What's the best Veggie System: Please Advise

[apocalypsegrrrl]

I haven't bought my HJ60 yet (I'm working on it), but I want to put in a vegetable oil fuel system. I'm not much of a mechanic, but I don't mind getting my fingers dirty, and I can read instructions. So I'm wondering what you think is the best vegetable oil system in your opinions.

[crushers]

talk to Torrie at TCarlson@orionhealth.ca
he has perfected a system he installs...

[M John Galt]

http://forum.ih8mud.com/alternative-fuels-svo-biodiesel-etc/127720-bio-diesel-svo-questions-concerns.html#post1693558
http://forum.ih8mud.com/alternative-fuels-svo-biodiesel-etc/167037-svo.html#post2396278

[freeway]

Look at SVO discussion on page 2

[joshoisasleep]

After much research, this is the system I will be going with.
http://www.smartveg.com/

It's simple, easy to install, idiot-proof, and designed by aerospace engineers or something. Also, it's nice that it's officially certified to meet EU vehicle standards of some sort.
This appears to be the only system around that is designed specifically for use with WVO that comes with any sort of a guarantee.
The fact that it's an english company means you won't see their name coming up much in north american SVO forums.

[peterdouglas]

About 6 months ago, I did a lot of research on this. Frybrid seemed to be the most technologically advanced, and most expensive, but seemed to have a lot of disgruntled customers due to availability, shipping, etc. Nothing to do with the product, but I was scared off by the potential customer service woes.

Greasecar seemed to be the best bang for the buck. Not as sophisticated, but seemed to be well proven and had many happy customers. About half the cost of Frybrid IIRC.

Golden Fuel Systems seemed to be the most basic. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but there was nothing to really sway me towards their product, other than the fact they state on their website that they've installed their kit in a Land Cruiser.

Plant Drive seemed OK. My friend with the Jetta was most impressed with Plant Drive. If he gets this kit, I might also. IIRC, Plant Drive was rated poorly in a comparison amongst the above mentioned brands, but then again, the comparison was done by one of their competitors (Frybrid).

I'd love to get a kit installed before my trip out west. That could easy pay me back $400 to $500 worth of savings on that trip alone. But, the upfront cost of purchasing and installing is a bit too much of a hit for my budget right now. I took out my spare tire to make room for a custom made second tank since I don't want to have a tank in the interior, and I do want to use a 2 tank system. (I'll carry along my spare on longer trips, and leave it at home when I'm just going around town, unless I make a spare tire carrier on the back.) Currently I live in a house with a garage, so I have the space to filter WVO. But, when I move, it will be (at least for a year or so), in an apartment so there won't be space to filter WVO. So, I might wait until I'm back in a house. Plus, I've been considering swapping my drivetrain into a rust free FJ60 body rather than fixing the rust on my BJ60. If so, it would pointless to go to the effort of installing the veggie oil kit if I'll be getting a rust free body. For me, too many unknowns at this time to buy a kit.

[joshoisasleep]

http://www.frybrid.com/kittest.htm
I belive this is the comparison you're referring to. It appears to be quite honest, and the inexpensive greasecar kit does come out quite well. These 4 seem to be 4 of the more serious "real" companies doing kits in North America.
Personally I'd say stay away from the Plantdrive guys just because they seem a bit "dodgy". Unless I'm mistaken, they started out as "Neoteric", a company claiming to be developing kits to compete with Elsbett (a German company who appear to be the patriarch of all veggie kit companies) in the Canadian market. Then they did something weird, changed their name to Plantdrive, which is actually two separate companies or something, one Canadian, one US. Just seems shady.

For me, the most important thing is for the conversion to be as seamless and bombproof as possible. For this, I want everything to be computer controlled, so unfortunately that rules out Greasecar. Smartveg seems to be the simplest, best designed, and most reasonably priced system available that does this (and has an english language website ).

