[Kernal]

Any thoughts on this $69 battery to use as main/only battery? (Edit: price went up this past week to $79)

[Ebag333]

You usually get what you pay for.

Interesting specs. Interesting how they are getting that many amp hours and that much reserve capacity for that price. Something has to give to be nearly $200 cheaper than the Die Hard PM-1 and have similar specs.

One thing that's interesting is that the CCA is measured at 32*, which means it'll be less at 0*. The PM-1 has 1150 CCA at 0*.

I wonder how physically big it is and how much it weighs.

My guess is that it uses more thinner plates to push out that much power with that much reserve capacity...the problem is that it won't hold up very well if that is the case. Thinner plates don't do well when jostled (like, say, bouncing around on a lake....or on rocks). They also tend not to last as long as the plates flake when they're bounced, and if too much material collects at the bottom it'll short out the plates it touches (rendering those plates useless, and reducing your capacity and CCA).

If you just need it to get by for now or a street queen, I'd say go for it. If you want to off road for it, I'd say pony up the cash and go with the Sears Diehard PM-1 or PM-2. Those are the best bang for the buck batteries I've been able to find so far in all my research.

I put the PM-1 in my truck and wouldn't do anything else if I needed another battery. The PM-2 will go in the truck when her battery dies (will be a while yet, it's only a few years old). The PM-1/2 are very well built and have great specs, they will hold up extraordinarily well. When I'm out in the middle of no where I want a battery that can hold up to whatever I need it to do, and I'm happy to know that I have a battery I can weld off of if I need to.

[Kernal]

The Platinums/Odessey's are the best, just money is tight and this is not the daily driver. I read on one forum where some farmers liked these for their tractors that sit for long periods. It only has a one year warranty, not sure if that is because they are usually used for trolling etc and get abused??, but it was heavier than the standard auto battery of the same group size (27).

[e9999]

IIRC, Consumer Reports rated some Duralast very highly. Are these Walmart's or some such store?

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by Kernal

The Platinums/Odessey's are the best, just money is tight and this is not the daily driver. I read on one forum where some farmers liked these for their tractors that sit for long periods. It only has a one year warranty, not sure if that is because they are usually used for trolling etc and get abused??, but it was heavier than the standard auto battery of the same group size (27).

Most auto batteries are designed for CCA and not for longevity, durability, or reserve capacity.

Deep cycle batteries are generally designed for reserve capacity and longevity, but not durability or CCA.

The nice thing about the Marine batteries is that they tend to be an intersection of all four things.

The fact that it was heavier than a standard starting battery is probably a good sign as it's an indication that it's either got thicker plates or more of them. Unfortunately, without cracking it open you can't really see how it's designed, and more than one battery which is labelled for a particular use is simply the same battery design with a different sticker on it.

If you've found some good reports on it, then by all means go for it and report back.

[Marc311]

It looks like 800cca at 0*. The numbers look pretty good - especially out of a Group 27. The only thing that would turn me off is that it doesn't look like it's maintenance free and the 1 year warranty (3 yr total). Apparently Duralast is made by Johnson Controls. I just bought a group 31 Interstate (also made by Johnson Controls).

The price is right. Somebody needs to be the guinea pig . . .

[addicted56]

I've used a Duralast Group 49 850 cold 1000 at 32 for years. I used them in all my old mercedes diesels. I have one on my garage floor I've used and abused for 3 years now and it keeps ticking. I used it in a car for about 6 months and then I used it as a battery for my electric pump to pump out Veg oil. It would suck a lot of amps real quick and I'd drain it way down. I'd fill it back up and do it again the same day if not minutes later after re charging. At times I would let it sit on my garage floor for a couple months and it would only take a few minutes on 2.5 amp trickle recharge to be fully charged. Just used it last month to try and start another diesel engine over and over in a period of an hour. That is a heck of a load on a battery.

I've probably had 10 Duralast batteries and only had one go bad. I left a light on in a car for a least a couple weeks and came back and of course dead. It wouldn't take a charge. I took it to Autozone and they pulled up my phone number, never said a word and handed me a new battery no questions asked.

I'd say hell yes on this purchase.

[Kernal]

This battery was at Autozone. I wonder whether this battery will put any strain on the alternator or components, like will it take and feed power like a pure auto battery?? Are boat electrical and charging systems the same as a car/truck?

[fourtrax]

charging systems are the same. no worry.

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by Kernal

This battery was at Autozone. I wonder whether this battery will put any strain on the alternator or components, like will it take and feed power like a pure auto battery?? Are boat electrical and charging systems the same as a car/truck?

As long as it has enough CCA to start the rig, no problems.

