FJ-80 tie rod alternatives?

theyis · 02-09-07, 09:45 AM

Hey guys,

Anyone now of alternatives for the 80 tie rod? Specifically, I would like to get the thing up and in front like the 4x4 labs setup for the earlier models. Doesn't seem to be an option with the stock knuckle with the arms mounted to the bottom of the knuckle. Anyone have a suggestion? I've thought about replacing the 80 ball ends with 40 ends so I can run the 6 pack knuckles from trail-gear.com. Anyone see a huge problem with that? Seems like it would work if I can get the 40 end welded in place. No? If that is possible I would run Longfield 40 outer axels with 80 inner axels. Need to check to see if that would work or not. I want to avoid custom inners if I can. Or am I just crazy for even asking?

Thanks,
Kyon

ktmracer01 · 02-09-07, 09:49 AM

there are a couple different ways you can go about doing tie rods and tie rod ends. I'm sure if you do a search on the subject, you might be able to find what you're looking for.

PHAEDRUS · 02-09-07, 01:18 PM

The 80 and the 40 series birfeilds are different sized, I am not sure on the inners being different but I dont think the 40 series knucle ends would clear the ball on the end of the 80 series housing.
I know that christo was working on a upper link set up for the 80's but If memory serves you had to delete the abs sensors and have a customer upper arm made.
Dave

lowtideride · 02-09-07, 01:26 PM

40series kunckles and birfs are even smaller the 60s series, 40 series guys have to grind out the knuckle a hair to run 60 series birfs.

I believe that the ends of the axle housing would be o big to run a 60 series knuckle on there. But if it turns out that they are not, you could run 60 series 6 bolt knucles with 60 series longfields, 4340 hub gears, aisin lock outs, 6 bolt steering arms...Would be very very beef. But i still dont think you would fit them over the ends of the 80series axle housing ends(where the kunckle bearings sit)

Cruiserdrew · 02-09-07, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowtideride

40series kunckles and birfs are even smaller the 60s series, 40 series guys have to grind out the knuckle a hair to run 60 series birfs.

)

Only pre-79. Otherwise they are the same.

Tool Pusher · 02-09-07, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theyis

Hey guys,

Anyone now of alternatives for the 80 tie rod? Specifically, I would like to get the thing up and in front like the 4x4 labs setup for the earlier models. Doesn't seem to be an option with the stock knuckle with the arms mounted to the bottom of the knuckle. Anyone have a suggestion? I've thought about replacing the 80 ball ends with 40 ends so I can run the 6 pack knuckles from trail-gear.com. Anyone see a huge problem with that? Seems like it would work if I can get the 40 end welded in place. No? If that is possible I would run Longfield 40 outer axels with 80 inner axels. Need to check to see if that would work or not. I want to avoid custom inners if I can. Or am I just crazy for even asking?

Thanks,
Kyon

Kyon,
The 4x4 Labs setup takes the tierod from the front of the axle where it can be hit and moves it to the rear. Since 40s and 60 have the steering arms on top of the knuckles, that is where they go when they are moved to the rear. An 80 already has the tierod behind the axle, but the steering arms are on the bottom of the knuckles to let the tie rod clear the anti-sway bar, locker mechanisms, etc. It is pretty well protected back there, even though it is mounted to the bottom of the knuckles. The relay rod from the steering box is another story. It is still out in front of the axle where it can be hit. 4x4Labs, Marlin Crawler, and Slee Offroad all sell beefier relay rods and tie rods to overcome this problem.

David Sword

theyis · 02-09-07, 06:03 PM

Thanks guys,

So I can't use older knuckles with the 80 birfs... that really throws a wrench into the works. What I am trying to do is run hydro steer (don't really care to get into a legal discussion on that) in front up high (in the back would be great but the 3rd member is in the way). The 6 shooter knuckles would have been perfect for that. So on to the second part of the question. Anyone know if it would be possible to weld in later model ends 40 or 60 and run the 6 shooter knuckles on there instead of the stock knuckles? I'd need to find out if i could run 80 Longfield inners with 40 or 60 longfield outers. By the way, I'm trying to keep this whole build in the landcruiser family. The axels are going in under a 40.

