer-case through the gear splines. Next, your transfer-case floor shifter must first be mounted so that the shifting lug at the bottom of the shift lever aligns with slot in the switching valve shaft. Once you have them aligned, then the lug will be too far outboard, not engaging into the shaft. Remedy is to get a 12mm by 50mm long allen head bolt with .700 to .710 head diameter, and two jam nuts. Drill hole in bottom of shift lever out to .465", then allen head bolt can be adjusted inward for full engagement with the shaft, and jam nutted into that position- - - easy deal.

 

[GreenGoat]

Downey, thanks for the input. Could I trouble you for a very basic drawing/picture of your explanation for the shifter alignment adjustment? I just want to make sure I understand exactly what you are describing before I drill a hole in something. If I understand correctly though, I am basically creating a link with the allen head bolt from the shifter linkage to the valve shaft. I need to drill a hole through both the linkage and the valve shaft.

After an evaluation from a local mechanic today, his diagnosis was both the rear-end and transfer case need to be addressed. There is "slop" in the gears and pinion ring (?). My thoughts now are to purchase a rebuilt transfer case from Mark's Off Road or fjparts.c*m, and have the rear-end rebuilt by someone more qualified to do it.

Do you guys have a recommendation on which one to fix first? Will the t-case hold out longer than the rear-end, provided I keep it full of oil? Or, should I replace the t-case first, then the rear-end?

 

[Downey]

No, you do not have to drill a hole in the valve shaft. You are drilling out the existing hole in the bottom of your shift lever to allow for the diameter of the threads of the allen head bolt. The head of the allen head bolt (at about .700" to .710" diameter) merely engages into the existing slot in the end of your valve shaft, and the threads merely allow the head of the allen head bolt to be adjustable inward or outward..

 

[Josie'sLandCruiser]

Hi all,

Green Goat, IMHO the rearend will survive longer than the t-case.

Dealing with the rear axle is not too bad. On Toyotas you can remove the rear differential housing (i.e. the "third member") and take it into a shop for rebuild or upgrade. FYI, a Land Cruiser 9.5 inch third member fits into a 6 gallon plastic bucket nicely for shipping.

For a rear axle rebuild, in additional to the previous MUD venders I mentioned, consider Marlin Crawler. Although mainly a Toyota 4wd pu/4Runner shop they know Toyota differentials.

Good luck,

Alan

 

[B y r o n]

Downey, thanks for the input. Could I trouble you for a very basic drawing/picture of your explanation for the shifter alignment adjustment? I just want to make sure I understand exactly what you are describing before I drill a hole in something. If I understand correctly though, I am basically creating a link with the allen head bolt from the shifter linkage to the valve shaft. I need to drill a hole through both the linkage and the valve shaft.

After an evaluation from a local mechanic today, his diagnosis was both the rear-end and transfer case need to be addressed. There is "slop" in the gears and pinion ring (?). My thoughts now are to purchase a rebuilt transfer case from Mark's Off Road or fjparts.c*m, and have the rear-end rebuilt by someone more qualified to do it.

Do you guys have a recommendation on which one to fix first? Will the t-case hold out longer than the rear-end, provided I keep it full of oil? Or, should I replace the t-case first, then the rear-end?

Maybe this image will help.

The end of the linkage arm that fits into the slot in the shift rod will press out. This is the hole Downey is talking about opening up. I went a different route with my 3 speed linkage than you have with your 4 speed transfer case.

 

[GreenGoat]

Thanks Byron, that's exactly what I needed.

Transfer case first, then rear-end; got it. When looking at the rear-end work, would this be a good time to go with a full float to replace the semi-float? Are there major advantages to either, if I happen to find a rebuilt one before the other somewhere? Or, do you guys recommend just sticking with the original and rebuilding?

 

[RAYJON]

Welcome to the addiction, Join Battle Born cruisers we have a meeting the second Thursday of every month at the Round table on Demonte Ranch, We have a great group and can help. Next meeting is thrusday at 630pm... 12/11

https://forum.ih8mud.com/forums/nv-battle-born-cruisers-of-northern-nevada.60/

 

[GreenGoat]

Welcome to the addiction, Join Battle Born cruisers we have a meeting the second Thursday of every month at the Round table on Demonte Ranch, We have a great group and can help. Next meeting is thrusday at 630pm... 12/11

https://forum.ih8mud.com/forums/nv-battle-born-cruisers-of-northern-nevada.60/

Thanks RAYJON! That is about 5 minutes from our house. I'm not sure we can make it this week, but we would really like to meet the group. If we can't make it this week we will do our best to be there in January. Don't expect much out of the cruiser, it smells like burning t-case gear oil and transmission fluid (because it is burning fluids on the exhaust coming from those 2). But if the only requirement to be in the club is to have a cruiser then count us in!