isuzu 4BD1T swap?!

[ozwick]

Originally Posted by euclid

Very cool. about $1400 in kit cost?



Did you decide on the 4l60, then go find one, or did you use it because you had it? Wondering why you didn't use a 4L




Same crossmemember, same driveshafts! Wow that is exciting.

Room in front for an intercooler?

Is the 62 on stock springs right now?

Great job, thanks for pioneering for us 62 guys.

Euclid,

I have a 90 FJ62 and have the same questions. I was leaning towards the cummins but now this seems way more attractive and cost effective?

Lift, any additional needed over stock? No oil pan mods?

Thanks,

ozwick

[88tlc]

the isuzu diesel swapper adapter is $650

the AA 700r4 to the Toyota trans case, is a similarly priced.

4L60 was just what I found that was non electric. this was a good truck case, better reliability than a 700R4, but was able to mount to the two adapters. 4L80, my understanding was there were electrically controlled? You can get a computer module to control it, but that is also another chunk of cash.

[hks3sgte]

Good progress... when are you planning on driving it?

[RAYJON]

any updates... ????

[RHINO]

yeah i got an update,,,, still averaging 26MPG on 37's.

[RAYJON]

NEW IDEA... earlier in this thread it was posted that some npr's have allison tranmissions, depending on which allison was put in what about the adapers in the newer chevy pickups that mate the allison to the transfer case in them. ??? may be another route to go in looking for adapters for 60's and 80's...

[dieselcruiserhead]

Hopefully Bill (the88tlc) will see this and post some pics.. Yet another of my cameras shit the bed, again :sad: Anyway, we got his 4BD1T mounted pretty much completely last night into his 88 62. The mounts are very similar to my first Cummins 4BT mounts on the frame at least, 4" angle, gussetted. We are using Ford liquid filled (I think) mounts that look like mini-versions of the 4BT mounts. They are perfect actualy and should isolate well. We had to move the t case back about an inch and therefore drop it about an inch. The oil pan is a little close to the axle, it is definetely a slight shoe horn. Being able to move it back another inch or two would have been nice but not possible without major doghouse modification, but it fits in nice. The engine sits very well in the engine bay. This is with the 4L60 aka 700Rr trans this is the situation. The trans is short but the adapter is fairly long at about 6" long easily. So this makes the trans-setup fairly long. In general though the whole setup really is nice and that is just a killer engine. I have a little left fab with with the 1" dropped crossmember but the front mounts are all done and look good. I'm sure you all will see pics soon

Cheers,
Andre

[Dougal]

Originally Posted by RAYJON

NEW IDEA... earlier in this thread it was posted that some npr's have allison tranmissions, depending on which allison was put in what about the adapers in the newer chevy pickups that mate the allison to the transfer case in them. ??? may be another route to go in looking for adapters for 60's and 80's...

I think they might be AISIN rather than Allison. There was one up on ebay a while ago.

[ozwick]

dieselcruiserhead,

So with the isuzu conversion does the FJ 62 stock suspension height work out or is additional lift needed like the cummins?

ozwick

[dieselcruiserhead]

The lift is nice breathing room and I would almost say its required unfortunately. This one has brand new OME. If you have a shorter transmission again then I think you might be OK and can move it back an inch or two to have some additional room. I will post pics on the clearances as soon as I have some. Thanks guys, Andre

[andrew.fletcher]

Andre-
One suggestion I've been given is trimming the right front of the oil pan a bit to help with the clearance of the pumpkin. Still debating that one though. Have to wait and see once it's in the truck. Thoughts?

[Dougal]

Originally Posted by andrew.fletcher

Andre-
One suggestion I've been given is trimming the right front of the oil pan a bit to help with the clearance of the pumpkin. Still debating that one though. Have to wait and see once it's in the truck. Thoughts?

There's no real scope on my engine to do that. Creative panel-beating maybe, but not really trimming.

[dieselcruiserhead]

We or at least I am strongly considering it. Both options (trim or beat). The bummer would be simply pulling the pan but it is a possibility... Our other thought is let the axle bang it up once or twice a little and then it should be OK Again it is close but not that bad.. With 4" of lift I think we'd be in much better shape but it does fit with OME and slightly taller than stock height shackles...

