Should I buy an 80, costs of ownership?

[BOUNDER]

I learned this life lesson early when I had to buy parts for my sweet 1990 VW Jetta GLi 16v, Wolfsburg Edition red, Recaro, BBS, Alpine, etc. The car was hot, a blast to drive and someone was always trying to steal it but parts cost as much as if not more than parts for a 5-series BMW! I'm not a big BMW guy but I know they cost. It's one thing to buy that pre-owned $50k+ vehicle(or house) but it's another thing to operate and maintain it after the sale.

[FJ809496TLC]

Combined cost of maintenance and repair on my LCs to date is $7400, upgrade at $2735 and extra parts at $810. Not enough time and money spent on upgrades that's why the figure is low and hopefully will change in the near future.

[Brian Macgyver]

Romer mentioned many things. His is a pretty comprehensive list. I can back him up on at least two.
The sunroof is bulletproof. My 80 came to me rolled over. I assumed that I would have to weld a panel over the sunroof and have a unique solid roof 80. My roof was crushed over 6"! The sunroof glass has several scratches on it. That is one lucky piece of glass! But when reinstalled the sunroof worked perfectly! It has no leaks and no wind noise. It is great.
P0401 code comes up often on mine. It is always on a cold morning when I must take off without the proper warm-up time. Then it is only one time in ten or more. It seems like the EGR kicks on in cold condition. If on a short trip, I ignore it, knowing what it is. If I am going far I pull over and remove the EFI fuse to reset, and drive on. This is because of fuel mileage which is reduced in back-up mode. I don't really worry about it much. Maybe I'll fix it someday...

[RAYJON]

To add a little more to what everyone has said, these are not cheep vehicles, but not expensive to maintain by any means I budget 500-1000 per year each in parts/maintence. The excellent build quality and design allow almost everything to be rebuilt and with proper maintence it is designed to last a long, long time.

I tend to agree with what everyone has said and Slee said it best about the 2k when getting a used one. Both of my used ones needed about 1k in parts and my labor when I got them to make them perfect. Now both had great maintainence records and were very clean. But in baselining each the shops/dealerships that worked on them were less than stellar and the PO had no clue either time.. My 93 had a birnfield pack and brake job 2 week prior to me buying it and was a great selling point, untill the cheep pads started to squeek, pulled it apart to find rotors turned under minimum, factory 200k wheel bearings, and the front motor plate missing. Aratco built a excellet truck, the idiots who serviced it up untill I got it is another point.

If you do a little reading and go in with your eyes open there are a great rig. The build qualty and built to last design will be arround a long time. I plan on driving mine for at least another 10 years.. and when you compare 1000 a year average in parts to 700-800 a month in a payment the choice is easy I will put that money in my pocket.

[cc93cruiser]

I have always thought and said before that the land cruiser 80 series is the perfect platform/baseline to start any trail rig build up..Definitley the "best bang for the buck" 4wheeler out there....

[enutter]

So, would you be worried about buying an 80 with 138,000 miles? How long do they usually go before major repairs?

[TroutRunner]

Originally Posted by enutter

So, would you be worried about buying an 80 with 138,000 miles? How long do they usually go before major repairs?

I bought mine with 126,000 miles, now has 138,000 miles.

The question about how long for major repairs depends on how it has been taken care of up to now. Plenty of people on here have bought trucks with much higher mileage than mine.

TR

[enutter]

OK. Let's say it is a well maintained LC. How long do they usually run before major problems?

[Grench]

Well maintained is a subjective measurement. For some on here that would include rotating the blinker fluid. A simple indicator would be to know if the axles had ever been serviced/repacked within the last 60,000 miles.

Remember that these trucks are 10+ years old. They will require ongoing maintenance. Some stuff will be on the verge of wearing out. You can't blame the truck for that. Comon wear parts at 150,000+ miles include water pumps, U joints, radiators, brakes (not just pads but rotors and calipers), rust, tires, rubber hoses, plastic bits that are supposed to flex but don't now (air cleaner tube), bushings, paint, seat surfaces, shifter knobs, brake & gas pedals, steering wheel cover...

The above is maintenance as they are moving/wear parts. Even the paint (sun, wind, rain, hail, sand, bugs...)

What do you consider major? There is no warranty at this point. Depending on your level of desired maintenance though, you can wind up with a substantial bill for bits here and there.

On the other hand, if you aren't worried about aesthetics at all, change the oil once in a while, lube, gas it and go.

[Beowulf]

Originally Posted by enutter

OK. Let's say it is a well maintained LC. How long do they usually run before major problems?

