Bleeding brakes, what am i doing wrong?

[kpudden]

After completing OME lift(J's/L's w/1" spacer up front to level out) i intalled the MAF SS brake lines. Read the FAQ on bleeding, Landtanks commments about the possible leak in the system (haven't found anything to indicate a leak, but it could be the culprit) but i still have very spongy brakes. I have not adjusted LSPV yet, plan on dropping .25" but not until i get the air out

I have had wife and son "Manning" the pedal...

1. Started from the back first, crack bleeder, pump brakes at least 3X or until air bubbles are gone (have clear 1/4" tubing to see stream)
2. Once sides are done, crack LSPV and pump until clear stream emerges.
3. Move to front, crack valve, pump until clear 2X.

End result is i do not see air, and brakes suck... I haven't gone through quarts of fluid, but definitely pints...

Advice?

[wakesetter]

tagging along for my own mushy brakes after new rear pads installed.

[jmvar]

At any point did the level in the master cylinder reservoir get really low?

Remember it has 2 separate compartments that hold fluid, maybe one got really low and you didn't notice? This would lead to air in the MC. If this happened you will need to bleed the MC.

The procedure is pretty easy but I don't know the details from memory. If you have an service manual it is in there.

I don't know if I am just lucky but I have always just bled brakes by myself just pumping the pedal.

Drain and fill MC reservoir with new fluid.

Clear line on bleed screw going into a bottle with fresh fluid.

Crack bleeder.

Pump brakes while making sure to keep MC reservoir full. Pump until clear fluid come out. Close bleeder.

Repeat all the way around including LSPV.

The only issue I have ever come across was when I let the reservoir get too low. I just bled the MC and all was good.

Good luck. PM me if you would like the procedure to bleed the MC.

[kpudden]

I didn't suck the MC dry, but it did get pretty low...if you have the MC procedure, post it please so that others can utilize if needed. Thanks!

[Firedog]

http://forum.ih8mud.com/80-series-te...ease-help.html

[kpudden]

I'll run a quart or more through tonight and see if that does the trick. If not, on to plan b, though i am not sure what that is as of yet.

[Boheefus]

I have absolutely nothing to add to this post

[Sanchez]

I had this issue after installing the slee brake lines when I did the lift. Once I knew I had the air out I adjusted the LSPV, my pedal returned to it's normal position and feel. I ran 2 of the big bottles of brake fluid thru mine and it didn't cure the problem. Then I adjusted the LSPV and man what a difference that made.

-Juan

[Atoyot1031]

MC could be junk. I had a similar problem with my minitruck. It turned out that the MC worked fine for the front, but the rear was toast. Therefore, I was able to pump, but not get the necessary pressure. I also ended up having a junk slave cylinder a few months later.

Just something else to check. Good luck.

[azrider]

I did it the other way around. Pump up the brakes, steady pressure on the pedal, then crack open the bleeder(pedal goes to the floor)HOLD IT, then tighten bleeder. Repeat. Am I not recalling correctly or are you guys doing it backwards?

[kpudden]

Originally Posted by Boheefus

I have absolutely nothing to add to this post

Is that a sinister grin? Sounds like you have been there/done that?

Originally Posted by Sanchez

I had this issue after installing the slee brake lines when I did the lift. Once I knew I had the air out I adjusted the LSPV, my pedal returned to it's normal position and feel. I ran 2 of the big bottles of brake fluid thru mine and it didn't cure the problem. Then I adjusted the LSPV and man what a difference that made.

-Juan

I will adjust LSPV and see what that does, hope that's the issue. Thanks Juan.

[Ebag333]

If you do bleed the MC, make sure you use Flare-nut wrench (AKA tube wrench or line wrench) and NOT a box end wrench.

Ask me how I know.

(And if you do booger up the hard lines to the MC, there aren't any more available in the US. I got the last one. )

Additionally I had to bleed each point several times. It sometimes takes a while for the air bubbles to collect. If you do a round of bleeding, wait a bit then go through it again.

[Squash]

This has worked well for me.
Try with the engine off
Pump the brake pedal slowly and repeatily till there is definite pressure at the pedal, push the brake pedal down while you or someone you trust bleeds the system caliper, you want to slowly open the bleeder while the other person slowly...steadily pushes the pedal to the floor and holds the pedal to the floor while you tighten the bleeder.
Repeat this process at all bleeders till brake pedal is firm.

You may have to go around the calipers a "number" of times till you have positive results.

