Prince William County, Virginia wants to bar illegal aliens from library...

OZCAL · 07-14-07, 06:15 PM

Wow. Get ready to present your passport before using the library or the pool...

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...la-home-center

OZCAL · 07-14-07, 06:17 PM

I cut/pasted in case the LATimes is password only:

By Claudia Lauer, Times Staff Writer
July 14, 2007

WASHINGTON — Using a municipal swimming pool or checking out a library book could soon be against the law for illegal immigrants living in Prince William County, Va.

The county's Board of Supervisors unanimously passed a resolution this week that aims to ban illegal immigrants from receiving most government-funded services, as well as increase enforcement of immigration laws at a local level.

The resolution, if it withstands legal challenges, would be among the toughest of a growing number of resolutions in the country seeking to deter illegal immigration.

The issue has been "simmering for the past couple years, and it's come to the forefront now because of the federal failure to really address the immigration issue and because of the public outcry of our constituents," Supervisor John T. Stirrup Jr said.

The resolution was introduced by Stirrup and was a weakened version of the one he originally sought. The initial version asked that all public services be denied to illegal immigrants.

The county attorney warned that federal law prohibited excluding illegal immigrants from receiving some government services, such as emergency medical care.

The new resolution asks all county agencies to report back later this year with lists of services that can be denied, can't be denied and those that are at the discretion of officials. It also directs the Police Department to determine the immigration status of individuals who are legally detained when there is probable cause for such a check, and to come up with a standard for determining probable cause.

The original resolution would have required officers to verify immigration status even on traffic stops.

With the latest effort to rewrite federal immigration laws failing recently in the Senate, municipal and county governments are becoming impatient and increasingly are addressing the issue at the local level, said Kathleen Walker, national president of the American Immigration Lawyers Assn. But, she added, few have gone as far as Prince William County.

"They are seeking to root out any possible benefit they might be able to cut off from someone, no matter what their age, because they are not here on a documented status," she said.

"The cruelty of this is just astounding."

But Stirrup, whose resolution said illegal immigration causes "economic hardship and lawlessness" in his community, has stoutly defended the measure as "the first step toward taking back our community."

Prince William County, with a population estimated at 280,000 in the 2000 census, is about 30 miles west of Washington. Its main city is Manassas; the area was the site of the bloody Civil War battles of Bull Run.

Walker said several chapters of the immigration lawyers group were reviewing the resolution and would closely monitor the ordinances that could result after the county agencies report back to the board. These reviews could then result in legal challenges.

The resolution spawned a passionate debate. More than 100 people testified on the measure before it was passed Tuesday.

"It's going to mean a lot of fear; the resolution is already having a tremendous impact on the community," said Teresita Jacinto, a volunteer organizer for the Woodbridge Workers Committee, a group that formed to offer support to the area's growing immigrant community.

"People are considering pulling their children out from school," Jacinto said. "Several people have called me to ask if their children are safe by being in school, asking can I guarantee that no one is going to take them away."

Defenders of the resolution included members of a group named Help Save Manassas.

One member, Sue Fleming, was quoted by the Washington Post as telling the board during Tuesday's debate: "If we turn our heads and permit illegal entry into our county … we are saying our language, our culture, our Constitution, our neighborhoods and our flag are inconsequential. It is a price I do not care to pay."

Officials from other Virginia counties said they were waiting to see whether a legal challenge would be brought before deciding whether to launch similar measures.

The Pew Hispanic Center estimates that 250,000 illegal immigrants live in Virginia, up from about 50,000 in 1996.

claudia.lauer@latimes.com

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-14-07, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OZCAL

Wow. Get ready to present your passport before using the library or the pool...

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...la-home-center

Great. After the ACLU gets through with them, they will have their own county

OZCAL · 07-14-07, 06:22 PM

"One member, Sue Fleming, was quoted by the Washington Post as telling the board during Tuesday's debate: "If we turn our heads and permit illegal entry into our county … we are saying our language, our culture, our Constitution, our neighborhoods and our flag are inconsequential. It is a price I do not care to pay."

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-14-07, 06:23 PM

"Officials from other Virginia counties said they were waiting to see whether a legal challenge would be brought before deciding whether to launch similar measures."

Maybe they could do an end run and all the counties in VA could do it at the same time....would the ACLU be able to keep up?

This is total sillyness anyway. NC gives driver's licenses to illegals, so how exactly are librarians and life guards supposed to police this?

Just BS headline food.

