Turbo Position

Radd Cruisers · 02-11-05, 01:24 PM

Safari boasts the pulse manifold, equal length runners would be ideal in the real world but prolly not from a manufacturing stand point.

I would like to see a shot of Waynes setup on his 75?

Rob

crushers · 02-11-05, 02:56 PM

i would be willing to take some pics but the wife has the truck and i will not be near a computor for the remainder of the weekend...

lumpy70 · 02-11-05, 09:26 PM

Radd,
Is that a Safari turbo? I thought they weren't available anymore. How much is that kit?

Craig.

Radd Cruisers · 02-11-05, 10:23 PM

Nope thats the Denco unit, using a Switzer turbo.

Radd Cruisers · 02-11-05, 10:26 PM

As mentioned earlier, I like the cast in bung for the piro.

1FE pig · 02-13-05, 12:22 AM

nice setup

fjbj40 · 02-13-05, 09:32 AM

Good to see these pics. I started building my turbo ex. manifold this weekend....using 1/2 x 4 " cold rolled plate for the flange on the head/ turbo mount and schedule 40 weld els for primarys and collector . Patterns and templates are being made so I may build a few to sell....any takers ?Will post pics when finished.
Daryl

brownbear · 02-13-05, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjbj40

Good to see these pics. I started building my turbo ex. manifold this weekend....using 1/2 x 4 " cold rolled plate for the flange on the head/ turbo mount and schedule 40 weld els for primarys and collector . Patterns and templates are being made so I may build a few to sell....any takers ?Will post pics when finished.
Daryl

depends on the price and how it works out with the whole kit. but I am still looking for an option. can't afford the 3k price. I know the kits are good. Just hard to pay for. post the pics of your manifold. I am interested.

lumpy70 · 02-13-05, 07:41 PM

I'm in the process of putting a 13B-T manifold (from G & S Cruiserparts) onto my 3B with a junkyard turbo (Chrysler Lebaron). The only hard part is that there is some fabrication needed to adapt the mounting surfaces. All told I'm in for about $600. I'll post as it comes along.

Craig.

Diescipel · 02-13-05, 07:53 PM

Holy crap that's a great idea! Keep us informed. Will any turbo work with that manifold?

B

lumpy70 · 02-13-05, 08:14 PM

Yes you could put any turbo on, but you want to make sure it's the right turbo for the engine. Someone smarter than me figured it out that a LeBaron Turbo works just about perfectly with the 3B, and a couple of friends are running those turbos very happily. They're about $75 from the local wrecker and a dime a dozen, but a real pain to pull. I've also heard that a CT-26 from the MR2 (specifically the 3GTSE engine) works well too, NOT the Supra one though, too big.

Anyway, all I'm doing is welding a piece of 3/4" cold rolled steel to the mounting surface of the 13B-T manifold (which is a direct bolt up to the 3B), port matching the entrys and mounting it with some 3/8" bolts tapped into the adaptor plate.

You need access to a welder, die grinder, a hole saw preferably on a drill press, and a few basic fab skills. I went through a few designs first which were much more complicated before I came up with this design, which is better.

13B-T manifold from G&S; http://www.gscruiserparts.com/, you'll have to email them direct and it takes a bit to get the manifold from Japan, but I got it and it was new in the box, which was pretty cool.

Craig.

jzilla · 02-14-05, 12:14 AM

U have any pics lumpy?

lumpy70 · 02-14-05, 08:14 AM

Only one good one so far. The above is the 13B-T manifold all shiny and new out of the box, showing the sweet mounting position of the turbo with even lengths for gases from each cylinder to travel to the turbo.

Below is a comparison shot with the stock 3B manifold. Some people have had good luck simply flipping the 3B manifold, I attached a picture from the web of someone who has done this.

Craig.

lumpy70 · 02-14-05, 08:16 AM

here is a better on of the 13B-T manifold:

crushers · 02-14-05, 09:42 AM

damn that is one ugly exhaust fliped setup...
<shiver>

jzilla · 02-16-05, 11:58 PM

Wayne that is funny, but whatever works right.
Thanks for the pics lumpy, I might get one of those too.
Lumpy is that a flange on there u had made? The ct26 from the mr2 would bolt right on there with a different flange it looks like.
john

crushers · 02-17-05, 07:00 AM

true but a little thought would be nice...
that much weight hanging off the manifold with no support?!? now that can not be good...
cheers

lumpy70 · 02-17-05, 08:25 AM

Jzilla,
No that isn't a flange I welded on, that is the stock Toyota surface. I very strongly believe (99% sure) that a CT26 from an MR2 (not, repeat NOT FROM A SUPRA) would bolt right up to that manifold, as Toyota likes to make many of their parts fit one another.

