Turbo Spark Plug Selections: Some Hopefully Helpful Hints

[turbocruiser]

Fine folks, I stumbled onto something that will hopefully help others. I know that Air Power Systems ( aka Safari Turbo Systems for 4x4 vehicles) recommends NGK spark plug part number BCPR7ES-11's for several of their offerings for Toyota Turbo Systems (Land Cruiser & Supra).

This BCPR7ES-11 is a 14 mm plug (the B), with 5/8 hex (the CP), resistor plug (the R), in a 7 heat range (the 7 which only represents one heat range colder than the stock setup for forced induction), standard 2.5mm diameter center electrode (ES), gapped to 1.1mm (the -11).

To put this plug in, the gap should get reset at least as low as .8mm ( aka .0315inches) which represents the stock plug setting and ideally it should be set approximately .004inches or .1mms smaller for every additional 50HP produced over the stock engine setup according to NGK and also according to most tuners out there.

Now, NGK recommends that their plugs get gapped "larger or smaller by no more than .008inches or .2mm's" soooo what that means is that taking the BCPR7ES-11 to the recommended .0315inches or .8mm's is technically slightly too much (.004inches and .1 mm too far - prolly no problem) AND what that also means is that taking them to the .6mm or so suggested by the power produced from the turbos that are out there is really too far for these plugs (still prolly no serious problem). Will it cause catastrophic failure, no absolutely not, but is it ideal, no because it basically misaligns the electrodes.

So, it turns out that NGK now makes the BCPR7ES without the -11 as a suffix for the plug's part number and it turns out that the "BCPR7ES" is pre-gapped at exactly .0315inches or .8mm! So whether one wants to install them at that gap and rely on the power of our stock ignition systems to still spark the gap, OR, one wants to regap them to the .7 or .6 or whatever they think based on the power their system makes, it is now much more within the range of the plug. As far as I know the stock ignition system is plenty powerful to spark the gap of .8mm (i've never had a misfire code if that really represents anything) and as I recently accidentally acknowledged when I dropped a set of -11's in and forget to re-gap them to the .8mm's I usually use, the stock ignition system can still spark the gap of 1.1mm's although I think that is costing some power if that is possible without causing an actual misfire? In any event, it seems that the "BCPR7ES" is more ideally gapped as a starting point or as an ending point for force inducted 1FZFE's.

Again, just in the hope it helps others here.

[cruiserdan]

Why not just use the OEM Denso Turbo MR2 plug, 90919-01180-83.

Platinum, one heat range colder than stock and already gapped at .8mm.....

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

Why not just use the OEM Denso Turbo MR2 plug, 90919-01180-83.

Platinum, one heat range colder than stock and already gapped at .8mm.....

Prefer copper to platinum. Not recommended by APS/Safari. Not recommended to regap the platinums.

[cruiserdan]

That plug is already at the proper 1FZ gap.

Regarding the selection of platinum you may be interested to know that in all of Toyota's factory forced induction engine families, the turbo MR2, supercharged MR2, supercharged Preva, turbo Supra and the turbo Alltrac Celica, Toyota uses a platinum plug that is one heat range colder than the naturally aspirated version of that engine.

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

That plug is already at the proper 1FZ gap.

Regarding the selection of platinum you may be interested to know that in all of Toyota's factory forced induction engine families, the Turbo MR2, supercharged MR2, supercharged Preva, and the turbo Alltrac Celica, Toyota uses a platinum plug that is on heat range colder than the naturally aspirated version of that engine.

That's great Dan, really, that's great, but copper is all around acknowledged as the better conductor, and it is also not advised to regap the platinums. That plus APS/Safari specifically recommends against platinum plugs. I think they recommend the 10K short replacement interval to make up for the fact that coppers last shorter in such environments. I imagine that Mr. T spec'd the platinums for the fact that they offer significantly longer replacement intervals. Anyways, I'm just hoping that others that want coppers can benefit by this info, that's all.

[tblume]

easy now......

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by tblume

easy now......

Its not like that, sorry if it seemed so.

[tblume]

no insinuation,
you two have a LOT of experience/posts; obviously have your opinions, I just saw the time stamps and thought things could get fugly.

maybe it's a turbo Vs. super-charger grudge match. At any rate, both of you guys are way over my head, I bet your helpful hints will steer someone in the right direction.

I'll go lurk somewhere else....

