"Lift" Question

[C5Drvr]

It seems like most of the "lift kits" that people are installing around here are just beefier, taller springs that cause the stock suspension parts to ride higher then normal. Several questions about this:

1 - Doesn't this just mean that the wheel can travel futher up (good) but will stroke out earlier on the way down (bad)?

2 - Won't changing the null position of the suspension affect the alignment of the IFS? It seems that the stock suspension would be designed to have the null at a different point in the travel, the the wheels in a more level (axel vs road surface in parallel) position. Are those that are installing these lifts also realigning their suspension?

3 - Wouldn't it be better to install a lift kit that moved all the hinge points down the same amount and keep the suspension in true alignment and deal with the drive train issues with better, higher angle u-joints? Is it just that the oversized spring method is easier and cheaper? Does it have to do with the unique set up of the IFS and the trailing link rear?

4 - Does anyone make a true lift that moves the entire suspension, not just slap in coils and shocks?

[TexasBadlands]

Seeing that the suspension lift here is mild, between 2-3 inches, there isn't much chance of angular problems with drive train. When a lift is put in, the wheels are realigned, toe in/ toe out etc should be adjusted by the installer. Trust me, if more parts were needed, then the manufacturers would definitely be hawking them with the new springs and shocks etc.

[FirstToy]

Originally Posted by C5Drvr

1 - Doesn't this just mean that the wheel can travel futher up (good) but will stroke out earlier on the way down (bad)?

2 - Won't changing the null position of the suspension affect the alignment of the IFS? It seems that the stock suspension would be designed to have the null at a different point in the travel, the the wheels in a more level (axel vs road surface in parallel) position. Are those that are installing these lifts also realigning their suspension?

3 - Wouldn't it be better to install a lift kit that moved all the hinge points down the same amount and keep the suspension in true alignment and deal with the drive train issues with better, higher angle u-joints? Is it just that the oversized spring method is easier and cheaper? Does it have to do with the unique set up of the IFS and the trailing link rear?

4 - Does anyone make a true lift that moves the entire suspension, not just slap in coils and shocks?

These are great observations- here's my take

1- Yes, lifting IFS does limit the downtravel. The good thing about the FJC is, even w/ 3" lift, the CV's are not at an extreme angle so you maintain good travel up and down.

2. Alignments are required when lifting. IFS needs to be aligned in all directions- toe, camber, caster

3. You are talking about a differential drop. The disadvantage of this is you are taking away the clearance you lifted to gain in the first place. Again, not an issue at the 2-3" lift arena of the FJC.

If there were driveline issues to be dealt with, they could be but simply not necessary with the amount of lift coilovers give.

[jfonz]

you pose very good questions. I would like to hear from some manufactures about this becuases I'm now wondering the same thing.

I would think that if there lifting it that they are taking in account the increased height, and at the same time increaseing the shock length a bit, atleast on some of the lifts out there, thus increaseing the downward travel as well. I know the moving the axle down method is another way to do it but that usually means having to break the 4" barrier, and unless there moving front axle forward at the same time theres really not much point. The biggest tire your going to fit on one with the stock front axle position is a 35 (which can fit with 3.5" of lift) and thats with some triming to the front body mount... And if your moving the IFS position forward you might as well just do a SFA swap....

[C5Drvr]

The question remains about the limited down stroke. Are you going to be constantly topping out the stoke in normal driving? Undulating highways, etc. How good is that for the suspension/bump stops?

[JonB]

Originally Posted by C5Drvr

The question remains about the limited down stroke. Are you going to be constantly topping out the stoke in normal driving? Undulating highways, etc. How good is that for the suspension/bump stops?

The Walker Evans Racing shocks we use have 1.5" more stroke than the factory shocks. This translates into almost 3" more usable wheel travel because of where the shock is mounted in relation to the pivot points of the control arms. The FJ comes factory with the differential at a lower ride height than the hubs which works out great for people who want to lift their FJ. With 3" of lift cranked into your coil-overs the angle of your axle is barely over horizontal. Even with the longer travel shocks at full droop the CV's don't bind. The geometry of the FJ suspension is much better than the Tacoma's even though they use a lot of the same components. It seems like Toyota knew more people would want to lift FJ's and actually gave us a good foundation to do so.

[C5Drvr]

Originally Posted by JonB

The Walker Evans Racing shocks we use have 1.5" more stroke than the factory shocks. This translates into almost 3" more usable wheel travel because of where the shock is mounted in relation to the pivot points of the control arms. The FJ comes factory with the differential at a lower ride height than the hubs which works out great for people who want to lift their FJ. With 3" of lift cranked into your coil-overs the angle of your axle is barely over horizontal. Even with the longer travel shocks at full droop the CV's don't bind. The geometry of the FJ suspension is much better than the Tacoma's even though they use a lot of the same components. It seems like Toyota knew more people would want to lift FJ's and actually gave us a good foundation to do so.

SO what lift kit are you using with the Walker Evans shocks?

[k_os]

Originally Posted by C5Drvr

SO what lift kit are you using with the Walker Evans shocks?

The walker evans shocks. They are coilovers that is essentially the "lift kit". Shocks and springs in one thing same kind of thing you have on the FJC now. Just adjustable with some other features like adjustble damping/height and ofcourse up to 3" longer. and you can get them with a reservoir or not. high quality product. I just don't see the average Joe using these coilovers to their limit or using their nice features at all.

[JonB]

Originally Posted by C5Drvr

SO what lift kit are you using with the Walker Evans shocks?

The All-Pro Off-Road 3" suspension kit.