I was looking for an MR2 turbo on ebay (there are plenty) for a while so I could directly bolt it up, but then I decided that the Chrylser T3's are so cheap and so readily available that if my turbo dies I can go pick one from the wrecker for $75 Cdn and have it in the next day.

You (or anyone else) are looking for the CT26 from an MR2 or Celica. Whichever car had the 3GTSE engine. The Supra one (with the 7MGTE engine) is WAY to big for a 3B and it won't spool up properly.

In general, any turbo from a 1.8L to a 2.2L gas engine is perfect for the 3B. This includes some Volvos, Lebarons, some K-Cars, Dodge Shadows, New Yorkers, Daytonas, MR2's, Celicas, possibly a turbo from a 22RE (not quite sure about that) and many others that I can't think of this early in the morning. I think kits for/from some Hondas would work too.

Craig.

lumpy70 · 02-17-05, 08:27 AM

Also, many of the CT26's from the MR2's have twin entry pots, which are different from the mounting surface on the 13B-T manifold. You want the ones with the single round hole.

Craig.

fjbj40 · 02-17-05, 03:42 PM

Just use the alternator oil feed line to feed the turbo and the alternator oil return line as the return for the turbo , just tee into both. Keep it simple , you do not need a dedicated oil resevoir,pump and cooler for your turbo system. You are making a super simple thing complicate by doing that.
If you plan on running 7 psi then an intercooler is not required , the intake charge temp will not be high enough to warrant the pumping loss associated with intercoolers plus the added expense and extra plumbing .
Daryl

cruiser_guy · 02-17-05, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjbj40

Just use the alternator oil feed line to feed the turbo and the alternator oil return line as the return for the turbo , just tee into both. Keep it simple , you do not need a dedicated oil resevoir,pump and cooler for your turbo system. You are making a super simple thing complicate by doing that.
If you plan on running 7 psi then an intercooler is not required , the intake charge temp will not be high enough to warrant the pumping loss associated with intercoolers plus the added expense and extra plumbing .
Daryl

I agree with all this but if I were to run an intercooler I'd get my wastegate signal from the intake manifold so that the intercooler loss would not show up as it would if the wastegate signal was left "as is". This way the turbo might actually produce 10 - 12 psi pre-intercooler but still deliver 7-8 psi (or whatever the wastegate is set to) to the intake manifold. This way you'd get the denser charge from the intercooler and still maintain boost pressure.

A separate oiling system would be a complete waste of time in my opinion as well as making a very simple setup complicated. My oil supply comes from the altenator/vacuum pump and returns to the oil pressure port. I've had NO problems in 100,000kM. I allow the turbo to cool (engine running) until my pyrometer reads less than 400F.

wesintl · 02-17-05, 07:26 PM

Craig.. What is the bolt pattern on that manifold?

tlcruiserman · 02-17-05, 11:01 PM

I new a guy in Tahoe area that had a Garrett T3 on his BJ42 and it seemed to have less power than the AXT, but possible if he was running 7lbs instead of tuned for 9psi that might be the case.

I agree the seperate oil system is over kill and more parts to break, I like the AXT setup running off of the sending unit and return back to the oil filter inlet. I also run an oil cooler on my BJ42 and it helps keep things cool

G'day,

Michael

jzilla · 02-18-05, 12:32 AM

Lumpy I have the ct26 from an mr2 with the dual entry ports.
And it spools up great on my truck. Guess if i got the 13bt manifold i would have to make a different flange, no big deal i guess.
When i put the intercooler in it I did not notice difference in power loss, i noticed decreased temps which is why i wanted it, only cost me 100 bucks or so to buy and install.
And Wayne it could definitely use supports! Maybe he has some on there now.

Island Moose · 02-18-05, 10:55 AM

My suggestion on the separate oiling system is just born out of a concern over 15w40 diesel oil not being the best oil for the turbo, especially once it's saturated with soot. But I'm willing to be convinced otherwise, and keeping it simple makes sense financially.

cruiser_guy · 02-18-05, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moose_sv1000s

My suggestion on the separate oiling system is just born out of a concern over 15w40 diesel oil not being the best oil for the turbo, especially once it's saturated with soot. But I'm willing to be convinced otherwise, and keeping it simple makes sense financially.

