BC government is at it again

[2rivers]

Good work Previa and you others! Great read after back from hollerdaze. Following with interest... Quick comments;

Every RHD owners should have access to a print off and sign/send letter to MLA, MP, ICBC, Insurance something something ...of Canada, TC etc. Dealers/flippers/anyone should provide these to the past customers, word of mouth, posted on a site. Numbers and loud voice. Good work on getting a few other interesters on board like the BMW's, the Benz's, the Patrols, Pajeros clubs...cross post to other forums. Thanks to Wayne and others for "hosting" this info elsewhere to spread info.

Question: in BC isnt ICBC mandated to provide a BC citizen with insurance as long as you hold a licence/ dont have a screwed up drving record?

Never mind the "vehicles dont have standards"


Johnny

[Previa Diesel]

I think it needs to be pointed out to all RHD owners, (dealers: your former clients) that once RHD is declared "unsafe"- obviously falsely - but once done "in policy", I can't help wondering on what grounds RHD vehicles will be allowed to continue to operate?

If a vehicle is "unsafe" to import, how does one justify allowing an "unsafe" vehicle on the road?

Ah, here's a happy bureaucratic medium: jack up their insurance rates so high they can hardly afford to drive them.

I can see the private insurers being happy to jump on the bandwagon.

Those who are thinking, "well, I've already got mine so I'm alright Jack", may want to think again.

I don't know about other provinces, but in BC that's a "temporary registration" on the windshield.

Food for thought, and hopefully action.

[crushers]

please don't use blue colour, it mkes it hard for old farts like me to read...

i don't think they will ever prove the RHD is unsafe, they are trying to go for the 25 year rule to stop the importation to "have time to study the issue further"...
once the year is changed they will give up on trying to prove ANYTHING since they will have won...
it is a ruse to lie to the powers that be. politcians lie, mislead, twist the facts to their own end, it has been this way from the begining of time. the only way we can beat them is to point out the lies and twisted truths using their own facts against them.

dig up as many facts as you can and post them up... we all can use this information...

[Previa Diesel]

OK, got rid of the blue, but I do want to draw attention to this. A legal argument could very well be made that if it's not "safe" to import, it's not "safe" to drive.

No, they'll never prove it, and the more they try, the more the advantages of RHD will become known, but precedent counts for a lot in regulations as well as in law.

If this ban goes through, all RHD owners are going to be driving vehicles with a shadow cast over them of being "unsafe" from a regulatory/legal point of view.

Other agencies will use thate precedent/opinion to justify other restrictions and insurance is the most obvious one.

If federal regulations say RHD is unsafe, it'll be no good arguing with your insuror or writing letters to the editor saying that they aren't. The response will be: "so you know better than Transport Canada?"

That's how history is (re)written.

[61ihc]

maybe a different approach is needed. if these "old" vehicles are dangerous maybe we should play along and petition to change the import rule to 2 years or younger... just a thought

[jhmed]

Originally Posted by Previa Diesel

I think it needs to be pointed out to all RHD owners, (dealers: your former clients) that once RHD is declared "unsafe"- obviously falsely - but once done "in policy", I can't help wondering on what grounds RHD vehicles will be allowed to continue to operate?

If a vehicle is "unsafe" to import, how does one justify allowing an "unsafe" vehicle on the road?

Ah, here's a happy bureaucratic medium: jack up their insurance rates so high they can hardly afford to drive them.

I can see the private insurers being happy to jump on the bandwagon.

Those who are thinking, "well, I've already got mine so I'm alright Jack", may want to think again.

I don't know about other provinces, but in BC that's a "temporary registration" on the windshield.

Food for thought, and hopefully action.

I agree, and already mentioned this in post 41 (Page 2)...

Like I've said before, I could give a damn if one more import landed on our shores, but I do not want to have to pay Exotic Car insurance if I can help it, and I certainly don't want to be told I can't drive my car or that it's uninsurable... I only drive it about thirty days per year as it is! Frankly, there's just no guarantee the government will 'grandfather' or exempt anything that's already here... everyone who owns a RHD needs to get their asses involved.

I hate to say it, but don't count on a lot of support from the Sport Compact crowd. We could get some of the die-hards but the impression I get from a lot of people after seeing some of the reactionary BS on the local boards about this issue isn't very promising. Most of them, unless they're enthusiasts don't care, or don't think it will happen. Hell, most don't give a sh*t if their vehicle is truly legal. We need to get some neutral territory to get the word out. Somewhere where everyone can converge, and quickly. Not on a CR-X site, a Skyline/Sylvia site, a LC or 4x4 site, but a RHD site where we can all come together. Something running vbulletin where we can brainstorm and spitball ideas back and forth.


