3B in a cradle (EDIC wiring question) (1 Viewer)

[DanS HJ-45]

OK, so here's some quick background on "the project..."

My Dad has a 1979 FJ-40 that is very nice, clean, straight, and has a nicely smogged 2F/H42 drivetrain. It's only problem is that it gets the same bad mileage that the F series do, and it burns petroleum. So, Dad bought a 3B/H55f from SOR a little while ago to swap into his 40.

I'm hoping to actually swap the engine/trans/transfer case into the truck perhaps in November (there'll be a real build thread, probably in the 40 section, when that happens).

But in the meantime, I figure why don't I at least make sure the engine runs while it's in the wooden cradle it sits in. It would sure make me feel better about swapping it in knowing that it already runs (and more precisely that I can figure out how to wire it), and it would make me feel better about stripping it down to paint it later.

So basically, it's a 3B (with a Safari turbo already installed) from an Australian BJ-73. Visual inspection shows it to be in decent shape, and I don't really worry about the engines SOR sells. Here it is for a general overview if it helps anyone identify anything in particular on it...

The EDIC on it has four wires. I'm not exactly sure what they do, or what they don't do, so I'm hoping someone has a diagram from the BJ-73 to clear this up. It doesn't seem to match my BJ-40 wiring schematics.

More tomorrow. My camera battery died, but I've been busy making cables to run from a battery to the starter, the glow plugs (and a relay to control the GPs), as well as a small control panel to control all of this. All I want to do is start the engine, idle it, and maybe rev it quickly once or twice just to hear it's general health and stuff. I'm not even planning on hooking up a radiator or anything, as it will not be running more than a minute or two if I'm successful.

If I wanted to plumb in a mechanical oil pressure gauge, would it be easiest to remove the oil pressure sender and put it there, or has anyone tried using the toyota oil pressure sender to run a plain american oil psi gauge? I did fill it with oil today, but I obviously don't want to damage the engine and a gauge would sure be nice, since we don't really know anything about the health of the engine, other than Marv said it was a good one (which I believe).

Dan

 

[Joe Egolf]

Dan , I think you might ste edic settings manually to test run your engine see attached 3b engine manual page ref edic controlls

 

[DanS HJ-45]

So, judging by this (and the -40 manual, which includes the BJ wiring, but not that matches this engine) the four wires to the EDIC are probably GND, ON, START, and OIL???

Does the EDIC use the same oil pressure sender, or is there a separate oil pressure switch to worry about? I'd be tempted to leave that system inoperative (since I don't have a problem watching my needle to protect the engine), but it could be useful as a kill switch or just to make it work like it's "supposed" to.

Dan

PS-sent you an e-mail Joe

 

[TURNMEOVER]

the edic is simple if you have all the parts. First you need to source a fuel relay for the edic. It requires 3 separate + inputs , Oil presure input and a ground. I believe the wire diag is the same on the 2h also . I refered to mt fsm and the 60 and 75 use the same edic. Cannot post pics as I have it in a pdf not a jpeg file . Sorry

 

[DanS HJ-45]

What does the Fuel Control Relay do that the EDIC motor doesn't? I assume it just sorts out a few inputs and then commands the EDIC motor.

I might go see if my HJ-45 has a fuel control relay that will work (as I do have an EDIC) just for grins and giggles.

Dan

 

[Joe Egolf]

jpegs sent

Dan I sent you copies of the other 2 pages from my 3b manual to your regular email.

 

[DanS HJ-45]

OK, so from the stuff Joe sent me (thanks again!) it appears that the fuel control relay basically does some pretty simple things...

1)Commands the EDIC motor to turn ON when it needs to move
2)Forwards the signal to the EDIC as to the selected position
3)Turns the EDIC motor OFF when it reaches the selected position
4)Cuts the fuel off if the oil pressure drops

I'm going to head up to the shop now to go see if the HJ-45 uses the same system, because I might just have a fuel control relay that I can use to test all this out....

But in the long run it looks like I need to get my hands on a fuel control relay for this, plus the plugs for the EDIC motor and the fuel control relay (well, I could do without the EDIC motor plug, but it would be nice). I think it's time to call up $OR or some Canuckian cruiser shops...

Dan

 

[DanS HJ-45]

OK, while the fuel control relay I need is in the process of being procured (28590-56090), I'm going to try to run it without the EDIC, just me moving the lever with my hand.

But before I go make a lot of noise (and potentially screw stuff up) I want to make sure I've got the positions correct....

Overinject (for starting)

Run

Stop

It appears that the overinject position is pushing on a plunger of some sort when it is pulled back, and it is spring loaded to the "run" position. You have to actually push against a spring to either stop the engine or overinject for starting.

Is that making sense? If it is, then hopefully it'll be clattering later tonight.