Ideally you should use full synthetic but that gets expensive with oil changes are recommended intervals (and I'm not convinced that extended change intervals are a good idea). Full synthetic has a higher coking temperature than regular dyno oil. There is 15W-40 dyno oil that is approved by the manufacturers for turbo applications.

BJ40 3B · 02-20-05, 02:43 PM

I Have both settings, flipped manifold on a B engine and original manifold with the flange welded to the center of the manifold on a 3B engine.
Both settings work great, but the welded flange makes a cleaner install.
Here are some pics.

Diescipel · 02-20-05, 06:50 PM

BJ40 3B--

What turbos are you using in each build?

B

BJ40 3B · 02-21-05, 09:03 AM

On the B engine i have a K16 and on the 3B it's a K24, both from KKK and both are intercooled.

Diesel Dude · 03-05-05, 02:15 PM

Knew to this forum... THE FORUM ROCKS>> >>> The turbo information is good. I recently installed a Turbo on my BJ-42. It bolted right on to the manifold. No modification. The turbo came from an mid 80's Dodge D-50 diesel. I am boosting a safe 10 pounds and everything seems to run smoothly. This is a mitsubishi turbo however unlike the 2.2L mitsubishi gas turbos no coolant is required to be run through this turbo. A major bonus. With a diesel there is no need to run the coolant through the turbo so that is one less step to do the whole thing took about a day.

02-11-05, 01:24 PM	#1
Radd Cruisers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 3,831	Turbo Position Safari boasts the pulse manifold, equal length runners would be ideal in the real world but prolly not from a manufacturing stand point. I would like to see a shot of Waynes setup on his 75? Rob Attached Images __________________ Come and visit us in Duncan, BC www.raddcruisers.ca --> 60 Series Cable Lockers available - 4.11s or 3.70s - handles and cables included --> 12HT & H55F combos available - complete & running --> in stock and ready to go.

02-11-05, 02:56 PM	#2
crushers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 9,793	i would be willing to take some pics but the wife has the truck and i will not be near a computor for the remainder of the weekend... __________________ pulling this info out of my ass so take it with a pound of salt "People are poor because they don't spend money wisely, tough sh!t !!! " John Galt 09/22/08 "educate yourself. Sorry if that seems too blunt." John Galt 11-01-08 Wayne in Ontario http://www.ivoac.ca join today

02-11-05, 09:26 PM	#3
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	Radd, Is that a Safari turbo? I thought they weren't available anymore. How much is that kit? Craig. __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-11-05, 10:23 PM	#4
Radd Cruisers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 3,831	Nope thats the Denco unit, using a Switzer turbo. __________________ Come and visit us in Duncan, BC www.raddcruisers.ca --> 60 Series Cable Lockers available - 4.11s or 3.70s - handles and cables included --> 12HT & H55F combos available - complete & running --> in stock and ready to go.

02-11-05, 10:26 PM	#5
Radd Cruisers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 3,831	As mentioned earlier, I like the cast in bung for the piro. Attached Images __________________ Come and visit us in Duncan, BC www.raddcruisers.ca --> 60 Series Cable Lockers available - 4.11s or 3.70s - handles and cables included --> 12HT & H55F combos available - complete & running --> in stock and ready to go.

02-13-05, 12:22 AM	#6
1FE pig IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Helena MT TLCA# 15226 Posts: 220	nice setup __________________ Big man Pig man Ha ha charade you are

02-13-05, 09:32 AM	#7
fjbj40 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: east coast Canada Posts: 369	Good to see these pics. I started building my turbo ex. manifold this weekend....using 1/2 x 4 " cold rolled plate for the flange on the head/ turbo mount and schedule 40 weld els for primarys and collector . Patterns and templates are being made so I may build a few to sell....any takers ?Will post pics when finished. Daryl __________________ 74 fj/bj40 88 fj/bj62 , full OME lift kit , home brew turbo , 4 runner brakes .