That's why I'm in this fight. In it till the bitter bitter end.

[83bj60]

Originally Posted by lshobie

83BJ60, to get into the yahoo group - you have to sign in - are you a a member? Sounds silly, but the only way I can get it to act like you say is to sign out. When I sign in it is fine.

Regards,

This is what I get when I login, I'm baffled...

[lshobie]

83BJ60 - because you opted out of the email option the program doesnt allow you to see messages I guess. I opted you for the "special notices" which we never really have - seems like you should be able to see messages now - check it out and let me know please.

[83bj60]

Originally Posted by lshobie

83BJ60 - because you opted out of the email option the program doesnt allow you to see messages I guess. I opted you for the "special notices" which we never really have - seems like you should be able to see messages now - check it out and let me know please.

Sorry, no joy, not in Opera, not in IE, I can see Files, but no Messages

[canucksafari]

Originally Posted by 83bj60

Sorry, no joy, not in Opera, not in IE, I can see Files, but no Messages

It's the same for me. I tried changing my preferences to no avail.
John

[BulletProof]

Originally Posted by Fromage

as there is a north american equivalent, but what about a Pajero?.... These vehicles have no North American equivalents,

The Pajero is a Montero in North America. Headlights are swappable if this is a concern for the legislators.

[mdrive]

Originally Posted by lshobie

I have my lawyer looking at it now, i think they are the largest firm in Canada now with an office in BC. I will see what course of action she thinks is best. I am betting that she will recommend a law office in BC to respond to that document, TC, and ICBC.

I am willing to pay up some cash for the cause - I will see if any other dealers are willing as well. Any dealers on here willing? This is not a pulpit thing or empire building, but I am willing to cough up.

It is possible that lawyers don't need to be called in yet, perhaps just a response letter is good enough.

Anyway, I will see what her recommendation is.

I am willing to participate and contribute as necessary for the fight.

[mdrive]

The study suggested that 15 year old imports also should go through RIV program. RIV program is nothing but a Federal Inspection (in addition to Provincial) which checks for Todler Seat belt anchorage, & day time running lights. I hope TC will not value this report!
I believe none of this would happen if all RHD owners would comply to the Provincial Inspection. I saw many dealers and importers are not complying to date. Many units are being inspected without proper headlights, DRL, High Mount Brake lamps. Most popular units such as Land Cruisers, Delica, Pajero, Hilux are so easy to comply but reckless importers & dealers are passing inspection somehow and pissing off vehicle inspection guys up in Victoria and creating such a mess.

[cruzrjt]

Wow this has been a really interesting read. There sure are some passionate people here regarding this topic. Sounds like lots of great ideas on how to combat a seemingly certain fate for imported vehicles. My questions are this. If the rules for importing were changed from 15 year rule to a 25 year rule, would RHD vehicles still be allowed? It seems like changing the importation date/timeline doesn't really effect the RHD issue except to slow down the obviously large number of vehicles currently coming into the country. Looking to our Southern neighbours does anyone know if there are restrictions on RHD vehicles there?
Many of the current regulations on transportation in Canada have been borrowed from the regulations currently in place in the US so looking at their rules might give insight into what our system could become.
Also it seems that after reading all these posts, heated debates and mis-interpretation of facts and opinions there are alot of great ideas and willing people to jump in. Surely there must be a few people willing to take the reigns and show some leadership? It sounds like several courses of action should be taken
1) Web site/forum such as the Mud type where people can openly add to and access information should be developed. Surely someone here has the ability to make that happen (I am a mediocre computer literate at best, have maintained a few small web sites in the past but wouldn't trust myself enough to actually put together something of this size)
2) A form letter which can be sent to the various MLA's, MP's or who ever else will listen (perhaps someone with some more technical writing skills, mixed with some experience in dealing with governement agencies could step up for this task.
3) Petition with information such as name, email etc which can be signed and sent to the correct government bodies
have I missed anything?
Jayson T.

[cruiser_guy]

Originally Posted by cruzrjt

If the rules for importing were changed from 15 year rule to a 25 year rule, would RHD vehicles still be allowed? It seems like changing the importation date/timeline doesn't really effect the RHD issue except to slow down the obviously large number of vehicles currently coming into the country. Looking to our Southern neighbours does anyone know if there are restrictions on RHD vehicles there?

Jayson, the issue is that in Japan where many of these vehicles come from the vehicle inspection is so strict that most vehicles don't make it till 25 years. 15 years is about it. That doesn't mean that they are wrecked, far from it! Most of these are MUCH better than the average 15 year old vehicle from the CDM. The US is on a 25 year rule which is why there are not the same issues there right now.