If it has very low CCA (like some true deep cycle batteries do) then it can be hard on the battery. No strain on the alternator or other components though.

This particular one should be just fine.

[Kernal]

Thanks to everyone for the advice

[e9999]

if the CCAs are there, then it seems to me that you're probably better off in general with a deepcycle than a regular for offroading apps if it involves anything like fridges, lights, winching, etc. Besides the DC capability, I have the impression they are just more rugged all around. I switched to one myself (Costco) and so far so good.

[Kernal]

What do you do with the extra terminals on the marine type battery (if you're not using them), like cover them with some silicone goop or just leave them bare?

[Ebag333]

You could smear some dielectric grease on them or get a battery terminal cap for it.

I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[-Spike-]

Originally Posted by Kernal

What do you do with the extra terminals on the marine type battery (if you're not using them), like cover them with some silicone goop or just leave them bare?

Hook your winch to them.

[fourtrax]

from what i read if your replacing your starting battery with a marine battery, you want to spec the deep cycle battery with 20% more CCA's then what you would normally use. so if Mt. T said you need a 550 CCA battery for your cruiser then you would want a marine battery with at least 660CCA to provide you with the correct starting amprage (to prevent shorting the live of the battery). So if you going with a 1000CCA battery you should be more then covered and should not have any issues running your factory accessories and an occisional winch or fridge. if you plan on running many items and a high power AMP or two, or heavy winching on a regular basis you might consider upgrading the alternator.

[Kernal]

I bought it, but the price had gone up in the past week. They had just forgot to change the price label when I looked at it yesterday so he gave me 10% off the new price of $79 today. I also asked the salesman for a fresh battery (he had two in the back room) as the ones he had on the shelf were eight months old. For grins we checked the voltage of both; the old stock new battery was at 12.4 volts and 77% capacity, the fresh new battery was at 12.8 volts and 100% capacity. When I got it home I put it on my smart charger and it read 12.8 volts, 90% capacity, so charged it for about 5 minutes at 2 amps to bring it to 100%.

Here are the specs on the batteries (all Autozone Duralast Group 27):

New (current) Duralast Gold 750CCA 135RC wgt 48lbs
Nine year old Duralast Gold 725CCA 150RC wgt 51lbs
New Duralast Marine Dual Purpose 770CCA 180RC wgt 55lbs

For comparison we weighed one of their Valuecraft batteries of similar size; only 38lbs!

Interesting how the RC goes up with the weight, more lead I guess.

One thing is the short warranty; only one year full replacement then two more years prorated. I'm hoping that the short warranty is more due to the abuse these take when used as a marine/trolling battery than anything due to the construction quality?? Time will tell.

To weigh the batteries I brought a digital bathroom scale from home (and got it back without the noticing); all the employees checked their own weight while I was there.

[Ebag333]

Excellent info. Thanks for sharing.

[e9999]

is this a 27 for the 80 OEM terminal position (27F?) or the opposite (more common I think)? (if you look at it from the front of the truck when installed with the terminals closer to the rear of the truck, is the + on the left (as OEM) or right side?)

The Costco one I got had the regular orientation so I had to extend and reverse the leads. A pain in the neck. Was about the same price with 750 MCA / 115 Ahr IIRC, and 30 months warranty. Yours may be better.

[Kernal]

Regular orientation Group 27 (not 27F); the positive terminal is on the right rear or left front if you turn it around. Autozone's website says this Marine 27DP-DL has 90 Ahr, 800CCA, 180RC. I figured 770CCA by multiplying 1000MCA by .77.

[e9999]

Originally Posted by Kernal

Regular orientation Group 27 (not 27F); the positive terminal is on the right rear.

that's what I thought, thanks. I may get one too for the trailer. Nice to have the same size in the truck and trailer.



added: went down from 115 to 90 Ah?

[e9999]

well, I ended up buying another Costco Kirkland group 27 dual purpose (starting and deep cycle), and not the Duralast. Both made by Johnson Controls as far as I know.

Reasoning:
- it has 115 Ah vs the 90 of the Duralast. To me that's important cuz I'm running a fridge on a 1 battery system. 30% longer for the fridge is a big deal to me.
- the CA is 750 vs the 1000 for the Duralast, but I'm rarely at low temps and the same battery in my 80 can easily start the engine many times in a row even when seriously depleted. I think the 80 does not require a lot of power to start when in good condition. I'm a wuss, I like balmy weather for my wheeling... Plus a cold feels better when it's not freezing outside
- the same battery in my 80 suffered some serious travails when I did quite a few tests to full depletion. Looks fine so far.
- it's $71+tax vs the $89+tax of the Duralast. Pretty inexpensive in the grand scheme of things.

