Too Much Flex (from my Hood)

Isotel · 07-30-07, 06:27 PM

My Hood is everywhere, It shifts from side to side about 2 inches, and eventualy i loose my latches and its catching air.. I did not realize how bad it was till i saw this photo..

Im going to be doing a cage tied to the frame at 6 places, aswell as some tube fenders / Radiator protection soon, Any tricks to keeping things in place while flexing??

greenfox · 07-30-07, 06:32 PM

Leave it alone it will be fine.

Isotel · 07-30-07, 06:35 PM

yea yea, i know, id just like to eventually have a rig that dosent squeek rattle and hum as im working it thru a trail..

numtel · 07-30-07, 06:56 PM

Mine is at least that bad...now I have more squeaks and rattles though so I don't notice it.

sine80 · 07-30-07, 08:26 PM

One suggestion that came up recently (if you have your window down) is to leave it unhooked and let it do its thing. That does seem to be an awful lot though...

wngrog · 07-30-07, 09:09 PM

So much help here

That is FRAME flex manifesting itself in the hood.

Add a crossmember, tie in the cage to the frame and box the rear of the frame.

Any of the above or all will fix this.....

bustanutley · 07-30-07, 11:58 PM

First build a cage that ties to the frame in 6 places, you will be surprise how much it stiffens up your chassis, plating the rear of the frame won't be necessary. Then either weld the 2 C's of the frame together up front or build an engine cage.

A stiff chassis is a happy chassis, frame flex is a very dated train of thought.

Isotel · 07-31-07, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wngrog

So much help here

That is FRAME flex manifesting itself in the hood.

Add a crossmember, tie in the cage to the frame and box the rear of the frame.

Thanks Nolan.. not alot of room for a cross member, Cage is a MUST, cant wait to get that done!

Quote:

Originally Posted by bustanutley

First build a cage that ties to the frame in 6 places, you will be surprise how much it stiffens up your chassis, plating the rear of the frame won't be necessary. Then either weld the 2 C's of the frame together up front or build an engine cage.

A stiff chassis is a happy chassis, frame flex is a very dated train of thought.

Zach, So your Saying, Stitch Weld the C's that are Currently just Riveted?

bustanutley · 07-31-07, 02:22 PM

yes

make sure to do your best to square up the frame before-hand

Isotel · 07-31-07, 02:33 PM

cool.. My garage floor looks like a fault line runs thru it, so i think ill find another place to weld..

Thanks for the ideas!

Mace · 07-31-07, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isotel

Thanks Nolan.. not alot of room for a cross member, Cage is a MUST, cant wait to get that done!

Zach, So your Saying, Stitch Weld the C's that are Currently just Riveted?

Grogan hit the nail on the head...

Stitch weld the frame. It will work wonders..

cage hard mounted to the frame does a lot as well..

greenfox · 07-31-07, 05:49 PM

I stitch weilded the frame on my 74 it did help out alot.

gottoy · 07-31-07, 06:16 PM

hi,
IMO I would leave it like that for two reasons;

-first, adding a cage will bring stiffness to the frame and aren't we looking for more flex? this hood thing with old cruisers is good because it alows more flex in general in contrary to newer cruisers were the hood is kept in "between" the flares instead of sliding over the flares...
-and its known that what flexes doesn't break...well that's what i've been told

besides this a cage looks good and protects the passenger but i would just leave the original cage and add an extention around the windshield

Cheers,

greetings from Belgium!

Mace · 07-31-07, 06:26 PM

I perfer to allow the suspension (that is designed to move) do the work..

Tapage · 07-31-07, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bustanutley

A stiff chassis is a happy chassis, frame flex is a very dated train of thought.

Just curious .. coz I saw the F-350 of a buddy flex the chasis very well and it helps a lots ( coz the spring packs are really stiff ) at the trail ..

Are diferences chassis materials of design . ?

Eskimo · 07-31-07, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tapage

Just curious .. coz I saw the F-350 of a buddy flex the chasis very well and it helps a lots ( coz the spring packs are really stiff ) at the trail ..

Are diferences chassis materials of design . ?

The suspension is so stiff because the frame is so flexy. stiffer frame lets you use a softer suspension.

Frame flex sucks. The flex on mine went to -nill after the buggy build. No more creaking, popping, groaning, etc... from the frame.

Mace · 07-31-07, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tapage

Just curious .. coz I saw the F-350 of a buddy flex the chasis very well and it helps a lots ( coz the spring packs are really stiff ) at the trail ..

