Living State-side. Traveling south. What rig?

[Pushbutton]

Hello everyone, I must say this site has answered a great many of my questions, but has created even more!

Here is the situation. I currently live in the states for grad school, but I spend 5-7 months a year in Belize and the surrounding area doing archaeological reseach. My main focus is digitally mapping and conducting preliminary excavations on Maya sites that are "newly discovered". (mainly ones nobody has gotten around to doing yet ) My problem comes with getting to the sites themselves. With uncertain road conditions and river crossings a 2wd van will only go so far before we are forced to abandon it, let the driver take it back to town, and carry a few hundred pounds of equipment on foot. That combined with the insane cost (total) of shipping all that equipment down there, renting the van itself, and plane tickets makes it cheaper to take the time to drive everything down to Belize from the states.

This is how I did things as an undergrad as my prof owned a Land Rover Defender that we would drive down and it worked out great. That prompted me to think about building up a vehicle to do the same. What I am looking for is a rig that will be simple, but comfortable as it will be a daily driver because I am a poor grad student and can not afford 2 cars. (Bye bye '85 Z ) Also diesel, manual tran, and popular enough in that area of the world to make parts finding easy. This was before I came to this site.

Now I know that rig does not exist in the USA! Well, I cant say that, I am sure there is something out there that I do not know about and thats why I am asking you all. All you who venture into that area of the world, what do you take for a rig? I hope my explination gave you an idea on how I will be using it. Thanks for any help you all can provide!

[cruiser_guy]

You mean places like this?

I have an '82 BJ60 Toyota Land Cruiser which is a diesel and it's the same engine as the Toyota Dyna/Coaster used in that time period.

[joshoisasleep]

In some states I think it is possible to import older landcruisers from Canada? I think there's an active thread about this a bit lower down in this forum...
Up here you can get older BJ60's and HJ60's that are affordable and tough (diesel 4 cyl and 6 cyl respectively). Were there also no diesel landrovers in the states? I have heard there were only about 200 110's in North America anyway so you would have to go with a shorter one even if you could find diesel.

Depending on your budget, You can get a landcruiser converted professionally to diesel for about $10,000 all in (plus your cruiser). (I think again some states have some restrictions... I've heard it's a no-go in Cali? Can't confirm that).
Again, depending on import restrictions in your area, (and if you like RHD) I know you can get an ex military landrover 110 diesel for AROUND $3,000 from the UK (purchase price only). In Canada we can import 80 series (like 1992-1998 I think?) diesel landcruisers for about $10,000 all in from Japan, if you do it yourself.

In my sig is what I use a little further south of where you go...

[joshoisasleep]

Originally Posted by cruiser_guy

...Toyota Dyna/Coaster used in that time period.

What's that?

[cruiser_guy]

Originally Posted by joshoisasleep

What's that?

You have not seen a Toyota Dyna 2 1/2 ton truck or a Toyota Coaster bus on your travels yet?!?! The newer Dyna/Coaster uses a 1HZ or similar engine.

[joshoisasleep]

Err... sounds like I have but the model names were all covered in dirt or gone...

[Pushbutton]

Haha, I knew you would pop up cruiser_guy. I have seen that place many times... Going that direction is easy... going the other way... well... .

Thanks for the replies! So it looks like importing or swapping is the only way, eh? I kind of thought thats what would happen. I am still looking for a diesel land rover, but there are few and they are going for premium. Now I have imported and swapped before, but that is also the reason I was hoping that I could get away without it. Rarely is the cost and hassle of each route worth the outcome. Luckily Georgia is an agricultural state and it makes the process for importing 4x4's far easier... its still a pain tho.

The only thing holding me back from just swapping myself is that I know -nothing- about diesels. All my work has been on sports cars and race cars. I may talk to some people I know and see if they would be willing to help me out with that. What engine should I be looking at for a swap into, say, a FJ60? A 1HZ?

I would also be interested in importing a diesel 80. I will have to look into that and see what the cost difference between the two routes would be. Thanks for the help you two, if you got any more info shoot it my way!

[cruiser_guy]

Originally Posted by Pushbutton

Haha, I knew you would pop up cruiser_guy. I have seen that place many times... Going that direction is easy... going the other way... well... .

