Cat Trouble and New introduction

[Flank]

Hey group, newbie here. Just got (after years of yearning) into my first cruiser - a one owner 95 fzj in amazing condition. Truck has 180K on it and is AMAZINGLY solid. I have no idea of the maintenance records (bought from a boutique dealership who had just had 3 rows of new leather put in). Verfied one owner status on Carfax. I love it, my wife does not understand why I sit on the front porch and stare, but she cannot see my heart leap when I get told to go to the store for baby food...

I digress - got engine trouble light, took it to Toyota dealership in Dallas, they told me that my catalytic converters were both shot. They could fix to the tune of $2700. When I told my wife that, I almost got - well... fixed. Is this reasonable? I looked online extensively, found OE Toyota cats to be about $7-800, but aftermarket with the bolt on flanges at under $300 and not for Cali, which is okey dokey with me.

Advice appreciated, and if need be CDan, what can I get Cats and all gaskets needed for? probably time for O2 sensors as well.

I have coveted cruisers ever since my dad had the nicest 60 series in Vegas in the 90s, unfortunately traded it, but for an 96' 80, and since I tried in vain to buy a 40 in college. Let the addiction and $$$ drain begin.

[Skillet]

Welcome!

I always use these for cat trouble...





Seriously though, what are the smog laws like in Texas?

As long as you don't plan on registering it here, perhaps you could find a way "around" the problem?

No?

[fullfog]

I just took home a 96 LC with the same light,got home reset it and it has not come on since.Might give it a shot before you spend a bunch.

[Beowulf]

Originally Posted by Flank

I digress - got engine trouble light, took it to Toyota dealership in Dallas, they told me that my catalytic converters were both shot. They could fix to the tune of $2700.

Owning a 12yo vehicle with 180k miles that originally cost over $50k will create heartburn if you cannot do any maintenance yourself. Hopefully, this trip to the dealer was an outlier.

My recommendation would have been for you to:
* Take it to an AutoZone and have them pull the OBD-II code. Get the actual code (not "it says your EGR is bad..." like some places will do.) Post the code here and we will point you in the right direction.

* Find a local Land Cruiser club and get involved. Surely someone will help you.

* Post up a message in the 80-Section and ask if there is anyone in the DFW area that could pull the code for you. I am certain you would get a positive response.

There are alternatives to Toyota OEM cats if that is what you need. I have not had to deal with this issue so I can't give specifics. Do a search and if you come up empty, let me know and I will try to help with search terms.

-B-

[Koffer]

Welcome

Heres what I would do . Reset the light and see if it comes back .
If it comes back then check for leaks between the joints of the two and the front header pipe and rear pipe off the 2nd cat . If no leaks then move onto replacing both of the O2 sensors. When the O2s get old they tend to throw the cat codes as they are no longer working like they should plus if you still need to replace the cats you can reuse the new o2s .

BTW this is what I did when I got my truck and the CEL came on 2 weeks after . its been fine for over 45k miles since then
good luck with it

[CJF]

Doubtful it's the cat's.

Listen to Beo and Koffer.

[ranma21]

Hey, try to reset the light first. if that doesn't work, go with the aftermarket cat. I bought the aftermarket y pipe and cats from from Wichita, Kansas. I can't remember which web site already. I think I paid close to $400 for both. You do not have to get factory cat. It has been working fine since.

[reffug]

welcome to the wonderful world of 80 fix-it.

nice and cheap.

[DocLX450]

Randy is a local Cruiser Gear head in Irving. Most of the local guys including me goes to him. This guy know his LC in and out.

his email Randy@customcruiser.net

[Flank]

Lord, I love this group. Thanks for all the advice. I forgot to mention that I did clear the trouble light, and it remained off. I am, however, fairly environmentally minded as a guy who drives a truck that gets 13.5mph can be, and don't want to be spewing too much extra S**t into the air if I can help it. Will expired Cats affect the performance of the vehicle? will they affect my mileage? or are they purely to clean the exhaust?

[Flank]

Originally Posted by Beowulf

My recommendation would have been for you to:
* Take it to an AutoZone and have them pull the OBD-II code. Get the actual code (not "it says your EGR is bad..." like some places will do.) Post the code here and we will point you in the right direction.

-B-

Excellent suggestion, I did not realize they would do this for you. Has anybody invested in their own code reader? Is it worth it?

I took it in to the dealer to get a baseline assessment of a new vehicle. Had them do a basic check on it to make sure no glaring problems were present. I am used to wrenching a bit on my cars and love owning an older one again that I can do it again on.

Will order some o2 sensors and get them in.