Are diferences chassis materials of design . ?

When his frame fails, you will know it..

Landcruisin'60 · 07-31-07, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

The suspension is so stiff because the frame is so flexy. stiffer frame lets you use a softer suspension.

Frame flex sucks. The flex on mine went to -nill after the buggy build. No more creaking, popping, groaning, etc... from the frame.

Isnt the suspension stiff because its designed to tow and haul a lot? Tractor trailers have really flexy frames so that they flex instead of break. Just watch one as it accelerates it twists all around.

camcruiser13 · 07-31-07, 09:59 PM

the frame twists, the body twists the body twists thing start to fail. let the suspension do the flexing

bustanutley · 08-01-07, 09:14 AM

you cannot dampen chassis movement....

Eskimo · 08-01-07, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landcruisin'60

Isnt the suspension stiff because its designed to tow and haul a lot? Tractor trailers have really flexy frames so that they flex instead of break. Just watch one as it accelerates it twists all around.

Yes, but it can be less stiff as the chassis gets stiffer.

There's just so much any manufacturer can do with a ladder frame to make it stiff. Semi's twist so much because they weigh 80,000lbs and have 2000lb-ft in a really low first gear fighting each other. The manufacturers know the twist is inevitable with that frame design, so they design around it.

Designing around it and designing it in are 2 different things.

Tapage · 08-01-07, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

The suspension is so stiff because the frame is so flexy. stiffer frame lets you use a softer suspension.

Yap I know .. and what happend if you choose a flexy frame with a flexy suspension !

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eskimo

Frame flex sucks. The flex on mine went to -nill after the buggy build. No more creaking, popping, groaning, etc... from the frame.

Yes . ? I thought my frame it's pretty stiff ! I thought .. and I hope

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mace

When his frame fails, you will know it..

Why .. ? I've seen many CJ frames break on trail here and some mini trucks also .. but never a Cruiser frame .. thought are far better resistance ( are close ! ) as same as all Cruiser stuff

Mace · 08-01-07, 11:44 AM

CJ frames are super weak, what happens is they bend and fatigue over time. Make the chassis stiff, and let the suspension do it's job..

Frames are not make out of spring material

'74 UA FJ · 08-01-07, 11:54 AM

Are your hood hinges strong enough? Maybe your hood is too rigid.

Tapage · 08-01-07, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mace

CJ frames are super weak, what happens is they bend and fatigue over time.

I know that

orangefj45 · 08-02-07, 09:36 AM

fawk all that, just take the hood off when you're wheeling!

07-30-07, 06:27 PM	#1
Isotel IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Crawlorado.com TLCA# 16898 Posts: 3,026	Too Much Flex (from my Hood) My Hood is everywhere, It shifts from side to side about 2 inches, and eventualy i loose my latches and its catching air.. I did not realize how bad it was till i saw this photo.. Im going to be doing a cage tied to the frame at 6 places, aswell as some tube fenders / Radiator protection soon, Any tricks to keeping things in place while flexing?? Attached Images __________________ 1976 FJ40 TBI350 700R4 D300 SOA Locked 37" PBR's Protected by REDLINE Colorado Land Cruisers - Club Redline Land Cruisers - PM me for info on our products or to order! CrAwLoRadO.com Last edited by Isotel; 07-30-07 at 06:33 PM.

07-30-07, 06:32 PM	#2
greenfox IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 13526 Posts: 669	Leave it alone it will be fine. __________________ 73 FJ40 Green - Original 74 FJ40 Red - (BMFCAGE) SOA 36X17IROKS weldedrear ARBfront and what ever els you can think of 97 FZJ80 Green (the wife's) - locked 67 fj45lwb in the works

07-30-07, 06:35 PM	#3
Isotel IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Crawlorado.com TLCA# 16898 Posts: 3,026	yea yea, i know, id just like to eventually have a rig that dosent squeek rattle and hum as im working it thru a trail.. __________________ 1976 FJ40 TBI350 700R4 D300 SOA Locked 37" PBR's Protected by REDLINE Colorado Land Cruisers - Club Redline Land Cruisers - PM me for info on our products or to order! CrAwLoRadO.com

07-30-07, 06:56 PM	#4
numtel IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chico, CA TLCA# 14946 Posts: 400	Mine is at least that bad...now I have more squeaks and rattles though so I don't notice it. __________________ 99" FJ40 - Trailbusters 4x4 - Toyota Rocks TLCA Chapter - Bent & Twisted Forum