[crushers]

okay, i am getting cards made up to hand out to any RHD drivers i see. i went up to a Pajero today in the local Home Despot and was chatting with the driver, he had heard nothing of the possible problems coming with BC goverments endevors.
this made me realise it would be good to have a card to give to him.

when i get them made i can ship some off to the various people on this board to hand out as well...

how many guys are interested in having some cards made up and how many do you want. i will foot the bill for the cards but please don't waste them or ask for more than you realisticly forsee you using...

i will give it a couple days to see how many i need to make up...

cheers

[wussyPup]

Originally Posted by lshobie

83BJ60 - because you opted out of the email option the program doesnt allow you to see messages I guess. I opted you for the "special notices" which we never really have - seems like you should be able to see messages now - check it out and let me know please.

My membership options have always been set to Individual emails and I don't get the Messages link either. I tried to navigate to it manually, but got a message that I'm not a group moderator. See first image.

Is it possible that the setting in:
Management - Group Settings - Messages - Archive Options - Access
is set to Moderators instead of Members?
The second image shows the settings I have on a different group that do allow all Members to see Messages.

-Steve

[canucksafari]

Originally Posted by crushers

how many guys are interested in having some cards made up and how many do you want. i will foot the bill for the cards but please don't waste them or ask for more than you realisticly forsee you using...

i will give it a couple days to see how many i need to make up...

cheers

Wayne I will take 50 cards. I will PM you with the details. However, I think it would be even more effective if the dealers sent a card to each of their past Canadian customers. If the card is addressed to the Minister of Transport at his Parliament Hill address there is no postage cost.

Now, as I do this type of political advocacy work for a living, I can tell you that letters are even more effective. Don't get me wrong, cards are great for getting busy people to sign them. Every year we flood government with between 200,000 and 300,000 cards. A lot of other organizations are doing near the same. Politicians, especially federal politicians, generally count a letter as representing about how 1000 people feel. So the more people who send a letter the better. It is not an either or question. We can do both. Again, any good advocacy campaign needs media coverage. People should be writing letters to the editor in their community newspapers. These are always scanned by an MPs consituency staff. They should also be contacting the bigger mass media - such as the CBC who broke the story. Ideally, the person to speak to the CBC or other big electronic media will be very well versed on all aspect of the debate. Often what happens with the bigger mass media is that they pick up local stories from their regional outlets - especially on a slow news day. In the case of the CBC story on RHD, I believe it came out of their Okanogan/Kootaney regional broadcasting. We should also be looking at consumer advocate television programs. They just love this typical underdog story of a group of small people fighting big business and big government.
Cheers, John

[William Baird]

Good evening gentlemen,

This is a very informative read, some great facts stated here helping our cause of the RIGHT to own and drive one of these fantastic right hand drive vehicles in our beloved country.

I am the owner of one of the larger Alberta based import dealers, and would like to offer help in any way that I can. Some positives notes I can contribute to the cause are:

- Over 1000 + customers / potential customers on our mailing list, along with hundreds of past customers who I can assume would sign any petition we come up with

- If we need any financial backing, I'd be more than happy to help out with that as well

If there is anything else we can do to help, please let me know.

[crushers]

Originally Posted by canucksafari

Wayne I will take 50 cards. I will PM you with the details. However, I think it would be even more effective if the dealers sent a card to each of their past Canadian customers. If the card is addressed to the Minister of Transport at his Parliament Hill address there is no postage cost.

Now, as I do this type of political advocacy work for a living, I can tell you that letters are even more effective. Don't get me wrong, cards are great for getting busy people to sign them. Every year we flood government with between 200,000 and 300,000 cards. A lot of other organizations are doing near the same. Politicians, especially federal politicians, generally count a letter as representing about how 1000 people feel. So the more people who send a letter the better. It is not an either or question. We can do both. Again, any good advocacy campaign needs media coverage. People should be writing letters to the editor in their community newspapers. These are always scanned by an MPs consituency staff. They should also be contacting the bigger mass media - such as the CBC who broke the story. Ideally, the person to speak to the CBC or other big electronic media will be very well versed on all aspect of the debate. Often what happens with the bigger mass media is that they pick up local stories from their regional outlets - especially on a slow news day. In the case of the CBC story on RHD, I believe it came out of their Okanogan/Kootaney regional broadcasting. We should also be looking at consumer advocate television programs. They just love this typical underdog story of a group of small people fighting big business and big government.
Cheers, John

John,
these cards are meant to be similar to business cards and used to point RHD owners to this site and the RHDTLC site. this way if we can at least let the average joe know about the situation in a couple seconds at a light or in a parking lot.
as for the letter you are talking about if you can send me a sample then i can get a bunch of them made up as well.
i am open to suggestions on how to contact those persons that would otherwide be blind sided by the goverments activity...

cheers