IronYuppy · 07-14-07, 06:24 PM

Because I'm sure the library is simply bursting at the seams from all the use it's getting from "legitimate" readers.

brownbear · 07-14-07, 06:31 PM

To go and read at a library should be open to anyone. Tourists and all...

To sign a book out should be for residents only. Those who pay the taxes to keep it open.

How do you prove that? Well they have to have an address in the area the library resides in.............

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-14-07, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brownbear

To go and read at a library should be open to anyone. Tourists and all...

To sign a book out should be for residents only. Those who pay the taxes to keep it open.

How do you prove that? Well they have to have an address in the area the library resides in.............

I would agree with your first two sentences, but how does having an address in the county prove citizenship? Do renters pay property taxes where you live?

Not flaming, just wondering.

White Shark · 07-14-07, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OZCAL

"One member, Sue Fleming, was quoted by the Washington Post as telling the board during Tuesday's debate: "If we turn our heads and permit illegal entry into our county … we are saying our language, our culture, our Constitution, our neighborhoods and our flag are inconsequential. It is a price I do not care to pay."

Yeah, the last thing I want illegal aliens to do is learn English, and educate themselves about our culture.

The main reason most illegals go to libraries is to learn our language, history, culture, and other such information. They take their kids and check out English books and magazines. Freaking idiots. I don't like the fact that people break the law, but denying them library access is unbelievably stupid. The KKK would be proud.

..

BHMCruiser · 07-14-07, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Shark

The KKK would be proud...

It is. We had a meeting at the Klavern and...

Wait, what?

cruiser88 · 07-14-07, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BHMCruiser

It is. We had a meeting at the Klavern and...

Wait, what?

grandmaster is that you

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-14-07, 09:09 PM

I think it is more like the Grand PooBah

cruiser88 · 07-14-07, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruisin'Carolina

I think it is more like the Grand PooPah

brownbear · 07-14-07, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cruisin'Carolina

I would agree with your first two sentences, but how does having an address in the county prove citizenship? Do renters pay property taxes where you live?

Not flaming, just wondering.

Ah I didn't say property taxes...... but if they have a residence and living a neighbourbood, they are contributing.

SO I'm ok.

Yah why not want to allow people to learn culture/language and more......

Ok time for me to go to the library and get some good books....

IronYuppy · 07-14-07, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cruiser88

grandmaster is that you

Funny, he doesn't sound black.

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-14-07, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brownbear

Ah I didn't say property taxes...... but if they have a residence and living a neighbourbood, they are contributing.

SO I'm ok.

Yah why not want to allow people to learn culture/language and more......

Ok time for me to go to the library and get some good books....

OK, but still wondering...you said they pay the taxes to keep it open. What taxes? Other than providing needed labor to the local economy, I cannot argue that, but what are they "contributing"??

Again, I'm all for letting people in to read, and again it is a silly law that will do nothing and cannot, will not be enforced anyway...

Is this where "MEH" would be appropriate?

jhnLennon · 07-15-07, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Shark

Yeah, the last thing I want illegal aliens to do is learn English, and educate themselves about our culture.

The main reason most illegals go to libraries is to learn our language, history, culture, and other such information. They take their kids and check out English books and magazines. Freaking idiots. I don't like the fact that people break the law, but denying them library access is unbelievably stupid. The KKK would be proud.

..

really?my local library has an entire spanish section now.

OZCAL · 07-15-07, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Shark

Yeah, the last thing I want illegal aliens to do is learn English, and educate themselves about our culture.

The main reason most illegals go to libraries is to learn our language, history, culture, and other such information. They take their kids and check out English books and magazines. Freaking idiots. I don't like the fact that people break the law, but denying them library access is unbelievably stupid. The KKK would be proud.

..

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhnLennon

really?my local library has an entire spanish section now.

Now, you do know WS was being sarcastic don't you?

swank60 · 07-15-07, 08:18 AM

Those damn illegals are ruining everything! Why do you think libraries are overrun now? And look at the cost!

Wait, what are some of the standard bitches people use about illegals? How does that go again? Just take all of that stuff and apply it to libraries and public pools.

*Special notice needs to be given to CC for bitching about the ACLU here.

D'Animal · 07-15-07, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Shark

Yeah, the last thing I want illegal aliens to do is learn English, and educate themselves about our culture.

The main reason most illegals go to libraries is to learn our language, history, culture, and other such information. They take their kids and check out English books and magazines. Freaking idiots. I don't like the fact that people break the law, but denying them library access is unbelievably stupid.

..

I don't sense any sarcasm. I was going to post the same thing until I read the White Shark did.