Kyon

Cruiserdrew · 02-09-07, 06:58 PM

Under a 40 you are over-thinking this. Just run FJ60 axles, the "Sixshooter" knuckle if you want and Longfield 30 spline birfs and inners. Did I miss something? If you can break a 30 spline Longfield, you can break an 80 series birf too. Then run the 4x4 Labs Highsteer and the super beefy 1 ton tie rods that 4x4 Labs makes. By the time you are fabbing 80 outers on 40 inners, there are many better choices out there-like a custom Dana 60 set-up.

theyis · 02-09-07, 09:52 PM

Drew,

You didn't miss anything I just didn't include some info. I am looking to get the benefits of the 80 axle (width, 4 wheel disks, full float, locking difs). The 80 axels seem to have everything except that pesky tie rod running low. Not much room down there for the hydro ram either. So the question is, how do the FJ 60 axels compare to the 80 in terms of the above mentioned characteristics? Are they as wide? Does the rear have disk brakes? are they full float? will the 80 3rd member drop in?

I guess I could run a 60 front and 80 rear if the widths are comparable.

Again, I'm trying to keep this all in the LC family so domestic isn't really an option. I'd also like to keep the LC electric locker(that will be converted to cable operated). Not interested in an ARB.

Keep the information coming...
Thanks,
Kyon

sleeoffroad · 02-09-07, 10:24 PM

This might help you

Hopefully the end of the power steering issues

theyis · 02-10-07, 08:57 AM

So Christo,

Can you give me your opinion? Would I be better off running a setup like that or just running a 60 front (along with the 6 pack knuckles with hi-steer) with wheel spacers to match up the width of an 80 rear? I think I can run a rear 80 diff in the 60 front housing, no? I realize I will lose the hi-pinion diff but I've heard that is weaker than the rear diff anyways. Seems like that would get me where I want to be.
Things I don't know about this setup are:
1) Is it okay to run wheel spacers while doing moderately hardcore wheeling?
2) Will the 80 3rd drop into the front 60 housing or do I need to cut the notch and drill/tap holes in the housing?
3) How much do I need to space the front wheels (I don't know how wide the 60 front axle is)
4) Which is better/stronger the 80 axle or the 60 axle set up as described above (I'll be using longfields in either setup).

Thanks,
Kyon

sleeoffroad · 02-12-07, 03:19 PM

>Can you give me your opinion? Would I be better off running a setup like that or just running a 60 front (along with the 6 pack knuckles with hi-steer) with wheel spacers to match up the width of an 80 rear?

What weight truck, what size tire and what kind of wheeling.

> I think I can run a rear 80 diff in the 60 front housing, no?

Yes,

> 1) Is it okay to run wheel spacers while doing moderately hardcore wheeling?

Moderate yes, but they do change the way the wheel turns and could make rubbing issues worse. Correct width axle with correct wheels is always batter on a steering axle.

> 2) Will the 80 3rd drop into the front 60 housing or do I need to cut the notch and drill/tap holes in the housing?

I believe it would fit

> 3) How much do I need to space the front wheels (I don't know how wide the 60 front axle is)

I don't have that measurement.

4) Which is better/stronger the 80 axle or the 60 axle set up as described above (I'll be using longfields in either setup).

80 axle due to increase in birfield size.

Thanks,
Kyon
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theyis · 02-12-07, 07:04 PM

Thanks for the reply.

This is all going into an FJ-40. I'll be running 5.29s and 40s. I'll also be 4 linking the front and rear. I live in CO too so you know what type of wheeling I'll be doing. My goal is to be able to do stuff like Carnage without much trouble. I'm not going to be doing competition or anything. I'm more of a steady as you go kind of driver so no big HP engine. I'm thinking 3FE at the moment. I'm trying to keep the build almost completely Toyota (and Land Cruiser for that matter). The exceptions at the moment are the NV4500 and the Klune.

If I stick with the 80 front axle, how much is the setup you posted? I didn't see it on the site.

Also, is it true that the hi-pinion 80 third is weaker than the 80 rear? I've read a few posts on that but I'm not convinced.

On another note… I was planning on going full hydro and will most of the time be driving to the trail. Can you explain why full hydro is a handful at speed? Seems counter intuitive to me. The setup should be really tight and controllable but everybody seems to say it’s not. I realize it should feel different and I understand things like lack of feedback but I’ve done the research and it seems you can counter some of that stuff to a certain extent. What gives?

Thanks again for the reply,
Kyon