Death Wobble.......now available more violent than ever!

[CodyRx7]

Ok....so I'm still on my 6" springs (not the 8" ones...still in the garage til I extend some brake lines and whatnot).

Every now and then my steering wheel will start shaking as if I'm turning it 3" back and forth for a few seconds.

I peek out the window to verify, and yes the front wheels are actually turning back and forth when the wobble happens.



So, fast forward to yesterday. I wonder if somehow the monster tires going out of balance are making the truck act up. I remove the big wheels up front, and install some 31s from my trailer to test it out.

(Note: Don't be me, remove the front DS or proceed to drive back home with the sound of running over hundreds of puppies)

So all is well, driving with these little A/T type tires. It looks stupid, but I'm happy to see the wobble is gone.

I put maybe 50-60 miles on it in this setup, and only in the last few blocks before home does it start......and OMG.

I imagine the big tires must absorb most of the wobble, because when this happened, it was a much faster, more violent wobble.



So what gives?

I have inspected, poke, prodded, pryed at each of the bushings up front. I've checked and made sure all bolts are tight, nothing looks bent or out of place.... Can't be a DS vibe, since it happens with or without the DS even connected.



It doesn't happen with braking, so no warped rotor issues.


I've tried removing both front 1.5" wheel spacers, and even leaving 1 on (since stock panhard pulls the front axle to the driver's side with any lift) - to even it out...

Nothing seems to eliminate it.

[TLCnoob]

Front wheel bearing almost shot? Just a guess, but I had quite a wobble at speed, and I found the DS outer bearing was really loose and it chewed up the race AND screwed up the spindle threads. New spindles aren't cheap. It had also welded the 54mm outer nut to the hub. I'd never have noticed if I hadn't jacked up the front and tried to wobble the front tires by putting hands at 9:00 and 3:00 (per FAQ) and doing the push/pull thing. She was REALLY loose, so I investigated. Glad I did...it was about to let go. That would have made a mess.

This was a month after I bought the LC, so I was only negligent for a short period of time. It could have ended badly, though.

Good luck.

[CodyRx7]

Cant be anything internal...

New axles, new bearings, new everything in there....all greased up and so fresh and so clean-clean.

[bhmmapping]

How is your caster with the slee plates? If it was already low then putting the small tires on the front would probably make it a lot worse.

[Kalawang]

Originally Posted by CodyRx7

Cant be anything internal...

New axles, new bearings, new everything in there....all greased up and so fresh and so clean-clean.

Even if your wheel bearings are new they might not have been properly re-torqued. It's no big deal to check it out.


Kalawang

[Cruiserdrew]

I had bad death wobble only once in my 80, and it turns out it was the pan hard bushings. It made a HUGE difference when I replaced them, so I think they had gradually going bad for some time.

As others have said, anything can cause it, from loose wheel bearings, to bad leading arm bushings. My guess is that a lot of factors even if individually not that bad, together can lead to death wobble. Your big tires brought it out but the problem is still there. You should keep looking, and replace all the front end bushings if you plan to run the big meats.

[CodyRx7]

is there a kit somewhere to replace all the front end bushings?

[Bikeman]

Rod end bushings worn out.

[Cruiserdrew]

Originally Posted by CodyRx7

is there a kit somewhere to replace all the front end bushings?

I got mine from Slee and I'm using the blue poly ones as a test. With all of the fronts done, and new leading arms to correct caser, it drives like a new truck. The steering it tight even with half worn 35 inch MTRs.

[CreeperSleeper]

My wifes 4Runner has this issue. It's to a point now that you can't drive straight! (It goes away when your turning.) I found that running the tires at trail pressure on the street helps a bunch. For her rig, I'm pretty sure it's trunion bearings. Did you replace those in your rebuild?

[CodyRx7]

Which ones out of this page would I be needing?

I dont have any connected sway bars...so those bushings wouldn't be of any use.