I also agree with tourist being allowed to use the library.

cary · 07-15-07, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Shark

Yeah, the last thing I want illegal aliens to do is learn English, and educate themselves about our culture.

The main reason most illegals go to libraries is to learn our language, history, culture, and other such information. They take their kids and check out English books and magazines. Freaking idiots. I don't like the fact that people break the law, but denying them library access is unbelievably stupid. The KKK would be proud.

..

Yep, I agree. People keep complaining about the fact that immigrants don't assimilate themselves into society, so lets make sure that they can't?!!!! If a person is going to the library to try and improve themselves, or their family, legal or illegal, shouldn't we be encouraging them? Productive people contribute to our economy, legal or not.

I vote in favor of an exchange program. For every illegal alien that wants to go to the library and learn something, we take a welfare recipient that never finished school, never been to the library, and exclude them from the library. Better yet, take the welfare recipient and send them to Mexico and we will keep the illegal alien.

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-15-07, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swank60

Those damn illegals are ruining everything! Why do you think libraries are overrun now? And look at the cost!

Wait, what are some of the standard bitches people use about illegals? How does that go again? Just take all of that stuff and apply it to libraries and public pools.

*Special notice needs to be given to CC for bitching about the ACLU here.

Special Notice

I was looking for bonus points

Cruisin'Carolina · 07-15-07, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swank60

Those damn illegals are ruining everything! Why do you think libraries are overrun now? And look at the cost!

Wait, what are some of the standard bitches people use about illegals? How does that go again? Just take all of that stuff and apply it to libraries and public pools.

*Special notice needs to be given to CC for bitching about the ACLU here.

After reading the article again, and considering the source, I think it is biased

for putting so much weight on the Library access. The measure is really about all services other than emergency medical care, which we will still all pay for through our insurance premiums and taxes. This focus on the horror of not being able to check out a book served it's intended purpose.

On closer review, the spokesperson for the group that supports illegals called used the word "cruelty".

Classic. It is wordsmithing like this that led us to this type of mess, on both sides of the aisle.

Look up the word cruel biatch, and in the meantime, STFU

07-14-07, 06:15 PM	#1
OZCAL IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Queensland Posts: 1,000 Blog Entries: 1	Prince William County, Virginia wants to bar illegal aliens from library... Wow. Get ready to present your passport before using the library or the pool... http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...la-home-center __________________ OZ - '97 80, 269,000 k's (Australian GXL) RHD, subtank, CDL, hand throttle, steel wheels w/Dueler 285/75/16s, cloth seats; dual batts, George's LEDs, Yakima rack CAL - '97 LX 450, 136,000 miles (US spec) stock + CDL, George's LEDs.

07-14-07, 06:17 PM	#2
OZCAL IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Queensland Posts: 1,000 Blog Entries: 1	I cut/pasted in case the LATimes is password only: By Claudia Lauer, Times Staff Writer July 14, 2007 WASHINGTON — Using a municipal swimming pool or checking out a library book could soon be against the law for illegal immigrants living in Prince William County, Va. The county's Board of Supervisors unanimously passed a resolution this week that aims to ban illegal immigrants from receiving most government-funded services, as well as increase enforcement of immigration laws at a local level. The resolution, if it withstands legal challenges, would be among the toughest of a growing number of resolutions in the country seeking to deter illegal immigration. The issue has been "simmering for the past couple years, and it's come to the forefront now because of the federal failure to really address the immigration issue and because of the public outcry of our constituents," Supervisor John T. Stirrup Jr said. The resolution was introduced by Stirrup and was a weakened version of the one he originally sought. The initial version asked that all public services be denied to illegal immigrants. The county attorney warned that federal law prohibited excluding illegal immigrants from receiving some government services, such as emergency medical care. The new resolution asks all county agencies to report back later this year with lists of services that can be denied, can't be denied and those that are at the discretion of officials. It also directs the Police Department to determine the immigration status of individuals who are legally detained when there is probable cause for such a check, and to come up with a standard for determining probable cause. The original resolution would have required officers to verify immigration status even on traffic stops. With the latest effort to rewrite federal immigration laws failing recently in the Senate, municipal and county governments are becoming impatient and increasingly are addressing the issue at the local level, said Kathleen Walker, national president of the American Immigration Lawyers Assn. But, she added, few have gone as far as Prince William County. "They are seeking to root out any possible benefit they might be able to cut off from someone, no matter what their age, because they are not here on a documented status," she said. "The cruelty of this is just astounding." But Stirrup, whose resolution said illegal immigration causes "economic hardship and lawlessness" in his community, has stoutly defended the measure as "the first step toward taking back our community." Prince William County, with a population estimated at 280,000 in the 2000 census, is about 30 miles west of Washington. Its main city is Manassas; the area was the site of the bloody Civil War battles of Bull Run. Walker said several chapters of the immigration lawyers group were reviewing the resolution and would closely monitor the ordinances that could result after the county agencies report back to the board. These reviews could then result in legal challenges. The resolution spawned a passionate debate. More than 100 people testified on the measure before it was passed Tuesday. "It's going to mean a lot of fear; the resolution is already having a tremendous impact on the community," said Teresita Jacinto, a volunteer organizer for the Woodbridge Workers Committee, a group that formed to offer support to the area's growing immigrant community. "People are considering pulling their children out from school," Jacinto said. "Several people have called me to ask if their children are safe by being in school, asking can I guarantee that no one is going to take them away." Defenders of the resolution included members of a group named Help Save Manassas. One member, Sue Fleming, was quoted by the Washington Post as telling the board during Tuesday's debate: "If we turn our heads and permit illegal entry into our county … we are saying our language, our culture, our Constitution, our neighborhoods and our flag are inconsequential. It is a price I do not care to pay." Officials from other Virginia counties said they were waiting to see whether a legal challenge would be brought before deciding whether to launch similar measures. The Pew Hispanic Center estimates that 250,000 illegal immigrants live in Virginia, up from about 50,000 in 1996. claudia.lauer@latimes.com __________________ OZ - '97 80, 269,000 k's (Australian GXL) RHD, subtank, CDL, hand throttle, steel wheels w/Dueler 285/75/16s, cloth seats; dual batts, George's LEDs, Yakima rack CAL - '97 LX 450, 136,000 miles (US spec) stock + CDL, George's LEDs.