[mac]

I'll stick up for PlantDrive here. Ed is extremely knowlegeable and has done countless conversions on everything out there, both low and high tech, including Land Cruisers. He is not Dodgy and if you get him on the phone when he has time he will gladly share what he knows. He's also been around and doing this as long or longer than anyone else out there. I personally know people who have his kit installed and they love it. His partner in California works the US market and I've heard only good things from those that have first hand experience. He actually posts on here from time to time.

Say only what you know, people. Especially when your talking about an individual's personal and business reputation.

[joshoisasleep]

err, sorry. just to clarify, I didn't mean ed or anyone specifically, that was just a feeling I got about the company itself from things I'd read online. what I said above wasn't meant to bash them or anything, I've had no experience with them and definitely can't say they're bad.
I guess Ed is the guy who runs the Canadian side, and the US Plantdrive is owned by the Neoteric guy Craig Reece? Whatever, all I was getting at is that I personally shied away from them because the history of their company seemed odd.
I don't know if they read these forums or not, but if they do it might be good for them to know that someone was put off them for this reason... no harm intended.

[PlantDriver]

Hi, here's the reason for the name change from Neoteric Biofuels to PlantDrive, and for the split into PlantDrive.com (US, owned by me) and PlantDrive.ca (Canada and the rest of the non-US world, owned by Ed Beggs in BC:

Ed founded Neoteric Biofuels in 1999, I bought half-ownership in 2003. We changed the name to PlantDrive in 2004 because having a .ca domain name confused US customers, and because few could spell (or pronouce) Neoteric. (Had a guy call me and ask if he'd reached Neurotic Biofuels, that was sorta the last straw.) We split the company in March of this year, so email or call Ed if you're in Canada or anywhere but the US, and email or call me if you're in the US. Contact info is on both websites.

As far as the Elsbett angle: I'd installed 3 Elsbett singletank kits on Mercedes before I'd bought into Neoteric, and loved the idea but hated their (uninstructive) instructions and poor customer service, and so I developed a singletank kit *only for Mercedes* and only for Mercedes running in non-freezing climates. It's a big seller, but not for Toyotas.

Ed drives a diesel BJ60 and I've got a FJ80 with a 1HD-FT swapped into it.

Both Ed and I pride ourselves on getting back to people promptly and shipping promptly, and have - we think - the best systems out there, with manual switching or 3 differenct controllers, custom tanks, the best coolant-heated filters on the market, and 12V inliine fuel heating, the Vegtherm.

Craig

[Sniperx]

I wouldn't call Elsbett uninstructive. I have a huge book, literally book, of an install manual. I wish it was a littler more vehicle specific, but otherwise, its VERY thorough.

As to their customer service.....yep.....theres not much. Shoot, it took me 3 months ust to learn where to send the money.

Oh well.

[joshoisasleep]

Hey well now you guys don't seem dodgy at all. It's always good to deal with a company you can communicate with easily. My impression of plantdrive has improved... sorry to have passed on a negative vibe

[Edward Beggs]

http://www.plantdrive.ca/html/about_us.html

[GregFrench]

I have the Goldenfuel system on my troopie, and I absolutely love it. I have had no problems at all that I haven't caused myself...and then it was just due to not knowing what I was doing. They were very helpful, and answered every question I could ever think of.

[PlantDriver]

Hi Ed,

Yup, that's PlantDrive.ca, for Canadian and other non-US order. For US, it's PlantDrive.com.

Craig

[haryv]

Does your company mfg a custom replacment tank for this truck? or does it sit in the back of the wagon strapped down?

[PlantDriver]

We don't, sorry. But Ed Beggs of PlantDrive.ca has a BJ60, and could possibly design a custom tank that fits under the stock tank. His email is edbeggs.plantdrive@gmail.com

Craig

[apocalypsegrrrl]

Well, I spent the weekend snooping around the web about WVO systems again, and am feeling slightly discouraged. I've been reading some stuff that says the WVO two tank systems are great for 30,000, then your engine gets waxed up and you're SOL. Has anyone put more than 30,000 veggie miles on their LC? I sure want to get more than a few years of fun out of mine!