Make sure you both work together by opening the passenger door and windows in order to listen to each other.

My LSPV bleeder is pooched and though I have a brand new spare just in case the above procedure was all I needed.

[96r50]

Originally Posted by Squash

My LSPV bleeder is pooched and though I have a brand new spare just in case the above procedure was all I needed.

Where did you get the spare bleeder? I thought the LSPV one is a different size from the caliper ones, and doesn't come individually from the LSPV.

[landtank]

I've been playing around with a variation on the standard bleeding procedure. I place a piece of clear tubing on the bleeder and hold it in a way that the tubing arcs up from the bleeder then down in top a catch can. The arc up is to get a section of tubing full of fluid to avoid air entering through the bleeder.

Now with someone in the cab, I open the bleeder and have that person push once and hold the pedal to the floor. I then tighten the bleeder and have them release the pedal. I repeat this process until the fluid runs clear.

What I have noticed is being able to get the smaller foamy bubbles out easier.

[Ebag333]

Last time I bled my brakes, the got tired of doing it after about 60 seconds, so I had to figure out a way to do it on my own.

My final solution was to use Harbor Freights ONE MAN BRAKE BLEEDER KIT. I attached this to the bleeder screw, then placed the bottle into a larger container. I then opened the bleeder part way--enough that when I pressed on the brakes there was still pressure, so open maybe 25-40% of the way.

This kept the system pressurized, while allowing me to catch fluid easily. The smaller bottle worked perfectly as a reservoir, so that when I let off the brakes and it sucked fluid back in, it wouldn't suck in air. The small bottle has a vent hole, which drained into the larger container when the small bottle filled up. The clear lines easily allowed me to see when the bubbles were out.

Keeping the system pressurized seemed to clear the air much faster than having it all the way open.

The only catch I had was to watch the master cylinder while doing this and make sure it didn't run dry.

Just one more way of skinning a cat.

[Miescha]

I use Landtank's procedure b/c I've noticed that no matter what fitting I use on the bleeder nipple, releasing the brake with the bleeder open sucks some air back into the system.

FWIW though, I think you have air in the MC. This happened to me on my last round of bleeding and I would have sworn it didn't get low enough for air in the MC, but it did. I bled the rest of the system to a crazy extent and still such low braking that it was dangerous. I bled the MC and presto! the brakes were back. BTW, you'll want to bleed the rest of the system again after the MC, but it should go pretty fast.

[cpg]

Originally Posted by landtank

I've been playing around with a variation on the standard bleeding procedure. I place a piece of clear tubing on the bleeder and hold it in a way that the tubing arcs up from the bleeder then down in top a catch can. The arc up is to get a section of tubing full of fluid to avoid air entering through the bleeder.

Now with someone in the cab, I open the bleeder and have that person push once and hold the pedal to the floor. I then tighten the bleeder and have them release the pedal. I repeat this process until the fluid runs clear.

What I have noticed is being able to get the smaller foamy bubbles out easier.

You can also create a loop with the clear tubing held together with a zip ty or 2. Makes it real easy to make sure all of the air out.

[kpudden]

Originally Posted by landtank

I've been playing around with a variation on the standard bleeding procedure. I place a piece of clear tubing on the bleeder and hold it in a way that the tubing arcs up from the bleeder then down in top a catch can. The arc up is to get a section of tubing full of fluid to avoid air entering through the bleeder.

Now with someone in the cab, I open the bleeder and have that person push once and hold the pedal to the floor. I then tighten the bleeder and have them release the pedal. I repeat this process until the fluid runs clear.

What I have noticed is being able to get the smaller foamy bubbles out easier.

Landtank- i am doing the exact same thing with the clear tubing arced upward then down into a container...saw lots of trapped air escape at first, but now nothing. I will try again tomorrow, couldn't get to it tonight

[Squash]

Originally Posted by Miescha

I use Landtank's procedure b/c I've noticed that no matter what fitting I use on the bleeder nipple, releasing the brake with the bleeder open sucks some air back into the system.

You must have someone hold the brake pedal to the floor until the bleeder is tightened otherwise air will be sucked into the line on the brake pedals upstroke.

Something like sucking or blowing on a drinking straw...if the straw is good and your finger is covering one end nothing can leave or enter whether you suck or blow, on the other hand if the straw is cracked or your finger is off of the end you get air.

Mike

[kpudden]

Thanks Squash...i caught on to that quickly once i had them pump the brakes.