How long will your 1988 4Runner go before major problems? How long is a piece of string? Yours seems like a simple question, but there really is no answer Enutter and I think you know it.

-B-

[stuck in GA]

Bottom line yall buy an 80! Great fun!

[enutter]

Thanks Grench. You actually tried to answer the question. I think there is a bit of overanalyzing going on here. I don't think I'll find one with rotated blinker fluid.

How long is a piece of string? Gee...that really helped.

I understand it is not a new car with 138,000 miles on it and expect some maintenance. Let me rephrase the question.

How long on average do they usually go before the engine dies? Do you think I can get 250k out of one?

[TroutRunner]

Originally Posted by enutter

How long on average do they usually go before the engine dies? Do you think I can get 250k out of one?

Yes.

Search or flip through a few pages in the 80 section. ther is a thread with people detailing the most miles on their rigs.

TR

[BHMCruiser]

Originally Posted by enutter

So, would you be worried about buying an 80 with 138,000 miles? How long do they usually go before major repairs?

My '94 has 220,000 miles on it. Major repairs have included new spark plugs, new rotors, and an a/c butterfly valve.

I just bought a '97 with 135,000 miles on it. I hope to have the same luck.

[BHMCruiser]

Originally Posted by enutter

OK. Let's say it is a well maintained LC. How long do they usually run before major problems?

You need to search. There's a lot of information on this in the archives. There are lots of engines over 200,000 miles, but you have to recognize that you are buying a used car. It may run ten more feet.

My personal opinion is that this particular engine is a very strong runner.

[Beowulf]

Originally Posted by BHMCruiser

I just bought a '97 with 135,000 miles on it. I hope to have the same luck.

And "luck" is the key point here. With good luck (or, more accurately, lack of bad luck...) you will get to 300k+ with no major problems. And we have seen a few cases of bad luck where the HG blew in the first few days/weeks of ownership. Mud member lars had this happen to him as did ali and a handful of others.

I remember one guy here on 'Mud that found the truck he had been looking for over many months. His wife loved it. It was the perfect colour. It was a great price. It was in excellent condition with all the records. It had everything they wanted on their 80. They made the deal and the dealer had to move the truck for some reason... inspection or something... during this drive the truck was in a terrible wreck and the vehicle was very badly damaged. I would say that was some piss poor luck.

-B-

[BHMCruiser]

Originally Posted by Beowulf

And "luck" is the key point here. With good luck (or, more accurately, lack of bad luck...) you will get to 300k+ with no major problems. And we have seen a few cases of bad luck where the HG blew in the first few days/weeks of ownership. Mud member lars had this happen to him as did ali and a handful of others.

I remember one guy here on 'Mud that found the truck he had been looking for over many months. His wife loved it. It was the perfect colour. It was a great price. It was in excellent condition with all the records. It had everything they wanted on their 80. They made the deal and the dealer had to move the truck for some reason... inspection or something... during this drive the truck was in a terrible wreck and the vehicle was very badly damaged. I would say that was some piss poor luck.

-B-

Yes, but how was the head gasket?

I personally felt (opinion only) that the hg in my 94 was going to last the life of the truck, as I was the one and only owner; I constantly worry about the 97. It is an unknown quantity.

[dman93]

Noob here to ih8mud, but almost 12 years ownership of a '93 bought as a lease return in '95. Except for fuel cost (and that's no different than any similar SUV) the cost of ownership has been phenomenally low. After all, basic consumables are pretty much the same whether it's an 80 or an Expedition. My mileage isn't thant high, only 135K, and I'm sure little things will start to go, but even a dealer engine and a trans rebuild will be cheaper than a new premium SUV. And, what other premium SUV can do the Rubicon with few mods (done it twice, and BTW a modest lift for the 80 is less than most IFS/leaf spring lifts), and then haul 7 kids on a school field trip on Monday?

-dmna93

[Kalawang]

Originally Posted by enutter

How long on average do they usually go before the engine dies? Do you think I can get 250k out of one?

The question isn't right. In the case of most modern cars, the engine easily outlives the body. Back in the time of the rolling tank, it was a close call. What is normally fatal to most vehicles is automatic obsolescence as dictated by annual model changes, new features, technological progress and abusively poor maintenance.

The hidden cost of an 80 is less the maintenance of the vehicle, unless you've fallen into the 1H8MUD sickness of looking diligently for something to maintain, but more the effect of having aquired one and being happy with it. Many owners aquire the need to modify and accessorize when no longer burdened by monthly amortizations. Subsequent to modifications, distant road travel, preferably where there are few or no roads, becomes an overiding need and upon arrival in a remote location, a need to climb seemingly unclimbable and downright dangerous obstacles.