[landtank]

I had a catalytic efficiency error and it was from a gasket leak. I wouldn't trust a Toyota dealer for anything. There is a story behind that mistrust but I won't bore you with it.

[CJF]

Originally Posted by Flank

Will expired Cats affect the performance of the vehicle? will they affect my mileage? or are they purely to clean the exhaust?

Affects emissions only, *unless* they're clogged.

But really: Go through everything else first. It's just highly unlikely that the cat's themselves are the problem.

Curtis

[AZ2ME]

I'm new to this site too, and have found a wealth of info here. Thanks for all the questions and answers from all the users.

As for the code reader, I picked one up from Harbor Freight for $30. Waaay worth it. They go on sale for 1/2 price periodically.

I've had the same problem, throwing the P0420 code. I turned off the CEL and it came back on in about 1200 miles. Turned it off again to get it through the state inspection and it stayed off for about 3000 miles before it came on again. Now I have what sounds to me like an exhaust leak. Local dealer said it's the cats, likely all 3, and the leak sound is the failing gaskets due to bad cats. Does that sound reasonable?

After reading the posts on here, I'll be changing the O2 sensors and guess I'll put in new gaskets. But one more question, which gaskets? I'd rather not do the exhaust manifold as I fear it's more than I can handle.

And one more question, how can I tell where an exhaust leak is? It sounds funny only under load. Revving the engine w/o load sounds normal. So kinda hard to pinpoint the sound ... unless I sit in the engine compartment while my wife drives some local hills....

[4WD Toyota Owner Magazine]

IF the issue is really a ruined cat(s), don't get them from Toyota. Other parts like seals, bearings, pumps, belts, etc... yes. But cats, no way--go aftermarket.

[landtank]

Originally Posted by AZ2ME

Local dealer said it's the cats, likely all 3, and the leak sound is the failing gaskets due to bad cats. Does that sound reasonable?

LOL there are only TWO cats in your truck. You have the efficiency error as I posted earlier and can hear an exhaust leak maybe you have a gasket problem.

Since you pulled the code I'm going with you have a 95~97 truck. There are two common places for an exhaust leak that will cause this code. The first and by far the most common is at the "Y" in the front "Y" pipe. They tend to crack right in the center and need nothing more than to be welded. The other problem is between the two cats and that only takes a new gasket.

You of course also have two gaskets at the manifolds themselves. Just fix the leak and reset the code and you should be fine.

[powderpig]

Welcome to IH8UD. I also would go the course of a couple of other guys who have posted. The cats are usually not the problem unless they have been abused(by leaded fuel or bad additives, or bumps). The O2 sensors are usually the culprits, or leaks at the Y pipe. If you do end up replaceing the cats, go with a high quality product, not a cheap cat. They can and will only cause you head aches in the most unlikely places.
As for different code readers, do a search and you will find some good info on this subject.
later and good luck Robbie

[Thermodyn]

Originally Posted by landtank

I had a catalytic efficiency error and it was from a gasket leak. I wouldn't trust a Toyota dealer for anything. There is a story behind that mistrust but I won't bore you with it.

Had this pop up also on my '96 @ 110k. Turned it off, and it's stayed off. Truck now has 114k on it.

[AZ2ME]

Originally Posted by landtank

LOL there are only TWO cats in your truck.

That's what everyone says on here, but I see one on the Y-pipe, and two inline below that. Are those two below really one?

And my welding is pitiful, so bad I've made a personal rule not to do it. Would something like JB Weld or one of those other off-the-shelf chemical welds work if I find a crack?

[charleston]

there are two inline cats under the truck just down from the Y. If it is cracked at the Y like mine was, you can eiter replace them for cheap with aftermarket or weld it for 20 bucks at a muffler shop.

[alkaline747trio]

Find an exhaust shop, tell them you have a catalytic converter deficiency error and think it's an exhaust leak (say your Toyota gurus told you that). If you drive a bunch before it, they can take an IR gauge and check your cats for proper temperature also. After the check things, there are only a few options.

Cats are good.....need gaskets/welding to fix the leaks you have

Cats are shot....Magnaflow high-flow cats work well and don't throw codes, have them use these (you can get them at summit racing) and fix any other leaks that are probably there


shouldn't cost more than $400, if they quote you more, go somewhere else.

[BrettinSanAntonio]

I had my cat replaced at an exhaust and welding shop in South San Antonio. Parts and labor were $150. This place does all the exhaust work for Land Rover of San Antonio and two local Toyota dealerships. The dealerships pay what I paid and then charge the customer what they quoted you. It's almost freaking criminal.