02-13-05, 07:41 PM	#9
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	I'm in the process of putting a 13B-T manifold (from G & S Cruiserparts) onto my 3B with a junkyard turbo (Chrysler Lebaron). The only hard part is that there is some fabrication needed to adapt the mounting surfaces. All told I'm in for about $600. I'll post as it comes along. Craig. __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-13-05, 07:53 PM	#10
Diescipel IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: 95570 TLCA# 14854 Posts: 841	Holy crap that's a great idea! Keep us informed. Will any turbo work with that manifold? B __________________ Brendan 1983 BJ42 bioD, lots o' Aqualu, TIC Parabolics/DT8000s, Tuffy, 33x9.5 BFG ATs, SOLD

02-13-05, 08:14 PM	#11
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	Yes you could put any turbo on, but you want to make sure it's the right turbo for the engine. Someone smarter than me figured it out that a LeBaron Turbo works just about perfectly with the 3B, and a couple of friends are running those turbos very happily. They're about $75 from the local wrecker and a dime a dozen, but a real pain to pull. I've also heard that a CT-26 from the MR2 (specifically the 3GTSE engine) works well too, NOT the Supra one though, too big. Anyway, all I'm doing is welding a piece of 3/4" cold rolled steel to the mounting surface of the 13B-T manifold (which is a direct bolt up to the 3B), port matching the entrys and mounting it with some 3/8" bolts tapped into the adaptor plate. You need access to a welder, die grinder, a hole saw preferably on a drill press, and a few basic fab skills. I went through a few designs first which were much more complicated before I came up with this design, which is better. 13B-T manifold from G&S; http://www.gscruiserparts.com/, you'll have to email them direct and it takes a bit to get the manifold from Japan, but I got it and it was new in the box, which was pretty cool. Craig. __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-14-05, 12:14 AM	#12
jzilla IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: N Vancouver, BC Posts: 267	U have any pics lumpy? __________________ 81 BJ60 turbo, intercooler, snorkel, etc.

02-14-05, 08:14 AM	#13
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	Only one good one so far. The above is the 13B-T manifold all shiny and new out of the box, showing the sweet mounting position of the turbo with even lengths for gases from each cylinder to travel to the turbo. Below is a comparison shot with the stock 3B manifold. Some people have had good luck simply flipping the 3B manifold, I attached a picture from the web of someone who has done this. Craig. Attached Images __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-14-05, 08:16 AM	#14
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	here is a better on of the 13B-T manifold: Attached Images __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-14-05, 09:42 AM	#15
crushers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 9,793	damn that is one ugly exhaust fliped setup... <shiver> __________________ pulling this info out of my ass so take it with a pound of salt "People are poor because they don't spend money wisely, tough sh!t !!! " John Galt 09/22/08 "educate yourself. Sorry if that seems too blunt." John Galt 11-01-08 Wayne in Ontario http://www.ivoac.ca join today

02-16-05, 11:58 PM	#16
jzilla IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: N Vancouver, BC Posts: 267	Wayne that is funny, but whatever works right. Thanks for the pics lumpy, I might get one of those too. Lumpy is that a flange on there u had made? The ct26 from the mr2 would bolt right on there with a different flange it looks like. john __________________ 81 BJ60 turbo, intercooler, snorkel, etc.

02-17-05, 07:26 PM	#22
wesintl IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Denver TLCA# 4180 Posts: 3,586	Craig.. What is the bolt pattern on that manifold? __________________ 1964 FJ40 \| 1966 M416 \| 1976 FJ40 \| 1985 BJ70 Volvo Power\| 1997 FZJ80 \| TDI commuter car Rising Sun; Former CLCC You should be able to delete your own thread. Communists abound Real Change is here --> Cato Institute

02-17-05, 07:00 AM	#17
crushers IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 9,793	true but a little thought would be nice... that much weight hanging off the manifold with no support?!? now that can not be good... cheers __________________ pulling this info out of my ass so take it with a pound of salt "People are poor because they don't spend money wisely, tough sh!t !!! " John Galt 09/22/08 "educate yourself. Sorry if that seems too blunt." John Galt 11-01-08 Wayne in Ontario http://www.ivoac.ca join today

02-17-05, 08:25 AM	#18
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	Jzilla, No that isn't a flange I welded on, that is the stock Toyota surface. I very strongly believe (99% sure) that a CT26 from an MR2 (not, repeat NOT FROM A SUPRA) would bolt right up to that manifold, as Toyota likes to make many of their parts fit one another. I was looking for an MR2 turbo on ebay (there are plenty) for a while so I could directly bolt it up, but then I decided that the Chrylser T3's are so cheap and so readily available that if my turbo dies I can go pick one from the wrecker for $75 Cdn and have it in the next day. You (or anyone else) are looking for the CT26 from an MR2 or Celica. Whichever car had the 3GTSE engine. The Supra one (with the 7MGTE engine) is WAY to big for a 3B and it won't spool up properly. In general, any turbo from a 1.8L to a 2.2L gas engine is perfect for the 3B. This includes some Volvos, Lebarons, some K-Cars, Dodge Shadows, New Yorkers, Daytonas, MR2's, Celicas, possibly a turbo from a 22RE (not quite sure about that) and many others that I can't think of this early in the morning. I think kits for/from some Hondas would work too. Craig. __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-17-05, 08:27 AM	#19
lumpy70 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Calgary Posts: 421	Also, many of the CT26's from the MR2's have twin entry pots, which are different from the mounting surface on the 13B-T manifold. You want the ones with the single round hole. Craig. __________________ Sadly no longer owning a 70 1993 HDJ81 TLCA # 13682

