3" Mandrel bent stainless exhaust or aluminized.. Interested?

[LC80Ducati996]

I am talking with hearthrob exhaust about making me a custom system..

I had bought a used press bender but resold it to a friend with a shop since I ran out of time before I deploy,

So now I am going farm it all out to the best shop in my area and have my best friend deliver and pick up my truck while I am roasting and wrenching in the desert.

Main
Heartthrob Exhaust
Custom work
Manufacturing, Installation, & Fabrication Services


I sent them links to photos of overframe high clearance custom exhausts from mud to get a general idea.

I am interested to know if others are interested in joining me. While they have everything setup to make one it could be very cost effective to make copies.

They make some great sytems.. This picture is of a huge diesel system

[NLXTACY]

Timing is bad only because there are sooo many projects going on, but interested none the less.

[jfz80]

MAF has the 3'' mandrel bent pieces, ceramic coated just for a price reference. Sounds like a cool option if he can keep the cost reasonable. Going custom maybe he can oval over the frame and rear crossmember for more clearance and equal exhaust flow.

SO looks like you can post pics........ lets see your truck. Did you ever update your lift thread w/ pics?

[LC80Ducati996]

MAF lists not available for it right now and does not spec over or under frame..

I have pics up of my over frame hitch mount mod. Been busy... Ever have to pack a over a dozen 25,000 lb containers with aircraft tools and parts in addition to your own personal gear? Then there was work on the house, wife's car, the boat and family time..

If the sun comes out and I get done setting up for my bonvoyage BBQ I'll shoot some post lift.. There are pics in other threads RE tires, ARB bump and winch etc.. Hitch shots are post lift but only rear shots.

I have faith that heartthrob can make an awesome system. The time frame I am looking at is july-august for it. The wife has no need or desire to drive it in the summer and will only use it for deep snow days in the winter...

Basically anyone with exhaust going bad or just in need or an upgrade let me know and PM an email.. I can then let them know how many to estimate the cost per unit for. Then we will know a cost and people can make a commitment or not based apon it.

[jfz80]

right on, i didnt know MAF was unavailable at the moment. Ive just been spendin lots of time searchin exhaust lately and it came up several times. mud member Jamisobe used it to got 3'' over the frame rail so thats what i was goin on. It wasnt in the budget so i didnt even bother calling MAF.

and i got my own business and family obligations so I understand priorities and busy time, didnt mean to sound harsh, its just i always get excited you the out of the box ideas youve posted and being a designer tend to be kinda visual....

[LC80Ducati996]

I have recieved some PMs from a couple interested people.

The cost will depend on what you want.

I am going full stainless to include all hardware and hangers. I am in Minnesota.. Those in states without road salt like crazy may not need that level of corrosion resistance and cost. There will be a huge difference in price between aluminized and stainless.. Both will be mandrel bent.. They even have identical hangers in both aluminized and stainless..

The more people we can get in on it the less each one will cost. It will be more of a short production run than a one off fab job then.

[LC80Ducati996]

Here is an update. The estimated price of a aluminized steel system will be between $400 and $600. A few more seriously interested people would be nice.

Once again they will be over frame and with a tailpipe that cant get smashed by the bumper when doing a departure angle check. These posts show similar systems. However not mandrel bent and things like welds are not as clean as heartthrob does things..

IH8MUD™ Forums - View Single Post - new 3'' cat-back exhaust

IH8MUD™ Forums - View Single Post - Custom exhaust done...

[Grench]

Which model year is this being done for?

How much would the stainless version cost?

Does it include one or more catalytic converters?

Does it include the muffler?

Does it include a resonance can?

Does it include the Y tube? (I.e. is it..
from the manifold back?
or
from the Y tube back?
or
from the cat back?

How much would shipping be?

Can we get a few pictures of what the results look like on your truck before we order one?

[LC80Ducati996]

Originally Posted by Grench

Which model year is this being done for?

I have a 1996 as well.. Model years originally equiped with inline cats and underframe routing.

Originally Posted by Grench

How much would the stainless version cost?

Short answer considerably more. A 10 foot stick of 3" aluminized costs the same as a bit over a foot of stainless.

Originally Posted by Grench

Does it include one or more catalytic converters?

Yes

Originally Posted by Grench

Does it include the muffler?

Yes

Originally Posted by Grench

Does it include a resonance can?

It is an option but not included in that approximation

Originally Posted by Grench

Does it include the Y tube? (I.e. is it..
from the manifold back?
or
from the Y tube back?
or
from the cat back?

