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#1 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Maximising the performance of the stock alternator
Like many of you, I've noted that my stock alt doesn't able to keep up with lights/heater/wipers/etc. I've been tempted to just install a higher amp alternator, but after reading lots of posts, reading the book "managing 12 volts" talking to wranglernw, david dearborn, to the guy at madelectric, and a few others, I decided to first make sure that my stock charging "system" was working properly. Turns out it's not a question of the alternator, you've got to make sure the system is up to snuff.
My 60 has a replacement engine, done by the PO, not a real clean install. I've never been sure that the wiring and emissions were done right. To simplify things, I purchased David Dearborns charging system upgrade wiring. Really nice product! I can make cables my self, but his are awesome, and more importantly I got more cables than I expected! So, first improvement is that I now have all of the right ground wires! Plus, they are so big that any voltage drop is negligable. Second improvement is that I added a 2 guage wire direct from the alt to the battery positive. I kept the existing wiring intact. (I fused this new wire.) This idea is direct from the guy at madelectric. My system voltage stays a lot more stable with this wire in place. Third improvement is that I used the slee headlight harness for my higher watt bulbs, but I ran the hot lead direct from the alternator (again a suggestion from the mad guy). This way the bulbs get 14.5 volts and run brighter. The relay harness takes a load off of the rest of the OEM harness, which allows the heater/etc to run better - again further stabilizing system voltage. Overall impact is very noticable. Used to be that at idle, I had 11.5 volts with lights on. Less with heater/wipers/etc. Maybe got to 12.5 at higher rpm. Now I get 12.5 - 13 volts at idle with lights on, and barely less than that with everything running. I have a solid 14.5 volts at higher rpm. It's pretty cold in Seattle right now (for Seattle anyway) - but the effect of my new system is that my cruiser starts super fast and easy. No question, this new system is notably better at colder temps. My alternator was always putting out 14.5 volts (over 1000 rpm) it's just that my poor electrical system didn't allow that juice to get where it needed. Too much resistance. __________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#2 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,820
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Glad it worked out. What did you fuse the batt direct wire at?
__________________ David Dearborn www.urbanlandcruisers.com Foreign Minister for life of the White Trash of the Elwood Chapter. I collect Hello Kitty |
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#3 |
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Still Lookin'
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On the headlight wiring... you'll burn bulbs out quicker, so don't go spending a lot of cash on high dollar bulbs.
good tips though! Also, was this in the 80 or 60? I didn't know slee made a 60 series headlight harness. __________________ Eric P. 1993 Landcruiser, 190K miles. Lifted, Locked, Slidered, Slee'd, Snork'd, Winched, bobbed. Daily driver. ROTW |
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#5 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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David,
Here's the fuse block I used. http://www.bluesea.com/product.asp?P...63&l1=7463&l2= Note that they also have a 35-300 amp version. I used a 60am fuse for now. But if I ever get a higher amp alt, I can just swap in the appropriate fuse. I'm pretty sure that pimp has one of these in his blue 60 - I think I remember seeing it on the PS fender. (Great pics pimp - thanks!) Doc, I use Hella H4 100/80 bulbs, approx $8 ea. Lots more light at this voltage, and I made this change over one year ago, with no burned bulbs yet. I keep a few extra's around though. Keep in mind though that our old trucks tend to deliver lower voltage to the lights than newer vehicles. Not sure what the H4's are designed for, but I can see better. Slee did make a harness for both the 60 and 80. I have one of each. Don't know if he still makes the one for the 60. One more note I forgot to put in last night...in "managing 12 volts" they talk about the effect of corrosion on different circuts. For a starting circut, where high amps are needed, corrosion reduces amps considerably. Clean tight connections (with huge freakin wires!) is needed. For lights, corroded connections still work, amps aren't significantly reduced, but volts go down. Lights still work, but are dimmer. Based on this info, I pulled all my bulbs, cleaned the contacts as well as I could, used dialectric grease, and reassembled. It's hard to judge the visual impact of this effort, but it makes sense to do I think. __________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#6 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
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I run 80/100 Hella's in all my round headlight cruisers, one set is 2 years old, no burnt bulbs, all have the upgraded harness for more volts.