Slee - Toyota 80 Land Cruiser Suspension Bushings

[Bikeman]

Unless you've replaced the 4 tie rod ends sometime in the past, you need to look there.

[BryanBerry]

I had horrible death wobble with a jeep a while back. The problem with it is that it is so violent that you kind of need to just fix everything at once. If you just replace the bushings, but the bushings are not the only problem, then when you get it again a day or two later, you can ruin the brand new bushings. Actually, that isn't so much true with bushings, but with TREs and wheel bearings, death wobble can mess that stuff up pretty quick. A good way to check things is to have someone sit in the truck and slightly turn the wheel back and forth just enough to change the tensions on the linkage. Keep doing that and closely look at every piece of suspension and steering and check for any movement. If the panhard rod is bad, than the body will move back and forth before the wheels actualyl turn. Good luck. Death wobble sucks. I actually drove from the rubicon back to Portland at 20-30 mph getting the wobblies every few minutes.

[CJF]

No mention of the steering stabilizer?

Curtis

[-Spike-]

Originally Posted by CreeperSleeper

My wifes 4Runner has this issue.

My wife's old '94 4Runner also had this problem. New steering stabilizer fixed it.

-Spike

[Nay]

Toe (mis)alignment is the #1 cause outside of a worn part. As a part of that diagnosis, I'd probably also replace the rod ends and panhard bushings if they aren't new.

Soft shock valving can easily contribute since you don't have a swaybar installed. Your L shocks are quite mismatched for your setup if you don't find a worn part.

[CreeperSleeper]

Originally Posted by -Spike-

My wife's old '94 4Runner also had this problem. New steering stabilizer fixed it.

-Spike

Was it stock or modified? I'm pretty sure her problem is trunions. The suspension and steering is less than 3 yrs old, but the axle was never rebuilt (I don't think.)

[clarkrw3]

only time I had death wobble was when my pan hard bolt came loose...def check those bushings.

[CodyRx7]

Now this just looks silly.

[Elijah]

I've also got some brutal death wobble, from about 45-50 mph ONLY. Not sure why at that speed only. I was thinking the tires or balancing or something. They are 37 inch bias ply pitbull rockers. I have all new TRE's and new bearings as well. I haven't looked at the bushings specifically yet but the panhard is a new Slee.

[BryanBerry]

Unbalanced tires will cause a shimmy that can lead to death wobble, but for the shimmy to lead to death wobble, there is something that isn't correct.

[clarkrw3]

careful cody....you don't want to run around like that with the rears so much bigger than the front due to the AWD system

[tblume]

Originally Posted by clarkrw3

careful cody....you don't want to run around like that with the rears so much bigger than the front due to the AWD system

did you read the first post carefully?

[Ivan80]

Originally Posted by CodyRx7

Now this just looks silly.

Looks silly now, but as soon as you put on those 8" springs and get some 31's on the rear it'll be fine.

[Elijah]

Do others also notice death wobble at specific speeds only as well?

[BryanBerry]

Yes, that is characteristic of the wobble. It is usually at a certain speed and above. Changing to smaller tires only increased the speed in which it will start. On my jeep it was any decent bump over 45 and it would set it off and I would have to come to a complete stop. I have known some people with 39" tires that got it around 25-30 mph. Does yours go away when you slow back below 40, or do you have to totally stop?

[Elijah]

It is only there between those speeds. Below 45 not there and above 50 not there. I don't have to hit a bump either. Just a regular road, any road, between those speeds and the steering wheel shimmies back and forth about 3 - 4 inches each way.

[BryanBerry]

That does sound like a wheel out of balance. Have they been checked? Also, those IROKs are pretty hard to balance. Also, do you have steel wheels? As there is really no such thing as perfectly round steel wheel.

[Elijah]

No steel wheels, just the factory alloys. I'll have to find a competent place to balance them for me then, these aren't your run of the mill Toyo or BFG's.