From the y tube.

Originally Posted by Grench

How much would shipping be?

Not sure. It all depends on how much it weights, choice of shipper and service level plus your location. FWIW they dont mark up the shiping. Just what it costs to pack and the shippers charge.

Originally Posted by Grench

Can we get a few pictures of what the results look like on your truck before we order one?

Only if we get enough people to order at the same time as my truck is getting done.

Why? If we get enough orders they will make things like welding jigs so that they can reproduce the results of the first custom system. So if we dont get a few others it wont be reproducable after my truck leaves..

They have state of the art equipment and skilled craftsman.

The owner himself does the custom jobs.

A search of heartthrob exhaust installations on other models of vehicle forums will yeild many happy customers.

[Grench]

I'm interested, but I'll need some solid numbers. The factory exhaust is stainless and I wouldn't think of replacing it with anything less.

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

Short answer considerably more. A 10 foot stick of 3" aluminized costs the same as a bit over a foot of stainless.

So, then how much for stainless complete?

Is it 304 or 314?

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

From the y tube.

Hmm. The Y tube is the #1 point of failure (see REAL noisy) in the factory exhaust. It is also nasty expensive to replace from Toyota. If I were to go through the expense to do this in after-factory custom stainless, I'd want that Y pipe to be included. Otherwise you still have a 2" restriction to the end of the Y pipe even if you go 3" from that point on.

Was the question about going oval over the rail answered?

Will they be supplying a bolt in heat shield to ride between the pipe and the floorboard (94 and earlier had this)?

[FredTJ]

What's stock diameter ?


Fred

[LC80Ducati996]

Originally Posted by Grench

I'm interested, but I'll need some solid numbers. The factory exhaust is stainless and I wouldn't think of replacing it with anything less.)

304 is much better than stock. I am also not too impressed with the stock system. Mine sure has a bunch of corrosion on the pipe, hangers like the one welded to the muffler corroded at the welds and broke. Sure stock is mandrel bent and better than aluminized but not that much better..

Originally Posted by Grench

So, then how much for stainless complete? )

Is it 304 or 314?

304 pipe with 409 stainless on the muffler. 409 is possible for the rest but not very cost effective. I will get an answer about the cost of ss systems. I do know that if only my one system was made in 3" ss with a 409 stainless muffler and full stainless hardware and hangers it would be about $1200-$1400 or so.. But this included a full installation of everything and footed the bill on its own for the time spent designing and perfecting the system.

The exact cost will depend on how many get ordered and be pinned down exactly only after the first one is complete.

After it seems like the majority of interested people have contacted me I will give them numbers of each type of system (SS and Aluminized) and my truck for a while. Knowing about how many of each will be made will narrow the price down more combining this info with actually doing the first one will allow an exact price to be calculated.

Originally Posted by Grench

Hmm. The Y tube is the #1 point of failure (see REAL noisy) in the factory exhaust. It is also nasty expensive to replace from Toyota. If I were to go through the expense to do this in after-factory custom stainless, I'd want that Y pipe to be included. Otherwise you still have a 2" restriction to the end of the Y pipe even if you go 3" from that point on)

Actually that far upstream a 2" pipe where it goes 2 to 1 is not that much of a restriction provided it is smooth transition. In fact it would outflow going right to 3" from the stock primary tubes. It is hot as heck there and retaining the velocity helps. It also helps get the converter(s) hot and working quicker. Exhaust should get bigger gradually as the gasses cool and velocity slows.

Originally Posted by Grench

Was the question about going oval over the rail answered?)?

It will be over the frame. Oval or not depends on what they feel works when they do it. I have seen people use full 3" over the frame and where OEM was pinched for the crossmember outback. Hanger placement made that possible... I will not be using my truck since I will be heading over seas.. So they can have it as long as they wish to get things right.

Looks like I might be coming back for 4-5 days in august before I go over.. I will be out of state for 2 months and out of the country for 10. So in early august I can actually get over to the shop.. I can have good friends deliver it to them and pick it up myself in August as well..

Right now I am just getting the ball rolling and coordinating things. Any actual ordering and payment will be done by others directly thru heartthrob. The idea is to get a bunch of mud members to go thru one great shop with state of the art mandrel equipment and get a much better system and deal than if we all went to some local shop with a press bender and got varied results and higher per system pricing since each one have to pay its own design time seperately.