just did Connies 62, did Hella H-4's with 80/100 and Hella H-1's with 55 bulbs.........CRAP that thing is putting out some light
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#7 |
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IH8MUD Addict
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you've been a very busy boy....
hey, how about the full title, name of author, and publisher on that electrical book "managing 12 volts" you mention in your post above? -dogboy- '87 FJ60 __________________ Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in. - Mark Twain - '87 FJ60: http://web.mac.com/p2larowe/iWeb/The...e/Arrival.html |
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#8 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Dogboy,
Managing 12 volts, second edition Author - Harold Barre Publisher - Summer Breeze Publishing, Incline Village NV. ISBN - 0-9647386-2-7 I think I may have purchased it from wranglernw - located in Portland! __________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#9 |
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IH8MUD Addict
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lovetoski, you are THE man!!
![]() i'll check it out, thanks, -db- __________________ Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in. - Mark Twain - '87 FJ60: http://web.mac.com/p2larowe/iWeb/The...e/Arrival.html |
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#10 | |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Quote:
__________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#11 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Pimp,
Glad to hear that you like how Connie's 62 has turned out. I'm helping my sis make a similar upgrade to her 62. I got her off on the right foot for x-mas with some e-code low/high lamps, but stuck with the stock 55/65 watt bulbs because I hadn't found the right harness yet. You mention in a thread in the FAQ that you got your harness from Wayne Tangen...does he sell them still? Not sure that I want to make one, though the instructions/diagram look pretty straightforward. Thanks for your help. __________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#12 | |
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IH8MUD Addict
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Quote:
I was in my freezing cold garage last Monday afternoon trying to do just that, adjust the valves, and long story short, what I got for my efforts: the flu which is still kicking me a week later So although it may appear to be procrastination on the surface, don't confuse it primal wisdom -db- __________________ Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in. - Mark Twain - '87 FJ60: http://web.mac.com/p2larowe/iWeb/The...e/Arrival.html |
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#13 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: One of Four Presidential Flying Saucers
Posts: 1,459
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Man, kick ass post. I don't have the drain problem that you were having, but I do see some dragging when everything is on. Sounds like the second charge wire might be the one thing that could improve it overall.
Do you have any photos of what you did? Would love to see that setup. |
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#14 |
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IH8MUD Lifer - No Appeal
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,497
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This one goes to the FAQ...
Mike S __________________ '96 FZJ80, locked, Hanna sliders, ARB bumper, Kaymar rear with spare carrier, 45 gallon Longranger aux fuel tank, OBA, Hella 4000's, OME lift, 285/75/R16 Revos & AutoHome Maggiolina rooftop tent, etc. Custom Cruiser trailer with OverLand tent www.AutoHomeUS.com TLCA Member #14874 |
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#15 | |
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IH8MUD Addict
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Quote:
Gotta say, Wayne's product quality and attention to detail is top-notch. -Ken __________________ Ken, Cascade Cruisers '64 FJ40, '66 FJ45, '79 FJ40, '81 BJ42, '82 BJ42, '85 xcab, '89 FJ62 Steens Photography, LLC |
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#16 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Glad you guys find the post helpful. My camara's at work, and I'm off today, but I'll post some pics tomorrow.
__________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#17 | |
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IH8MUD Lifer
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I would expect if he does another batch is will be close to a year from now, that how long it was last time. I'd make one but for the $90 it cost from Wayne.......I thought that was a great value.
Quote:
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#18 |
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lv junky
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[quote=lovetoski]
Second improvement is that I added a 2 guage wire direct from the alt to the battery positive. I kept the existing wiring intact. (I fused this new wire.) This idea is direct from the guy at madelectric. My system voltage stays a lot more stable with this wire in place. QUOTE] a couple of questions on your added charging wire install first how did you route it? did you go up to the fire wall and around the engine that way or did you go in front of the radiator? if you went the fire wall route what lengths of cable did you end up using. ie the length from the alt to the fusable link then the section from the fuseable link to the battery? thanks Jason __________________ 88'fj62 for sale http://forum.ih8mud.com/vehicles-tra...ml#post3719889 64'fj45lv http://forum.ih8mud.com/fj45-owners-club/44501-wilmas-buildup-thread-fj45lv.html M101 trailer build http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.p...89#post2076689 http://www.yankeetoys.org/ |
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#19 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Jason,
I didn't have time to post pics today - sorry. The length of wire is about 2 feet. The wire goes from the alt to the battery positive. It does not go to the firewall. The 2 ga wire is pretty thick, and kind of hangs there in space. I have installed a 60 amp fuse in the middle of this wire, so really it's two 1 foot long wires. The fuse will be screwed to the fender. (Right now it's zip-tied to the A/C lines, as it got dark and I ran out of time.) Not sure that 2 ga wire is really needed. I had it laying around. It might be overkill. You end up with two wires from the alt to the batter. The OEM wires, including the fusable + the new wire. Hope this helps. Let me know. __________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#20 | |
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IH8MUD Lifer
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Jason has a 62 and as so the alt on the other side of the engine then a 60, so its a longer run.