07-14-07, 06:22 PM	#4
OZCAL IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Queensland Posts: 1,000 Blog Entries: 1	"One member, Sue Fleming, was quoted by the Washington Post as telling the board during Tuesday's debate: "If we turn our heads and permit illegal entry into our county … we are saying our language, our culture, our Constitution, our neighborhoods and our flag are inconsequential. It is a price I do not care to pay." __________________ OZ - '97 80, 269,000 k's (Australian GXL) RHD, subtank, CDL, hand throttle, steel wheels w/Dueler 285/75/16s, cloth seats; dual batts, George's LEDs, Yakima rack CAL - '97 LX 450, 136,000 miles (US spec) stock + CDL, George's LEDs.

07-14-07, 06:23 PM	#5
Cruisin'Carolina IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Upstate Posts: 1,253	"Officials from other Virginia counties said they were waiting to see whether a legal challenge would be brought before deciding whether to launch similar measures." Maybe they could do an end run and all the counties in VA could do it at the same time....would the ACLU be able to keep up? This is total sillyness anyway. NC gives driver's licenses to illegals, so how exactly are librarians and life guards supposed to police this? Just BS headline food. __________________ "I hate conservatives, but I really fcking hate liberals" Matt Stone* 94 FZJ80.....ARB, OME, Revo'd, Eclipsed and Locked. 86 FJ60: Sold!

07-14-07, 06:24 PM	#6
IronYuppy You've always got time... Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Brentwood Bay, BC TLCA# 17705 Posts: 1,445	Because I'm sure the library is simply bursting at the seams from all the use it's getting from "legitimate" readers. __________________ '94 lockered FZJ80 Don't believe the disinformation; D'animal IS actually Dan from American Toyota. PM him with all your parts and tech questions. I don't even know where I am right now, Your Honor.

07-14-07, 06:31 PM	#7
brownbear Mod in Hibernation Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Where diesels purr and turbos whine TLCA# 15584 Posts: 6,147	To go and read at a library should be open to anyone. Tourists and all... To sign a book out should be for residents only. Those who pay the taxes to keep it open. How do you prove that? Well they have to have an address in the area the library resides in............. __________________ -84 BJ60, Finally on the FN road! -91 FJ80, wife's ride Iron Butt award winner of the Cruise Moab 08 !

07-14-07, 09:09 PM	#12
Cruisin'Carolina IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Upstate Posts: 1,253	I think it is more like the Grand PooBah __________________ "I hate conservatives, but I really fcking hate liberals" Matt Stone* 94 FZJ80.....ARB, OME, Revo'd, Eclipsed and Locked. 86 FJ60: Sold! Last edited by Cruisin'Carolina; 07-14-07 at 09:17 PM.