02-17-05, 03:42 PM	#20
fjbj40 IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: east coast Canada Posts: 369	Just use the alternator oil feed line to feed the turbo and the alternator oil return line as the return for the turbo , just tee into both. Keep it simple , you do not need a dedicated oil resevoir,pump and cooler for your turbo system. You are making a super simple thing complicate by doing that. If you plan on running 7 psi then an intercooler is not required , the intake charge temp will not be high enough to warrant the pumping loss associated with intercoolers plus the added expense and extra plumbing . Daryl __________________ 74 fj/bj40 88 fj/bj62 , full OME lift kit , home brew turbo , 4 runner brakes .

02-17-05, 11:01 PM	#23
tlcruiserman IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: San Diego, CA USA TLCA# 7932 Posts: 1,078	I new a guy in Tahoe area that had a Garrett T3 on his BJ42 and it seemed to have less power than the AXT, but possible if he was running 7lbs instead of tuned for 9psi that might be the case. I agree the seperate oil system is over kill and more parts to break, I like the AXT setup running off of the sending unit and return back to the oil filter inlet. I also run an oil cooler on my BJ42 and it helps keep things cool G'day, Michael __________________ Michael tlcruiserman@westcoastcruisers.com West Coast Cruisers Incorporated

02-18-05, 12:32 AM	#24
jzilla IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: N Vancouver, BC Posts: 267	Lumpy I have the ct26 from an mr2 with the dual entry ports. And it spools up great on my truck. Guess if i got the 13bt manifold i would have to make a different flange, no big deal i guess. When i put the intercooler in it I did not notice difference in power loss, i noticed decreased temps which is why i wanted it, only cost me 100 bucks or so to buy and install. And Wayne it could definitely use supports! Maybe he has some on there now. __________________ 81 BJ60 turbo, intercooler, snorkel, etc. Last edited by jzilla; 02-18-05 at 12:37 AM.

02-18-05, 10:55 AM	#25
Island Moose IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Auckland NZ via Vancouver Island Canada Posts: 818	My suggestion on the separate oiling system is just born out of a concern over 15w40 diesel oil not being the best oil for the turbo, especially once it's saturated with soot. But I'm willing to be convinced otherwise, and keeping it simple makes sense financially. __________________ MOOSE SOLD HER - SOMEDAY SOON JDM's...THEY SAVED THE BEST FOR THEMSELVES!!

02-20-05, 02:43 PM	#27
BJ40 3B IH8MUD Junior Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 87	I Have both settings, flipped manifold on a B engine and original manifold with the flange welded to the center of the manifold on a 3B engine. Both settings work great, but the welded flange makes a cleaner install. Here are some pics.

02-20-05, 06:50 PM	#28
Diescipel IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: 95570 TLCA# 14854 Posts: 841	BJ40 3B-- What turbos are you using in each build? B __________________ Brendan 1983 BJ42 bioD, lots o' Aqualu, TIC Parabolics/DT8000s, Tuffy, 33x9.5 BFG ATs, SOLD

02-21-05, 09:03 AM	#29
BJ40 3B IH8MUD Junior Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 87	On the B engine i have a K16 and on the 3B it's a K24, both from KKK and both are intercooled.

03-05-05, 02:15 PM	#30
Diesel Dude IH8MUD Junior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Calgary TLCA# 11470 Posts: 154	Knew to this forum... THE FORUM ROCKS>> >>> The turbo information is good. I recently installed a Turbo on my BJ-42. It bolted right on to the manifold. No modification. The turbo came from an mid 80's Dodge D-50 diesel. I am boosting a safe 10 pounds and everything seems to run smoothly. This is a mitsubishi turbo however unlike the 2.2L mitsubishi gas turbos no coolant is required to be run through this turbo. A major bonus. With a diesel there is no need to run the coolant through the turbo so that is one less step to do the whole thing took about a day.