Originally Posted by Flank

Hey group, newbie here. Just got (after years of yearning) into my first cruiser - a one owner 95 fzj in amazing condition. Truck has 180K on it and is AMAZINGLY solid. I have no idea of the maintenance records (bought from a boutique dealership who had just had 3 rows of new leather put in). Verfied one owner status on Carfax. I love it, my wife does not understand why I sit on the front porch and stare, but she cannot see my heart leap when I get told to go to the store for baby food...

I digress - got engine trouble light, took it to Toyota dealership in Dallas, they told me that my catalytic converters were both shot. They could fix to the tune of $2700. When I told my wife that, I almost got - well... fixed. Is this reasonable? I looked online extensively, found OE Toyota cats to be about $7-800, but aftermarket with the bolt on flanges at under $300 and not for Cali, which is okey dokey with me.

Advice appreciated, and if need be CDan, what can I get Cats and all gaskets needed for? probably time for O2 sensors as well.

I have coveted cruisers ever since my dad had the nicest 60 series in Vegas in the 90s, unfortunately traded it, but for an 96' 80, and since I tried in vain to buy a 40 in college. Let the addiction and $$$ drain begin.

[Ted44]

I had the MIL (Check Engine Light, Malfunction Indicator Light) come on soon after my purchase in 2005 with maybe 160K on the odo. I took it to a local independent shop (as big as some dealer service depts). The guy calls later and tells me it's a P0420 and I need to have both cats and O2 sensors replaced. Quotes the Cat prices as $1100 for the front and $1400 for the rear .

I am a 1.5 guy. BUT, I can read and I had purchased my genuine Toyota Factory Service Manual. SO, I started asking this guy questions straight from the diagnostic procedure for this MIL code in the manual, there was dead silence on the other end of the phone. He literally said nothing. So I told him to reset the code and I'd pay him for his time to that point and be over shortly to pick up my truck. He tells me that he cannot reset the code without replacing the parts. So I told him I'd reset it myself by pulling the EFI fuse. Again, silence. I said I'd be over soon and hung up.

When I picked up the truck, the the MIL was off. I then went to Advance Auto bought a code reader for about $150. I have never had that code since that time. The truck has 200+K now.

That afternoon, I crawled under to look at the scene for myself. I found the rear O2 sensor hanging loose on the studs , which I fixed with two new studs and nuts from a local specialty fastener business.

Important point from my perspective: The FSM advises as the first step in dealing with MILs is to read and reset the code, then wait to see if it comes back. Then it advises to test the sensors themselves. There are a number of steps before replacing something like the Cats themselves.

Buy the FSM. Be an educated consumer.

[smokethedog]

Originally Posted by Koffer

Welcome

Heres what I would do . Reset the light and see if it comes back .
If it comes back then check for leaks between the joints of the two and the front header pipe and rear pipe off the 2nd cat . If no leaks then move onto replacing both of the O2 sensors. When the O2s get old they tend to throw the cat codes as they are no longer working like they should plus if you still need to replace the cats you can reuse the new o2s .

BTW this is what I did when I got my truck and the CEL came on 2 weeks after . its been fine for over 45k miles since then
good luck with it

Same deal here on a 95 when i bought it in 2002. i think the cats had been replaced before, since I only had one cat. I went with an aftermarket cat from a local muffler shop. Fixed it for about a year, then got the code again. I found an exhaust leak right behind the cat. Had that fixed, and replaced O2 sensors. Been fine since

Check for exhaust leaks, and replace O2 sensors before replacing cats. If you replace the cats, go to a muffler shop, only a couple hundred bucks to do mine. Youmight consider goin with just one unless laws/emissions folks in your area would fail you for it.

[Flank]

Originally Posted by Ted44

So I told him (toyota Dealership) to reset the code and I'd pay him for his time to that point and be over shortly to pick up my truck. He tells me that he cannot reset the code without replacing the parts. So I told him I'd reset it myself by pulling the EFI fuse. Again, silence. I said I'd be over soon and hung up.

Thead is getting long - OK by me! As the original poster, I am learning a lot.
This happened to me as well, I asked the Dealership to reset the code for me, and I would get it worked on when I had the funds. They were already charging me for putting on the scanner ($80). They said they could not reset. Not that they would not, but that they COULD not. I pulled the battery cable for 30 seconds, and the code remained off. Liars, in my estimation, and I will not give that dealership any business any more - shame because they are near my house.

[AdventureBuddies]

I had to get both cats replaced to pass CA smog and I paid $775 including parts and labor. That's the inflated Orange County / CA price. It shouldn't cost any more than that elsewhere.