[Dieseltim]

Has anyone here tried using the oem bell housing from the isuzu 5 sp and then adapt that to another tranny? I have seen some of the adapter companys offering an adapter that gave me this idea. If I can use the oem isuzu bell housing and clutch pressure plate, then all I have to do is have a clutch disk made with the center to fit my tranny that I have (T-5), and then I can use my dana-300 transfer case just like it was in my CJ7 jeep when it had the 4 cyl. What do you guys think? I know several ideas have been looked at before, has anyone else followed this line of thinking before?Dieseltim

[Dougal]

Originally Posted by Dieseltim

Has anyone here tried using the oem bell housing from the isuzu 5 sp and then adapt that to another tranny? I have seen some of the adapter companys offering an adapter that gave me this idea. If I can use the oem isuzu bell housing and clutch pressure plate, then all I have to do is have a clutch disk made with the center to fit my tranny that I have (T-5), and then I can use my dana-300 transfer case just like it was in my CJ7 jeep when it had the 4 cyl. What do you guys think? I know several ideas have been looked at before, has anyone else followed this line of thinking before?Dieseltim

I think Bram and I discussed that earlier in this thread. The Isuzu gearbox bellhousing is also the front housing of the gearbox. It could work, but I think a better solution is to use the Isuzu box and adapt a gearlever to it.
If you're after a manual that is.

[ThePookieBear]

Has anyone figured up what kind of mpg figures you could expect with 33's and a revalved/beefed up a440 vs. a 4L60 or 700R4? Just wondering.

[euclid]

Originally Posted by ThePookieBear

Has anyone figured up what kind of mpg figures you could expect with 33's and a revalved/beefed up a440 vs. a 4L60 or 700R4? Just wondering.

I doubt there would be a significant difference.

[rtarh2o]

I considered an a440 trans for my conversion. I believe I found out that the overdrive in the a440's was very similar to the 700R4. I can't remember the exact numbers but the 700R4 is .70 so the a440 I think was around .73 or something. The a442 in my 94 was more like .78 or something. After pricing and rebuilding both transmissions it was easy to decide on the 700R4, I got a rebuilt heavy duty diesel specific 700R4 for about $900 including a core and torque converter. You can't get anywhere near that with the a440.
Rusty

[ThePookieBear]

Thats probably true, and I'm not bashing your decision I simply don't know the answer to my next question. Is the 700R4 as sturdy with as much longevity as the a440? No offense of course. Just wondering.

[RAYJON]

rebuild an a440...used ones are cheep because there is no demand...aka they last forever....

[orangefj45]

the biggest reason why an A440 series auto would ever need a rebuild is because the splines on the output shaft wear out. besides that, they're as close to bullet proof as an auto gets.
one other problem though: not too many "rebuilders" actually know all that much about rebuilding them. they just last too long for anybody to get lots of practice building them.......

[rtarh2o]

I would look into the cost of the A440 rebuild, if I already had one I probably would have gone that route. In my case I had the A442 so I was going to have to buy the A440 and have it rebuilt. The 700R4's were not very good when they first came out, especially with the torque of the diesel. Since then the problems have been fixed with the heavy duty rebuild kits. I know a guy who uses one in his truck he hauls cars with and he says he gets about 200,000 miles out of them. I actually bought mine from the guy who builds his for him.
You can buy a rebuilt 700R4 for around $1,000, not sure how much more the A440 rebuild is going to cost you but I don't think you can get it rebuilt for anywhere near that. Probably for the cost of the A440 rebuild you can buy a 700R4 and the adapter to install it. I don't anticipate any problems with the 700R4 but at least I know if anything happens I can go to any transmission shop and get it fixed quickly for not much money.
I think you will be ok either way you go, good luck.
Rusty

[88tlc]

isuzu diesel, 4L60, toyota transfer case is in the engine compartment.