I would also be interested in importing a diesel 80. I will have to look into that and see what the cost difference between the two routes would be. Thanks for the help you two, if you got any more info shoot it my way!

Actually I found it easier to go into Guatemala. Belize made us empty all our luggage and carry it through the customs house separate from driving the truck through.

Importing anything stateside that is not Canadian production or less than 25 years old is not technically possible, though it has been done.

[Pushbutton]

Originally Posted by cruiser_guy

Actually I found it easier to go into Guatemala. Belize made us empty all our luggage and carry it through the customs house separate from driving the truck through.

Importing anything stateside that is not Canadian production or less than 25 years old is not technically possible, though it has been done.

Really? Thats usually what they do to me going into Guatemala, lol, and yes, I did miss the part about importing TO Canada, not from Canada. Sorry about that.

I think it may just be easier to get a 60 and leave it be. Gas wont be optimal, but it will work....

[cruiser_guy]

Whatever you end up with you'll want lockers for the nice slick mud that seems to be everywhere. A well done SOA may also be useful and of course swampers or other off road tire.

[joshoisasleep]

Originally Posted by Pushbutton

Now I have imported and swapped before, but that is also the reason I was hoping that I could get away without it. Rarely is the cost and hassle of each route worth the outcome.

Not necessarily in this case. I live in Canada where you can get the Diesels, but I STILL ended up doing an engine swap. The old diesel cruisers hold their value very well. At the time I basically was looking at either buying a rusting and/or higher mileage (400,000km's +) BJ60 for around $8000-$10,000 (at least from what I could see), importing, or doing an engine swap. All-in, I ended up spending about $12,000 on my swap and I ended up with a rust-free truck with lower mileage, that I may not lose money on when it comes time to sell (possibly that is... from some of the prices I've seen... if I could ever part with it). Also, now instead of driving someone else's old truck with it's unknown quirks, this way I have a vehicle that's been essentially stripped down and put back together piece by piece by a professional mechanic.

This route also allowed me to drive the $1500 donor truck (rusted beyond safety margins for my purposes, or the PO's) for several months and get a feel for the engine before jumping into the main investment. So engine swapping isn't just for people in the US who don't have access to our diesels (ie, they're ALL rusty!).

[joshoisasleep]

Also, there's a cruiser mechanic on Vancouver Island where I'm from (I think he posts on here) who I think specializes in these swaps and who gave me a much lower quote for the labour than what I ended up paying my guy.

[cruiser_guy]

I STRONGLY recommend that any swap is given a good 6 months shake down to work out any bugs or problems. Don't leave until the truck has had a minimum of 3 months DD status problem free.

This is especially important for single vehicle expeditions or anyone who is not mechanically inclined (ie: doesn't do ALL the wrenching on their truck).

[joshoisasleep]

Originally Posted by cruiser_guy

I STRONGLY recommend that any swap is given a good 6 months shake down to work out any bugs or problems. Don't leave until the truck has had a minimum of 3 months DD status problem free.

This is especially important for single vehicle expeditions or anyone who is not mechanically inclined (ie: doesn't do ALL the wrenching on their truck).

Uh yeah I'll second that... don't do what I did. The above was only to say that logistically a swap is not necessarily the overly expensive and ridiculously inefficient way to go about things that it may sound.

[Josie'sLandCruiser]

Hi All:

"Pushbutton," why not a US-spec FZJ80 with factory electric locking diffs? Pay the money State-side to have Aussie-style long-range fuel and H20 tanks installed, as well as an OME heavy-load, low-height suspension installed.

Why? You could have this whole rig together for about US$10K. Sure, a diesel will get better fuel mileage, but how much $-premium are you willing to pay for that? Besides, my understanding is that petrol (gasoline) is easier to get in Mexico than diesel fuel.

Just an idea! If it was possible, I'd vote for a HZJ-75 Troop Carrier!


Regards,

Alan

[cruiser_guy]

Originally Posted by Josie'sLandCruiser

Sure, a diesel will get better fuel mileage, but how much $-premium are you willing to pay for that? Besides, my understanding is that petrol (gasoline) is easier to get in Mexico than diesel fuel.