These after aquisition sicknesses can cost many times more than the vehicle. Those who don't buy one can safely stay at home, spend their money on chips and TV and argue about politics.


Kalawang

[enutter]

Sorry for asking.

[FJ809496TLC]

Originally Posted by enutter

Sorry for asking.

Don't be. These motors on the average will lasts more than 200k plus miles easy if not abused. So, the average is on your side if you take care of it.

[Kalawang]

Originally Posted by enutter

Sorry for asking.

I guess I'm really poor at kidding people and should stop trying to be humerous and semi serious. I was just pulling your leg and doing a bad job of it.

Even the worst engine made these days can be made to run far longer than the body, provided you are willing to spend for parts and labor. It's usually the body that dies and that's because they are now made of hardened steel rather than mild steel. It became necessary to make the change because of the need for fuel economy. The thinner but harder steel is rust prone and gets eaten like peanuts, which gave birth to the anti-rust industry.

Again, my apologies for such a poor joke.


Kalawang

[FJ809496TLC]

Originally Posted by Kalawang

I guess I'm really poor at kidding people and should stop trying to be humerous and semi serious. I was just pulling your leg and doing a bad job of it.

Even the worst engine made these days can be made to run far longer than the body, provided you are willing to spend for parts and labor. It's usually the body that dies and that's because they are now made of hardened steel rather than mild steel. It became necessary to make the change because of the need for fuel economy. The thinner but harder steel is rust prone and gets eaten like peanuts, which gave birth to the anti-rust industry.

Again, my apologies for such a poor joke.


Kalawang

You might want to use some clickable smilies in your jokes.

[Miescha]

Great info on this thread - I'm definately saving it via thread subscription.

I purchased my 80 new in 1996 and the original window sticker (still in my file) is for just under $52k and that was before I added some stuff from the dealer (including block heater).

Add in the ARB, Warn M12k, PIAA lights, dual optimas, Milford barrier, blah, blah, blah, and I should be shot for spending that much money. But I simply love the thing.

I've owned many other high-end vehicles and currently have everything from a BMW 7 series to a GMC Yukon XL and Ford F350 in the garage - but I still drive the 80 more than anything else and I know I can always rely on it to get me where I'm going no matter the terrain.

Sadly, I am not as skilled as many on this board so I can't do as much as I would like, but I'm reading and learning. The more I learn though, the more concerned I am to take the 80 to the dealer - I'm afraid they will just do the minimum and I'll have problems as a result.

So to the new people, buy the 80 and don't look back. To the old-timers, thanks for all the help and for putting up with the many, many questions from people like me.

[joker]

Originally Posted by aslan1

WOW! I work as ageneral sales manager for a high line used car dealership in Illinois . I recently bought a 1994 Landcruiser for $6000 . good deal , maybe . I am lucky to be able to purchase such a nice vehicle for such a low price. but by no means is this a $30 - $40k vehicle. The one thing you all miss , and excuse me for my bluntness , is market. market very simply meaning , in my opinon and that of my industry , depreciation and resale value. Granted at one point the 80 series was worth as high as $50,000 + brand new , but so was the ford excursion! I wouldnt pay fifty for either! Also granted the capability of the landcruiser is far greater than the excursion , but they are both used and you can buy a comparably equipped 2001 excursion for the same price as a 1994 landcruiser. resale is always higher on a better vehicle. Better meaning build quality and maintenance. but a 12 year old vehicle is 12 YEARS OLD!!! Why sink money into something with depreciating resale value. The more you put in, the more you lose. Buy cheap, it hurts less in the long run.

this thread had nothing to do with resale values...
this thread is about people owning/considering a now-affordable offroad legend.
speaking of the long run.. i plan to put 500k on mine.

[tech_dog]

Originally Posted by joker

this thread had nothing to do with resale values...
this thread is about people owning/considering a now-affordable offroad legend.
speaking of the long run.. i plan to put 500k on mine.

It's also a warning that it may not be as affordable as you might think.

If you work at it, you can pick up a LC for little more than $5K. While this is low price to pay for such a capable machine, you shouldn't forget that you then become the owner of a high end, high quality, luxury vehicle.

One of CDan's points is that the vehicle doesn't know you bought it used, and an alternator will still cost you $600 or so if you need to buy a new one.

It's not a $600 alternator going into a $5,000 vehicle. It's a $600 alternator going into a $50,000 vehicle.