I have been busy getting it to run, but wanted to fill in some of the steps

andre dieselcruiserhead helped me with the mounts. we got these in place, and they look great. we added a small gusset on the frame pads for extra strength.

using the stock crossmember, in stock location, dropped about 1.25 inches. the adapter has a different hole pattern, presumably for a trans mount from a fj60. I found one of these unique style of these that fits the fj62 crossmember flat bottom, and a fj60 upper v shaped. it still did not fit, it was like a half a hole off, and no extra material for custom fitting. I question if one set of holes are off - the adapter or the mount.

So, with modification required regardless, I used the fj62 mount, and welded a strap to this to mount about 1 inch farther back.

[88tlc]

the 4l60 transmission requires only a key few hookups to the landcruiser.

1. shifter linkage - I was successful in using the stock shifter, and the stock linkage bell cranks. the only mod was lengthening the linkage, and revising the trans bell crank to fit on the larger diameter shifter shaft. the gating, and the length of the linkage arms stayed the same! the gear positions is very similar between 440f and 4l60. some items I learned along the way to pass on. start at neutral for lining up the shifter and the trans shifting, to get the most accurate location. for fine tuning, use the bolt that attaches the shifter lever, to the bell crank going through the floor.

2. the TV cable - like most auto trans, the TV throttle valve requires a linkage to the throttle. I had to modify the isuzu throttle linkage to get more travel, as the isuzu throttle travel, from idle to FWO is 30 mm, the TV cable travel is 40mm. so we simply added a bracket to increase the radius, thus adding a longer arc.

3. Lockup - this requires only power, and the ground then needs to go through a brake switch. a new switch is required, a fj80 cruise control style switch. this switch is really two switches - when the brake is pushed, the brake light cirquit is completed, the cruise (or in my case the lockup cirquit) is opened.

4. coolant lines - I used the existing lines as they are burly 10mm lines. i had to adapt to the trans though, they were a smaller 5/16 line connector. I had the evco house of hose guys make some hydraulic lines, and then had to use a steel compression fitting.

[88tlc]

this is some of the most difficult issues to resolve for me. the landcruiser as I understand uses different fittings and lines, than the isuzu. the 4l60 was yet another standard.

1. powersteering - utilized most of the landcruiser lines, with a flex line to the isuzu hard line. I used a compression fitting using a steel ring instead of a brass one, and did very well. this also helps in reducing issues with biodiesel and veg oil reacting with brass.

2. trans coolant - hydraulic flex line used to toyota lines, but had to remove the fittings, and replace with compression fittings.

3. fuel line - I used the hard steel lines already in place, and added a crimped on fitting to the isuzu banjo fitting. i also removed the fuel pump in the tank. i added a inline fuel pump, i will add other photos of this. I only have the one isuzu fuel filter inline at the moment.

4. vacuum - easy from vac pump to brake booster, and 4wd control, see electrical photos.

[88tlc]

I used many of orangefj45, aka astr suggestions and knowledge to figure out the electrical.

1. alternator - i took apart the toyota alternator connector, and replaces the spade connector into the isuzu connector. it clicks into place and looks factory!

2. batteries - made a battery box, and installed two batteries, using cable that I could but adding some new from the battery to the starter. also looks factory.

that is where the factory look ends!

3. oil sending - ripped the wire out of the harness and used current oil sending unit. do I trust a 20 year old sending unit from the landcruiser engine? it works, but i question the sending unit. NOTE: this is also a slightly different thread - like a 10mm thread, instead of a NPT thread.

4. water temp - found the wire, and connected to the temp sending unit.

5. glow plugs - i have a simple push on switch for glowplugs, and a relay to send juice to the glowplugs.

Still to work on....
6. isuzu shut off -- I have the shut off enrichment motor, but since astr has not figured out how to incorporate into a landcruiser ignition switch, I have not installed. I have a manual shut off cable, installed where the throttle cable used to be.

7. tach - I intend to use a Autometer tach, using a alternator pick up, and install the tach into the current hole.

8. terminating harness - what should I do with all the rest? I lopped the rest of the wires off , what is best for terminating? liquid tape, or pull them into the cabin? it is ugly at the moment, but runs!

9. reverse lights? - the landcruiser had the neutral switch and reverse lights switch on the trans. not the 4l60. i looped the neutral, but how do I rig up reverse lights?