If it were me on a 62 I would go infront of the rad, between the grill. Quote:
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#21 |
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lv junky
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yeah I have my dual battery wiring routed in front of the radiator. I am thinking of just running the extra alt wire together with the aux bat cable in a 5/8 section of hose for protection.
thanks Jason __________________ 88'fj62 for sale http://forum.ih8mud.com/vehicles-tra...ml#post3719889 64'fj45lv http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=44501 M101 trailer build http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.p...89#post2076689 http://www.yankeetoys.org/ |
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#22 |
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IH8MUD Rookie
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 69
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Was there ever any pics of this posted?
__________________ '84 FJ60 |
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#23 |
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IH8MUD Rookie
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: South FL
Posts: 34
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HI, I am having some problems with my charging system on my 87 fj60. My ac is droping out and my turn signls both come on turn off raido or somthing ac kicks back on. I thought alt problem but after readin this post it has me thinking
Looks to be an after mkt alt and is puttimg out about 13 volts at 1000rpm and 11 to 12 at idle. Went to local toyota dealer to price new OEM alt and they wanted to know if i needed a 40 or 50 amp alt?? Now I am wondering if alt is good and somthing else is going on.
__________________ Walk softley and carry a big fish |
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#24 |
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IH8MUD Addict
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Louisville, CO
Posts: 696
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Maybe check the VR
Before replacing the alt, maybe check or replce the voltage regulator? I had some goofy voltage drops and after chaging to Dearborn's batt cables (Very nice product), it was a little better. But not right. I put in a new VR, it's much better.
just a thought. __________________ 1987 FJ60, SROR Sliders, lockers, 4.11s, 33s and other stuff 1977 FJ40, mostly stock. |
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#25 | |
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IH8MUD Addict
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Trying to stack dimes
Posts: 656
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Quote:
I'm in Seattle and I'd let you look at mine but I'm taking the truck down to Over the Hill tomorrow for my engine rebuild
__________________ Joel '89 FJ-62 |
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#26 | |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,637
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Quote:
__________________ Doug G Seattle, WA TLCA#12671 1994 fzj80, 275,000 miles, 285X75/15, Billy's, dual batteries 1987 fj60, 310,00 miles, 3" lift, 33X10.50's BFG MT, dual battery, rear drawers, CB, tuffy, , lockright, 4.10's and H41 soon |
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#27 |
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IH8MUD Lifer
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Tamarindo, Costa Rica
Posts: 1,900
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I didn't have any large fuse holders sitting around, so I went with a 10ga wire and two 30 amp fuses...
I figure that stock wire should be carrying *some* of the load Anyhow, I gained .5 volts at the fuse box. That's a pretty nice step up for a $5 upgrade. If/when I get a maxi fuse holder, I may add a larger wire, maybe 8ga or 6 ga. I'm not convinced that going all the way up to 2ga is worth it.... according to this voltage calculater http://genuinedealz.com/voltage-drop.html you should see less than .2 v drop at 60 amps, 5 ft, 6ga wire. My alt doesn't put out 60 amps. And it is only a foot of 4ga wire going to my aux fuse box, from which my high-amp loads come off... but even with just a 10ga wire, there is an improvment. __________________ 91 fj80 w/ 93 1HD-T. OME 850/860 w/ 1" front spacer, LEDs, HIRs, Hankook MT's 31x10.50r15, Tuffy center, ARB rear locker (in progress), in garage: lightforce lights, full rack, superwinch X9, maggiolina tent, hella horns. WTB: Tan DS mirror & housing '88 HJ60, "Louie" For Sale in Costa Rica.
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