What about biodiesel? Anyone brewing their own?

[M John Galt]

Consider that what you refer to as "WVO" can be a wide variety of materials including some which are not good for a diesel engine. VegOil works better in some engines than others. If people are getting "wax" build up in their fuel system then they're not processing the oil correctly. It's just that simple.
Check out VO fuel forums like
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums

Any poor quality fuel can cause engine damage including petro-diesel, biodiesel, or veg-oil.

Are you compelled to burn 100% VO, or would you be OK with a lower percent of VO and fewer problems?

[apocalypsegrrrl]

I'm compelled to not screw up my LC.

I'm wondering if brewing my own bio diesel would be safer and cheaper in the long run. I live in a small, fossil fuel lovin' town, so If I want bio, I'll have to make it.

Basically, I want to give Exxon the finger as much as I can without hurting my truck.

[M John Galt]

Originally Posted by apocalypsegrrrl

I'm compelled to not screw up my LC.

I'm wondering if brewing my own bio diesel would be safer and cheaper in the long run. I live in a small, fossil fuel lovin' town, so If I want bio, I'll have to make it.
Basically, I want to give Exxon the finger as much as I can without hurting my truck.

Cheaper, maybe... safer depends on the quality of biodiesel one can 'brew'. Do some research at the link provided.

Biodiesel requires 20% methanol to process; methanol comes from natural gas. Methanol fumes are explosive and toxic.
Brewing biodiesel produces 20% dirty glycerin to dispose of.
That's assuming one actually produces biodiesel and not some emulsion that looks like peanut butter.

Commercial biodiesel is available in Seattle, it will probably be cheaper to buy biodiesel by the drum from there.

[arcteryx]

I have to second MJG. Bio quality is ESSENTIAL. Poor quality can be costly. I would purchase from a quality reseller/distributor if at all possible.

Here are some links in case for locations here and here.

Fortunately, we have quality bio in Austin.

[bigbertha]

While "waxing" in WVO vehicles may indeed be a problem in some vehicles, it seems that coking of the engine is he prevalent and most costly/destructive side effect. We are still planning to veggie oil our diesel as we know more than a handful of folks in our local community runnning WVO systems without problems for years. Greasecar and our local VegPower are the two most common systems run here.

BUT read the following tragic link and decide for yourself. Do your research and beware.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread...ght=WVO+coking

[dieselcruiserhead]

to the top for this thread.

I can't speak for all the kits but Craig and PlantDrive's components seem to be top notch, right up there with Frybrid or better, and their customer service seems to be great also. I spent several hours talking with him about it, it was that in-depth. I've also been thoroughly researching and again it all looks great..

[arcteryx]

Originally Posted by dieselcruiserhead

I've also been thoroughly researching and again it all looks great..

Andre,

What is prompting you to research this again? Are you planning on putting one on one of your projects? Inquiring minds want to know!

Cheers,
Jason

[dieselcruiserhead]

Hey Jason!

Yes the 55 will have a veg oil system, but variable so I can reduce the temps (simple ball valve) of the heat of the oil so I can use pure biodiesel in the winter with it or veg oil when it is in full heating mode

[arcteryx]

Originally Posted by dieselcruiserhead

Hey Jason!

Yes the 55 will have a veg oil system, but variable so I can reduce the temps (simple ball valve) of the heat of the oil so I can use pure biodiesel in the winter with it or veg oil when it is in full heating mode

Very cool. I have not heard of anyone doing that yet. I guess you'll be using a single-tan system then?

[dieselcruiserhead]

Nope double, plan is a seperated custom tank underneath and possibly a second 10 gallon or so on the rear bumper next to the rear tire is what I am thinking... The issue is waxed oil or biodiesel when you turn on the truck so two tank is mandatory as far as I am concerned... This is all prelim though but what I've been thinking for some time.. Goal is hopefully 40 gallon capacity too?