Hafc Install Thread! (mpg Increase?!)

[sleeoffroad]

We should soon have our first SOF IFIC unit on the market.

[F0RSAKEN]

Vicious, but immensely comical.

[PDoyle]

Where is the fat lady?

[e9999]

still waiting for solid numbers.... tap tap tap.....

[SS_Storm]

Hah I love the tags. " Fantasy and Sci Fi" :-P

So I have had no time to finish my own truck I have been too busy with customers, I just finished a 2006 f150 with 80,000 miles on the clock (2wd 5.4l v8) the truck started at 14 mpg highway after I modified and tuned it it ended up at 29 mpg highway.
Im very excited about those results! 115% not too bad.
I have the new o2 sensors for my truck, paid a buddy to change them and he rounded the nuts on the passenger side sensor so I have to get an extractor or simply pay to have it done at a shop.

[CJF]

At what point exactly does this thread become spam?

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by CJF

At what point exactly does this thread become spam?

Post before this one?

[CJF]

Originally Posted by Ebag333

Post before this one?

Two before that one, at a minimum.

Edit: Oh hey! Nice avi.

[GA Trevor]

I've been reading this thread for a while, "sadly", but can't everyone just let him post up his finds.

He is experimenting something on his own rig not your rig, he is not trying to sell it to you, he is just trying to do a favor, give him a break.

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by SS_Storm

talking about science

Sorry, I thought that this setup was based on science. If it's based on something else (Flying Spaghetti Monster?), by all means let us know.


Seriously though, while I'm extremely skeptical (of this particular setup, I believe that there's strong plausibility behind some of the pieces) I am also extremely curious to see how this turns out for you.


The problem is that it's now been a month and a day since you started this thread. You implied you'd have results fairly shortly. Shortly after posting you have had "tuning troubles", but amazingly the other vehicles you've installed this on get huge MPG increases.

You also say you're an unbiased party....yet you're selling your services installing and tuning these.


I'm not saying you're pulling a fast one or anything of the like. All of the above could be purely coincidental. However, the appearance of it all does not look well for you, which hurts your cause quite a bit. If circumstances were different, I suspect you would have gotten a quite different reaction.

I honestly don't know whether the kit you are installing works or not. From my research I would suspect no (or at least installing it may give you a benefit....but may also greatly increase the risk of toasting your engine), but I was hoping to get some results here.


Your responses to people (and especially your last comment) lead me to believe that we won't see any results, and if we do they're likely to be biased. Wish this thread had turned out otherwise.

[SS_Storm]

I really find it amazing that so many of you are chemists, politicians AND so respectful.



and yeah mine is harder. in your training you are told only to do 96+ cars, obd2 we can see when we are on the limits before tripping a MIL or something like that.
The cruiser is being a tough one to tune. I am hoping that its just a bad sensor somewhere. truthfully there are some vehicles that respond amazingly and some that don't. Fords happen to get amazing mileage increases. I cannot see the same things on the cruiser I can see on an obdII vehicle so I am going by feel and the sensor signals I cannot see what the computer is processing which is turning out to be far more trouble than I had expected.

Im only un-biased on these forums LOL you guys are far away form me and it does me no good to sell you anything. I make no money off parts only labor so its the install that helps me out. there are a few guys near me but I have more work than I can handle. I am booked 8 months out. 3/4 of those with the same roofing company- I am converting their entire fleet.

ALL other conversions I have done have been finished within a week at the most.
and heck Ill share the tuning secrets with anyone who NEEDS them so there was that one guy who said he had one of these to install- PM me Ill give ya a few tricks to kick you way up there

[Brian Macgyver]

I spent 20+ years with Honda and Toyota, watching them spend literally billions trying to improve fuel economy. They have tried everything from Hydrogen injection to ionized distilled water injection. There is absolutely a limit to the lean mixture that can be injected without raising combustion temps above the tolerances of normal piston materials. (Some progress was made using titanium pistons, cylinders and heads, but that is far from cost-effective.) Fuel is not only the combustion driver of the engine, but is necessary as a cooling agent. The fuel vapor entering the chamber cools metal as the fuel is heated in preparation for combustion. I have seen attempts at preheating fuel, and the holes in pistons that result. The factories are experts at creating high-performance engines. That is what economy is, getting the most possible power from a drop of fuel! They are very good at it.
Toyota has a product on the market that is excellent at reducing fuel use in Land Cruisers. It has been on the market for over 40 years, and is highly successful and well proven. It has a long history of producing high fuel economy and reliability. It also reduces maintenance costs on Land Cruisers. You can use it on all weekdays, saving the tree-climbing abilities of the Land Cruiser for weekends!
It is well known as the Corolla!!!
Try it sometime. You may be impressed!