Originally Posted by Grench

Will they be supplying a bolt in heat shield to ride between the pipe and the floorboard (94 and earlier had this)?

No bolt in heat shield. That is a part that is easy to fabricate, buy used or get from a source like Cruiser Dan. I can do that but I cant operate or afford to buy a mandrel bender. I recomend getting some heat screen material from DEI and adding that over a heat sheild.

[Grench]

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

I do know that if only my one system was made in 3" ss with a 409 stainless muffler and full stainless hardware and hangers it would be about $1200-$1400 or so.. But this included a full installation of everything and footed the bill on its own for the time spent designing and perfecting the system.

The price doesn't scare me off as much as not being able to see a completed version before ordering. The worst would be to get the parts and have them not fit right. Are they going to warranty DIY fitment?

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

Actually that far upstream a 2" pipe where it goes 2 to 1 is not that much of a restriction provided it is smooth transition. In fact it would outflow going right to 3" from the stock primary tubes. It is hot as heck there and retaining the velocity helps. It also helps get the converter(s) hot and working quicker. Exhaust should get bigger gradually as the gasses cool and velocity slows.

I'm not all that concerned about pipe diameter on the Y pipe. I AM concerned about the Y pipe itself. It runs exposed through the PS wheel well. It gets high heat, water and salt spray, etc... I want to keep these trucks running forever. I also want to minimize the amount of time I spend addressing any single system. That Y pipe is more vulnerable to corrosion than the rest of the system. ANY muffler shop can run from the Y pipe back. A good one can hop the frame rail. Very few will touch that Y pipe without a factory built replacement to put in. I can't see much point in replacing the exhaust without including it in the process.

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

It will be over the frame. Oval or not depends on what they feel works when they do it. I have seen people use full 3" over the frame and where OEM was pinched for the crossmember outback. Hanger placement made that possible... I will not be using my truck since I will be heading over seas.. So they can have it as long as they wish to get things right.

So we're likely looking at 3-6 months before they're ready to start producing these systems? Thats fine with me. Fall is good wrenching weather.

[LC80Ducati996]

Originally Posted by Grench

The price doesn't scare me off as much as not being able to see a completed version before ordering. The worst would be to get the parts and have them not fit right. Are they going to warranty DIY fitment?.

So long as you install it properly yes. Have you gone to their website? The majority of their buisness is selling aftermarket bolt on exhast to shops and the general public thru distributors. They do great custom work since it is just like prototyping a new production system.

Here is their off the shelf 3" single (as opposed to a dual exh) catback for a Durango... Keep in mind I specified wheeler friendly things like the turn down just before the bumper. None the less an example of what they produce to bolt right in.

1998-2003 Dodge Durango 3" Single Kit w/HVS If you go to the truck single cat back page some systems have sound clips up too!

Originally Posted by Grench

I'm not all that concerned about pipe diameter on the Y pipe. I AM concerned about the Y pipe itself. It runs exposed through the PS wheel well. It gets high heat, water and salt spray, etc... I want to keep these trucks running forever. I also want to minimize the amount of time I spend addressing any single system. That Y pipe is more vulnerable to corrosion than the rest of the system. ANY muffler shop can run from the Y pipe back. A good one can hop the frame rail. Very few will touch that Y pipe without a factory built replacement to put in. I can't see much point in replacing the exhaust without including it in the process..

I was really looking at replacing the main single trunk from where the y-goes in and back. This would need to be welded on in order to install it. I wanted better clearance here but did not want to put too much into that area since I just might go turbo and turbonetics manifold or even swap in a turbodiesel within a couple years.

Originally Posted by Grench

So we're likely looking at 3-6 months before they're ready to start producing these systems? Thats fine with me. Fall is good wrenching weather.

[Grench]

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

I was really looking at replacing the main single trunk from where the y-goes in and back. This would need to be welded on in order to install it. I wanted better clearance here but did not want to put too much into that area since I just might go turbo and turbonetics manifold or even swap in a turbodiesel within a couple years.

I'm not too keen on welding pretty new pipes to old rotten pipes when there are flanges 2' upstream in the system.

From what I understand, this Y pipe is -the- big $$$$ item in replacing the factory exhaust.

From what I can tell Bosal made the factory system (or at least theirs is direct replacement). I include a link to their site here for reference to how the Y pipe and front cat are one piece.




If the system were to bolt in at the manifold flanges and go from there to the rear bumper, I'd likely be in. With the way you're describing it though, what are you going to do when your Y pipe fails?