Basically: higher capacity, sufficient Cranking, withstanding abuse, a tad cheaper. Looks good to me.

[Kernal]

E9999: Amp hour versus reserve capacity confuses me a bit. Like your Costco battery will produce about 5 amps for 20 hours, versus a 20 amp draw for 180 minutes (the Duralast Marine DP), if I got it right?? Seems like the higher Ah rating will allow a lower amp draw for a longer time period, but the higher RC will allow a higher amp draw for a short period? That seems to go along with the differences in CA. My final price was $77.90, but that was with a 10% discount. Sounds like we both got what we needed (no fridge for me, yet). We'll have to bring this thread back in ?? years to see how the batteries performed over time.

Here is a link that discusses Amp hours, maybe someone can decipher it better than I can, and it includes a example!

Amp Hours and Beer

[e9999]

Originally Posted by Kernal

E9999: Amp hour versus reserve capacity confuses me a bit. Like your Costco battery will produce about 5 amps for 20 hours, versus a 20 amp draw for 180 minutes (the Duralast Marine DP), if I got it right?? Seems like the higher Ah rating will allow a lower amp draw for a longer time period, but the higher RC will allow a higher amp draw for a short period? That seems to go along with the differences in CA. My final price was $77.90, but that was with a 10% discount. Sounds like we both got what we needed (no fridge for me, yet). We'll have to bring this thread back in ?? years to see how the batteries performed over time.

Here is a link that discusses Amp hours, maybe someone can decipher it better than I can, and it includes a example!

Amp Hours and Beer

I'm sure there are many folks who would be be better served by the Duralast. Especially in colder climes. The CCA is pretty good.

the RC is the number of minutes it can deliver 25A before it's pooped.
Yes, Ah seems to be more an overall picture of the capacity for low amps.
RC is moderate Amps
CA is very high Amps

check out Jason's nifty chart on discharge rates in my current thread on winches in the recovery section. Interesting.

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by e9999

the RC is the number of minutes it can deliver 25A before it's pooped.
Yes, Ah seems to be more an overall picture of the capacity for low amps.
RC is moderate Amps
CA is very high Amps

IIRC Amp Hours can be measured in several ways. It's one thing manufacturers do to make their specs look better.

Like Duralast measuring the CCA at 32* instead of 0*.

[e9999]

Originally Posted by Ebag333

IIRC Amp Hours can be measured in several ways. It's one thing manufacturers do to make their specs look better.

Like Duralast measuring the CCA at 32* instead of 0*.

I'm sure
No, there are actually several standard definitions: M(arine)CA or CA which is at 32F and C(old)CA which is at 0F, and IIRC another one around 80F, H(ot?)CA.
It's actually not bad, you can get a pretty good idea of what performance the battery is capable of, with all these numbers (assuming they are truthful).

[IdahoDoug]

In 2006 Consumer's Reports rated the Autolite 96 from WalMart near the top of the Group 24s, so I snagged one in the correct 80 format regarding the terminals. It's been a great battery through 2 N. Idaho winters and has survived several episodes of the kids leaving lights on overnight and such on the family 80. Shows no signs of weakening at all though I admit I'm in the habit of hooking up the trickle charger on all my vehicles a couple times a winter and whenever I think of it in summer. I tend to get 6-7 years out of batteries and wonder if this habit impacts that. I'm pleased with it and the price was in the $80 range if I recall correctly. I have a Delco marine dual purpose battery that's working out well - kicks the butt of a dedicated marine deep cycle battery sitting right next to it, actually. I always run the boat on the Delco, then switch to the deep cycle when we overnight, knowing that if the deep cycle dies on a trip the Delco will get us home every time.

DougM

[e9999]

yes, I think the trickling is very helpful for deep cycle batts.
IIRC, I remember reading on the Johnson controls site that they were very explicit that one should not use high amps to charge deep cycle batteries. (I don't know why)

(still want to play with desulfation chargers one of these days. I just lost a 4 or 5 years young mucho$$ Trojan size 31 giant affair. Would not take a charge, but I gave up on it since it was also seriously bulged... (no pun intended, don't go there...))

[BikerTrash]

I have a big Marine starting/deep cycle battery in my 4runner. It is the largest battery that will fit my truck, fills up from the fender, to the radiator with only about 1/2 inch to spare.


I have winched with it quite a bit off the smaller screw posts with no problems and it spins the little 22r over like it is nothing.

Been on my truck about 3 years at this point.

[Dave 2000]

If you want dual purpose go for an Optima yellow top. You will need the small spacer that is available to go underneath as the battery sits lower than stock on an 80.

regards

Dave