[landtank]

As I posted earlier and many times elsewhere on MUD, our ECMs don't like people dicking around with them. A lot of people seem to think piggy backs are the way to tune for boosted applications but they just don't respond like people expect them to.

Setting up engines to intentionally run lean can severely impact an engines longevity. Best of luck to that fleet of Fords.

[sleeoffroad]

Originally Posted by SS_Storm

The cruiser is being a tough one to tune. I am hoping that its just a bad sensor somewhere. truthfully there are some vehicles that respond amazingly and some that don't.

Why? Maybe if you posted the issues you are having, some people that have dabbled in tuning these trucks could help you.

[PDoyle]

Originally Posted by GA Trevor

I've been reading this thread for a while, "sadly", but can't everyone just let him post up his finds.

He is experimenting something on his own rig not your rig, he is not trying to sell it to you, he is just trying to do a favor, give him a break.

x2.... We all got time. Keep trying, if you need info. DON'T be afraid to post ANY questions!

[jamisobe]

Originally Posted by sleeoffroad

Why? Maybe if you posted the issues you are having, some people that have dabbled in tuning these trucks could help you.

This is true SS, many of them will be respectful while reserving judgment as well. I for one, appreciate your patience and continue to monitor this thread because I know there is something to the hydroxy gas supplement thing. I also know there are tuning issues for vehicles with fuel injection/O2 sensors. If valves are getting burned I would like to know.

I am interested to see if you will be able to work these issues out for the 1FZFE. There are a few folks on here who know the ECM very well and may be able to help. Please persist.

FYI, I have seen 17mpg once since I recently started tracking mpg. The 2nd check was 15mpg. I try to stay out of the skinny pedal as much as possible and rarely fill up with more then 10 gallons.

[dwells50]

Energy in equals energy out, except our contraptions ( engines, power plants, furnaces, etc) waste energy in the process, resulting in a net loss. The same holds true with this hydrogen generator thingy.

The only way that this thing could possibly work would be that these additional gases burning in the combustion chamber are somehow causing the gasoline to burn more completely.

The combustion characteristics could be changing, causing a faster burn at the proper time during the downstroke. Who knows?

[WildHare]

SS, even though you haven't posted mileage averages for your vehicle, you have been posting them for other vehicles where you installed the system.

Would you mind posting other data about those vehicles as well, such as before and after horsepower/torque tests, before and after emissions tests, before and after exhaust gas temperatures, and other data? This information could help predict whether the system changes you make reduce engine longevity. With a significant system change, and only one data point (MPG), it's not possible to determine the long term effects of the newly installed system.

If I remember correctly, the company advocated unplugging/turning it off for emissions tests. Is this correct?

Thank you,

-Dan

[jonheld]

Originally Posted by Ebag333

If it's based on something else (Flying Spaghetti Monster?), by all means let us know.

Please don't take my lord's name in vain. I'm off to my local Olive Garden to pray for you.

[jjcobm]

I also would like to agree that if you have access to any testing equipment such as a dyno or exhaust gas analyzer (probably the best way to go), it would not only provide us with a good amount of information as to how the engines are reacting to the hho with all the modifications done to the sensors/pcm, but would also help you determine if what you are doing is beneficial to keep in the long run. Like someone said, please ask questions if you have any.

[SS_Storm]

Thanks guys, Ill take a look at it tonight and see if I can give you all some details-
I till install a EGT gauge in the cruiser after this is all getting good gains, Ill have to smog it soon too so I can tell you that also. Otherwise those are not things I test.

[Ebag333]

Originally Posted by jonheld

Please don't take my lord's name in vain. I'm off to my local Olive Garden to pray for you.

But..but..but....he tastes so good!

Originally Posted by SS_Storm

Thanks guys, Ill take a look at it tonight and see if I can give you all some details-
I till install a EGT gauge in the cruiser after this is all getting good gains, Ill have to smog it soon too so I can tell you that also. Otherwise those are not things I test.

A blackstone oil analysis would probably be beneficial as well. I'd be very curious to see what happened to it after 3k miles, especially if you have a few "befores".

[NLXTACY]

Is there a way to take a poll now to see how many people just want to see this thing blow up at this point?

[NLXTACY]

UGH, couldn't someone have given this thread 5 stars AFTER SOMETHING was proven!??!?!?!?!?!?!

[cary]

Boy, I don't check the 80 board for a while and come back to a train wreck. As already addressed by others, this is nothing but snake oil. There is no such thing as a free lunch.

[sleeoffroad]

OK, I watched the video of how much gas this thing produces. It was like 1 quart in 45 seconds or something. So this is injected into the airstream in the air intake. What is the air consumption of a 4.5L motor and if this gas is produced at a quart in 45 seconds what is the % of this gas that actually reaches the motor?