07-30-07, 08:26 PM	#5
sine80 IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 17109 Posts: 557	One suggestion that came up recently (if you have your window down) is to leave it unhooked and let it do its thing. That does seem to be an awful lot though... __________________

07-30-07, 09:09 PM	#6
wngrog IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Canton, Mississippi TLCA# 8121 Posts: 2,538	So much help here That is FRAME flex manifesting itself in the hood. Add a crossmember, tie in the cage to the frame and box the rear of the frame. Any of the above or all will fix this..... __________________ Rock Midget Motorsports www.rockmidget.com 2009 Calendars at www.rockmidget.com

07-30-07, 11:58 PM	#7
bustanutley IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: CrAwLoRaDo Posts: 1,612	First build a cage that ties to the frame in 6 places, you will be surprise how much it stiffens up your chassis, plating the rear of the frame won't be necessary. Then either weld the 2 C's of the frame together up front or build an engine cage. A stiff chassis is a happy chassis, frame flex is a very dated train of thought. __________________ FJ-40 on FO-DEEs just a lil guy HOMEGROWN

07-31-07, 02:22 PM	#9
bustanutley IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: CrAwLoRaDo Posts: 1,612	yes make sure to do your best to square up the frame before-hand __________________ FJ-40 on FO-DEEs just a lil guy HOMEGROWN

07-31-07, 02:33 PM	#10
Isotel IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Crawlorado.com TLCA# 16898 Posts: 3,026	cool.. My garage floor looks like a fault line runs thru it, so i think ill find another place to weld.. Thanks for the ideas! __________________ 1976 FJ40 TBI350 700R4 D300 SOA Locked 37" PBR's Protected by REDLINE Colorado Land Cruisers - Club Redline Land Cruisers - PM me for info on our products or to order! CrAwLoRadO.com

07-31-07, 05:49 PM	#12
greenfox IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 13526 Posts: 669	I stitch weilded the frame on my 74 it did help out alot. Attached Images __________________ 73 FJ40 Green - Original 74 FJ40 Red - (BMFCAGE) SOA 36X17IROKS weldedrear ARBfront and what ever els you can think of 97 FZJ80 Green (the wife's) - locked 67 fj45lwb in the works

07-31-07, 06:16 PM	#13
gottoy IH8MUD Rookie Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 21	hi, IMO I would leave it like that for two reasons; -first, adding a cage will bring stiffness to the frame and aren't we looking for more flex? this hood thing with old cruisers is good because it alows more flex in general in contrary to newer cruisers were the hood is kept in "between" the flares instead of sliding over the flares... -and its known that what flexes doesn't break...well that's what i've been told besides this a cage looks good and protects the passenger but i would just leave the original cage and add an extention around the windshield Cheers, greetings from Belgium!

07-31-07, 06:26 PM	#14
Mace what he said Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 11,207	I perfer to allow the suspension (that is designed to move) do the work.. __________________ I am kinda gay....... My Myspace http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...endid=75712409 "Mary Poppins: In every job that must be done, there is an element of fun. You find the fun and - SNAP - the job's a game."

07-31-07, 09:59 PM	#19
camcruiser13 IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: in the garage after dark in UT Posts: 5,134	the frame twists, the body twists the body twists thing start to fail. let the suspension do the flexing __________________ cc ------------- 76' fj40 camcrusier13 build threads the following are links, just click, go on try it Traction Bar Sliders Ram Assist Bumper Poison Spider Style Shackle Reversal Half Doors if your doing it im sure ive done it, need help just ask.......

08-01-07, 09:14 AM	#20
bustanutley IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: CrAwLoRaDo Posts: 1,612	you cannot dampen chassis movement.... __________________ FJ-40 on FO-DEEs just a lil guy HOMEGROWN

08-01-07, 11:44 AM	#23
Mace what he said Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 11,207	CJ frames are super weak, what happens is they bend and fatigue over time. Make the chassis stiff, and let the suspension do it's job.. Frames are not make out of spring material __________________ I am kinda gay....... My Myspace http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm...endid=75712409 "Mary Poppins: In every job that must be done, there is an element of fun. You find the fun and - SNAP - the job's a game."

08-02-07, 09:36 AM	#26
orangefj45 IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: on thin ice Posts: 5,671	fawk all that, just take the hood off when you're wheeling! __________________ TLCA and PMC member looking for Advance Adapters parts? send me a pm!