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by tblume

no insinuation,
you two have a LOT of experience/posts; obviously have your opinions, I just saw the time stamps and thought things could get fugly.

maybe it's a turbo Vs. super-charger grudge match. At any rate, both of you guys are way over my head, I bet your helpful hints will steer someone in the right direction.

I'll go lurk somewhere else....

Wow I went and watched a movie with the wifey and fell asleep and missed all the fun! Tblume, I can absolutely assure you it is nothing at all like that; not only is Dan an extremely fond friend but he is also an extremely valued advisor on all things cruiser (and some things other than cruisers too ). I was simply sharing something I recently stumbled on that should save some trouble for folks using a turbocharger (neither Dan nor I even mentioned the S word ). Dan understandably has a thing for OEM parts all around and so do I but there are some select things he and I advise going aftermarket on. For me, but not for Dan, spark plugs are obviously one of those things and believe it or not there are times when Dan will actually advise aftermarket alternatives (steering stabilizers for example) for folks. No big whup whatsoever at least as far as I'm concerned and again I'm sorry if by written word or by the rapid timestamps it seemed sort of .

One thing that really sways my mind is that much of, and prolly most of, the racer world and the tuner world actually avoid platinums for several specific reasons. For whatever reasons APS/Safari is REALLY against advising people to use them and while its written into their literature a little (piqued my curiousity), if you give em a call and chance to communicate their feelings they will REALLY advise against them. So for me the choice to follow their advice was absolutely easy and NOW the ability to follow their advice while not re-gapping the plugs past what NGK says they should be gapped to is a really cool thing that I thought I'd share with the fine folks here who may want to know. That's all, that's really all.

Lastly, both my combined post count here on MUD and my overall experience/expertise count "here in life" should be looked at with a 1/99 ratio; for every one thing that I've taught to others, they, and especially Dan, have taught me 99 times more! So, many thanks for that!

[cruiserdan]

Originally Posted by tblume

I just saw the time stamps and thought things could get fugly.

Not a chance.


Besides I'm still trying to get him to come over to my place to give my truck a proper wash and wax.

I don't do a good-enough job.....

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

Not a chance.


Besides I'm still trying to get him to come over to my place to give my truck a proper wash and wax.

I don't do a good-enough job.....

Dan, my friend, I keep hinting and hinting, its not you keeping me away, its yer cheap ass beer!

[cruiserdan]

DAMMIT!

Fat Tire?

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

DAMMIT!

Fat Tire?

Now yer talkin!

[cruiserdan]

If you head out now you should be here by ~3 pm. It'll be cold by then...

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

If you head out now you should be here by ~3 pm. It'll be cold by then...

Man stop calculating in supercharger mode, I've gots the turbo, I'll be there by 1:30 pm!

[tblume]

I knew it was a forced induction issue

you guys are all right, I hope to approach a 1:999 ratio for a beginning here, I can't give much advice yet, but I am close to learning my 999th thing, so I bet i help someone soon.

have a good week fellas,

[landtank]

why don't you two take the love to someplace more appropriate...like a rest stop!

[cruiserdan]

If it means anything I have not stayed at his place....

[turbocruiser]

Originally Posted by landtank

why don't you two take the love to someplace more appropriate...like a rest stop!

why dontcha shake off yer awfully angry hangover someplace more appropriate ... like a rest stop!

[joebarbarian1]

I'm getting a lil scared here guys, seems to me you guys are closet something or other here ....and I'm starting to get scared!..

Joeb.

[jfz80]

ah the simple factor of mud

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

Why not just use the OEM Denso Turbo MR2 plug, 90919-01180-83.

Platinum, one heat range colder than stock and already gapped at .8mm.....

Originally Posted by turbocruiser

Prefer copper to platinum. Not recommended by APS/Safari. Not recommended to regap the platinums.

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

That plug is already at the proper 1FZ gap.

Originally Posted by turbocruiser

That's great Dan, really, that's great, but copper is all around acknowledged as the better conductor, and it is also not advised to regap the platinums.

only the best of friends can read each others post and not listen to what each other is saying

Originally Posted by cruiserdan

If you head out now you should be here by ~3 pm. It'll be cold by then...

mmmmmmmmmm for fat tire ill be there by 3 (on thurs )

Originally Posted by turbocruiser

Man stop calculating in supercharger mode, I've gots the turbo, I'll be there by 1:30 pm!

now thats a good one.... nice info TURBO .............................but i still use the MR2 plugs