Diesel is SLIGHTLY easier to get, kind of like stateside. EVERY station has gasoline and many have diesel as well. In Mexico you only have Pemex and a black pump handle is diesel. They are also signposted with a black sign for diesel, green for regular and red for super.

The BIG benefit of diesel is it's simplicity. There is very little that can go wrong with a diesel whereas a gasoline can fail in many different areas.

The Toyota diesel engines are also much more popular down here in Central America. I actually find 3B parts laying on the ground at the wreckers!

[joshoisasleep]

Originally Posted by Josie'sLandCruiser

why not a US-spec FZJ80 with factory electric locking diffs? Pay the money State-side to have Aussie-style long-range fuel and H20 tanks installed, as well as an OME heavy-load, low-height suspension installed.

can't argue on the stock lockers. As for other mods though... if your spanish is good get it done down south for cheap.

Why? You could have this whole rig together for about US$10K. Sure, a diesel will get better fuel mileage, but how much $-premium are you willing to pay for that? Besides, my understanding is that petrol (gasoline) is easier to get in Mexico than diesel fuel.

Diesel is easier to find in Mexico than in the US in my experience. And cheaper than gasoline there (half the price of in the US?).
as pointed out above, it's not JUST about mileage. with the stock diesel you've got the same range as the gasser does with the long range tanks. That makes a difference when you're spending all day trying to make it 20km through deep mud, no gas stations in sight...

However the mileage is significant... you get about twice the mileage in a diesel 60 compared to a gas 60... at a conservative 10,000km's per round trip to belize, you're saving at least $1,000 to go there and back alone (assuming $2/km gas, $1/km diesel as in Canada when I left).

Just an idea! If it was possible, I'd vote for a HZJ-75 Troop Carrier!

Not a bad idea. I think one of those could be found in central america... am I wrong? I know they re-released the 70 series in Oz and they can be had new! In fact, I think that would be my rig of choice for said purposes.


P.S. sorry if I sound fanatical... I'm relatively new to diesel and wondering how I ever lived the other way...

[cruiser_guy]

Originally Posted by joshoisasleep

As for other mods though... if your spanish is good get it done down south for cheap.

I'd only get the stuff done down south if your spanish is good, you are in CONSTANT attendance when said work is being performed and you know EXACTLY what you want and are not afraid to have the folks doing the work redo it or change it to suit your thoughts and ideas.

Here in Central America there seems to be the underlying thought that as long as it lasts for today it's good enough. On an expedition, that does NOT cut it. It has to be done well and done right without shortcuts.

There are few Central American mechanics that I'd trust to work on my truck in any area that is critical for reliability.

[1tontoy]

HZJ75's can be bought brand new from a Toyota dealer in Costa Rica...

[rchalmers3]

Pushbutton,

What is your vehicle budget? Might narrow things down a bit.

Rick

[GRM]

IMHO, I would get a truck and try to keep it as stock as possible. If you want a diesel, try and keep it as OEM as possible. A 2" lift, ARB's, and a full floater rear end are good upgrades without going crazy. Its important to be able to buy any part you need anywhere, and not have things special ordered.

If I were doing your trip, I would probably try and get my hands on a BJ 60. Since i'm far too cheap of a person to import one, I'd end up with a really well kept FJ 60. I would try and keep the whole build under 5k, so that my general care for the vehicle is low, just in case something happens.

Just remember, its all about vehicle preservation to make it last for that trip, and many more in the future.

[fernandol]

I love diesels but it might prove to be too expensive once you tackle the hassle of importation or paying for the rarity of a well preserved bj or hj60 in the US.

I'll say get a nice fj60 upgrade the suspension and tires, get a winch and drive south, you can always swap the engine down the line.

I know there are lots of Land Rovers in Belize but I would not go that route

Fernando

[twstrchasr]

Were there also no diesel landrovers in the states? I have heard there were only about 200 110's in North America anyway so you would have to go with a shorter one even if you could find diesel.

LR only "officially" imported 500 D110's into the USA in 1993 (the only year of import here). No diesels were brought over. Today, even rusty ones bring big money and the cleaner they get the price goes up exponentially from there. East Coast Rovers does a diesel conversion on different LR vehicles, D110's included but ECR isn't cheap. They do top rate work though.