If everything goes wrong, then just covering the intake fully should cause it to shut off right? I'm sure I could pull the fuel line off, so it couldn't get new fuel, but I'm sure it would run on the fuel in the filter for a very long time (my hilux half cut ran for 10+ minutes on the fuel in the filter).

Dan

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Let's try those attachments again...

Dan

 

[lostmarbles]

I don't want to be a "kill-joy" here but I thought you could start and run our diesels without bothering to connect up the EDIC at all.

I thought that by just removing the "fuel control rod" the injector pump lever would spring into its "run" position. And that while it is true that when you crank it - without the EDIC working - it won't move the lever to the "start" position (and thus give extra fuel to make starting easier) - it WILL STILL START AND RUN (provided the plugs have been glowed of course). And once started - I thought the engine couldn't care less that the EDIC is disconnected. --- It will behave just the same EXCEPT FOR NOT HAVING ANY "LOW OIL PRESSURE PROTECTION" (and that you won't be able to stop it unless you manually move the fuel control lever into the "stop" position).

Opening and closing the throttle butterfly (normally done with your foot via the accelerator) will still revv up and slow down the engine via the diaphragm on the injector pump.

So unless I'm wrong here - I wouldn't bother with wiring up the EDIC at all simply for a brief test run of an engine in a cradle.

I've never actually tried starting/running my engine like this - but I can do so if you want. (All I need to do is remove my control rod - Then glow it and try starting it!)

PS. If you have a helper (which would be advisable anyway to shut it down quickly in the event that it revs-to-its-limit on start-up - which it can do in certain fault-conditions) - you could get them to move the lever to "start" manually as you crank it. (but as I say - I don't think that's necessary).

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Lostmarbles:

That's exactly the point of the system. If all electrical fails, then the it should fail to the "ON" position. Brilliant really.

I'm more concerned with the long term installation in the truck, for that I want a working EDIC, just because it's "right." For the test in the cradle, I'm happy to try it without a working EDIC just to see if it works. And then I'll wire up the fuel control relay and EDIC just to make sure I understand the wiring thereof before I go about taking the truck apart (just to minimize it's downtime).

I'm just double checking that I'm reading the manual right: STOP is full forward, and START is full back, with RUN being in the middle (and the default position).

Dan

 

[lostmarbles]

Lostmarbles:

That's exactly the point of the system. If all electrical fails, then the it should fail to the "ON" position. Brilliant really.

I'm more concerned with the long term installation in the truck, for that I want a working EDIC, just because it's "right." For the test in the cradle, I'm happy to try it without a working EDIC just to see if it works. And then I'll wire up the fuel control relay and EDIC just to make sure I understand the wiring thereof before I go about taking the truck apart (just to minimize it's downtime).

I'm just double checking that I'm reading the manual right: STOP is full forward, and START is full back, with RUN being in the middle (and the default position).

Dan

Ooops. Sorry. I didn't realise.

The reason for my mistake is that the extra-wide page width of this thread means that all the text doesn't automatically appear on my screen. Sorry I missed some of what was said.

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Success!

If I can figure out how to upload a video of it running I would.

Manually moving the fuel control worked like a charm. It started right up, idles nicely and sounds REALLY healthy. The turbo whine on it is awesome too.

Got to figure out how to upload that video somewhere... Maybe I'll actually open a YouTube account...

Dan

 

[Joe Egolf]

Would love to see the video

 

[DanS HJ-45]

It's currently "processing." Can't see it just yet, but it should be up sometime soon. I don't know what that means, as it's the first video I've ever uploaded, ever.

EDIT--it's up.

Toyota 3B/Safari Turbo test run

Dan

 

[pappy]

Dan,

Too bad I have a dead sound card. Guess I'll need to watch this at work. Love the cloud of smoke.

Rat

 

[79fj40moneypit]

Sounds good ,feels good running it for the first time, I started mine on a trailer tied down with straps. Good Luck!

 

[DanS HJ-45]

Too bad I have a dead sound card. Guess I'll need to watch this at work. Love the cloud of smoke.

If Dad and I weren't heading out to Aztec today in one of the Power Wagons, I'd invite you to come up and hear it in person. The video does a pretty good job of capturing the sound though. I sound funny on it though--pay no attention to that.

Sounds good ,feels good running it for the first time, I started mine on a trailer tied down with straps. Good Luck!

Yes it does. Especially hearing that it sounds healthy. Quite the peace of mind when it comes time to actually install it in the truck.

Dan

 

[pappy]

If Dad and I weren't heading out to Aztec today in one of the Power Wagons, I'd invite you to come up and hear it in person. The video does a pretty good job of capturing the sound though. I sound funny on it though--pay no attention to that.

Dan, sounds good. Great project. Get'er done! But I think you have gone diesel happy.

 

[lostmarbles]

Sounds nice Dan?

Surely that video can't have been its very first start? (Started too easy!)