[LC80Ducati996]

I guess I will look into going from the manifold flanges back.

For my personal order it will be aluminized steel untill after the cats. Not going to sink too much into a section that will not get used later when I go turbo 1z or turbo diesel...

[LC80Ducati996]

Looks like I might have found an off the shelf over the frame solution.. It is really for a HDJ80

http://www.rage.co.nz/bigbore/toyota41-43.pdf

Well mostly off the shelf. The downpipe will need to be mated to the stock collector for those keepin stock stuff up front.. Others can fab in downey tri-ys. Personally I will end up connecting it to a custom dump pipe fed by a seperate 38mm wastegate and a turbo..

I like the flex section.. Prevents a bunch of movement from the engine to be transfered into the pipe. I assume it helps keep things from banging with 3" going up and over the frame.




I found a northern north america distributor thru the MFG who I contacted. In AU shops converted to USD they are very reasonable $425-$450. Hopefully geting a few people on board at once will help control shipping.

[landtank]

the flex section is where the cat goes. Looks real good if it installs as advertised.

[LC80Ducati996]

Originally Posted by landtank

the flex section is where the cat goes. Looks real good if it installs as advertised.

If so I would put a flex back in maybe on the downward leg from the engine.

I have seen how much movement they isolate on my turbo AWD car I used to have. Think some give instead of break or bend permenantly part like that is nice to have given the clearance there and off road pummeling.

[jamisobe]

Looks like a good potential solution (Mandrel is very nice) although that muffler may allow a good amount of noise. You can always switch it out for something else with more capacity.

I don't think the flex section is necessary. I had my header exhaust in place for a year when the rear mount broke loose. After that I put thick rubber washers in as insulators on all 3 mounts. No problems over the last 4 years other then when I crunched the exhaust under the frame and had to weld the torn front mount (before I went over the frame). Why add the turbulence if you can get around it?

[LC80Ducati996]

There is some degree of turbulance in the flex section.. Most flex sections by good aftermarket manufactures keep it to a minimum. Its virtually non existent when compared to what goes on even inside a high perf cat converter. The down pipe I had on my GSX was pretty good. Full exhaust systems on a transverse mounted engine require a flex section...

FWIW this is not the only aftermarket HDJ system I have seen with a flex section. Even in a longitudinal application it makes sense, It does reduce stresses on headers or a y system of of OEM manifolds. The motor wont try to move the whole exhaust as much when it moves in its rubber padded mounts..

Hey why just isolate the engine vibrations from the frame but to a degree isolate them from majority of the cat back as well? Not so much the shaking of the engine but when it twists in its mounts under a heavy load.

A turbo has a muffler like effect. At idle 3" cat back on a ball bearing turbo DSM sounds bad ass and not annoying like it does on a non turbo RS model..

I prefer the smaller muffler for clearance reasons. Same with the lack of a rear resonator. the turn down is good.. May need to move the turn down forward a bit to get in just inside say a 4x4 labs bumper so it cant get crushed under the bumper on a departure angle test. Easy little tweeks I see..

Always a compromise between ideal efficiency and things like durability, longevity, NVH and ground clearance.

Oh and awesome news guys looks like we can work something out if we all go in at once. Just recieved a promising email from the north american distributor..

[jamisobe]

Turbos make great mufflers. You may even be able to skip a muffler altogether if you are running a turbo with a cat/pipe to the rear. Neither would you need to worry about tuning the exhaust. But normally aspirated will be loud with that little muffler and nothing else.

You can actually fit a pretty large muffler in the stock location. I tightly stuffed the big 70 series Flowmaster in there and it has left more clearance than stock.

[jamisobe]

Originally Posted by LC80Ducati996

There is some degree of turbulance in the flex section.. Most flex sections by good aftermarket manufactures keep it to a minimum. Its virtually non existent when compared to what goes on even inside a high perf cat converter. The down pipe I had on my GSX was pretty good. Full exhaust systems on a transverse mounted engine require a flex section...

FWIW this is not the only aftermarket HDJ system I have seen with a flex section. Even in a longitudinal application it makes sense, It does reduce stresses on headers or a y system of of OEM manifolds. The motor wont try to move the whole exhaust as much when it moves in its rubber padded mounts..

Diesels typically vibrate much more than gas engines and the flex section may be more crucial due to that difference. If I had a shakey diesel I would try it without and if it caused problems I would add the flex joint.