I'm Not Going to Jail!

[lehiguy]

After years of wondering about the possible consequences of my actions, those of removing all my smog stuff and eventually the entire motor, I called the engineer at the Division of Air Quality in the Utah County Health Department. His answers surprised me. Basicly, anything made between 1969 and 1988 has to retain only two items and that's only if they came from the factory with those items; an air pump and a cat. He said you can't go backwards, like putting a carb on something that was fuel injected, but you can certainly go the other way. EGR is not something they care about. So I confessed that I had been running a V8 in the rig that originally came with an I6 but that it gets better milage and the emissions are actually better, and he though that was great! All of this was caused by some twit at the place where I got my emissions done (it passes at the pipe). He said the county had mobile rigs that tested vehicle emissions at the roadside with a lazer of some sort, and if you get tripped up by that thing, you're going to the county for a complete inspection. So I got worried. Well, they were doing this but they aren't anymore and besides, all I lack is an air pump to be perfectly legal which I could get if I had to. Ahh, the relief!

[ToTalXS]

does the air pump have to be mounted and working or could you just mount it lets say as a hood ornament as long as the truck had it?

[Trapper50cal]

Just keep it as an idler and gut it, they wouldn't open it up

[Downey]

My guess is that Utah law is the same as 50 State law. If so, the air quality entity in your State would be tickled pink with you installing a late model muscle engine into your Toyota because they run sooooo much cleaner.You do, however, have to leave 1,000 percent of the emissions equipment on the newer engine. The newer LS-1, LT-1, and Vortec engines are sweet because they are very self contained without smog pumps.

[IndianDoc]

Originally Posted by Downey

My guess is that Utah law is the same as 50 State law. If so, the air quality entity in your State would be tickled pink with you installing a late model muscle engine into your Toyota because they run sooooo much cleaner.You do, however, have to leave 1,000 percent of the emissions equipment on the newer engine. The newer LS-1, LT-1, and Vortec engines are sweet because they are very self contained without smog pumps.

While I love the idea of the v8 wont do the mod just for the extra performance, my desmogged 6 has enoughf for me. However any problem with the Smog cops and in goes a late model V8. Great news.

[Trapper50cal]

Originally Posted by IndianDoc

While I love the idea of the v8 wont do the mod just for the extra performance, my desmogged 6 has enoughf for me. However any problem with the Smog cops and in goes a late model V8. Great news.

I assume each state (and for that matter each county) has different standards????

[calixto]

Dude, you worry too much!

[Eshu Elegua]

Florida has No emissions law,so here you can run whatever you want...but we have to pay the price : No Mountains or Hard core Rock crawling....

[lehiguy]

Originally Posted by Downey

My guess is that Utah law is the same as 50 State law. If so, the air quality entity in your State would be tickled pink with you installing a late model muscle engine into your Toyota because they run sooooo much cleaner.You do, however, have to leave 1,000 percent of the emissions equipment on the newer engine. The newer LS-1, LT-1, and Vortec engines are sweet because they are very self contained without smog pumps.

When I do the TBI I'll claim it's a '96 Vortec, the block and heads already are.

[pappy]

That brings up a question I've had. Did Toyota install a smog pump on the F engine in 1969? I can't find anything that says they did. I seem to recall looking at a 1971 PIGGY lately and don't remember seeing an air pump.

[brett76]

Originally Posted by Eshu Elegua

Florida has No emissions law,so here you can run whatever you want...but we have to pay the price : No Mountains or Hard core Rock crawling....

didnt that JUST change? you guys are adopting cali standards i heard on the news

talk about 0 to 100

[rchalmers3]

Dude, I baked you a cake.....

Dos'nt Utah require a certification after a conversion?

Rick

[Bret]

Originally Posted by brett76

didnt that JUST change? you guys are adopting cali standards i heard on the news

talk about 0 to 100

That's not funny! I might be changing stuff over to the older chassis for emissions.

[lehiguy]

Originally Posted by rchalmers3

Dude, I baked you a cake.....

Dos'nt Utah require a certification after a conversion?

Rick

I never asked that question nor was anything like that mentioned by the guy I spoke with. I reccomend calling in your particular county to find out what exactly the laws require as they will most certainly vary from place to place. Although I'm not racing down there to show off what I've done, it's nice to know that if worse came to worst, I wouldn't be forced to restore it to factory stuff. Can you imagine how aweful that would be?

[cr cruzr]

California and the Smog Thread;

Any vehicle prior to 1975 manufacturer model year is EXEMPT from any/all Smog Testing. Actually, the accepted standard now is any vehicle has to be thirty (30) years old to be exempt. As well, any vehicle that is diesel, electric, natural gas (over 14K#), hybrid, or a motorcycle is exempt.

So, if your rig is 30 years old, or more, then you can thumb your nose at being required to test. Do what you want under the hood. Or, stick a diesel under the hood. Hell, be the first on your block with a FJ60 Electric.

As an aside, when I lived in Europe there were plenty of guys who kept two engines ready for their choice rides (toys). The first one was the engine that they used to play with (major horsepower). The second one was to please the inspectors. Though it was a hassle to switch out engines every year (for only one day), it provided them plenty of fun for the rest of the year.

So, any vehicle in California today, that is model year 1978 - or older - is currently exempt. One more note; when any vehicle is tested, it will be tested according to the standards for that given vehicle. Which means it only has to pass the standards set forth for that vehicle year. If you have put in a much newer powerplant (with fuel injection and such), it will likely perform much better than the old powerplant.

[ToyotaDon]

Originally Posted by cr cruzr

Any vehicle prior to 1975 manufacturer model year is EXEMPT from any/all Smog Testing.

This part is true, the rest about the 30 year rolling exemption is no longer true. It stopped at 1975, but with our wonderful PRK lawmakers, it may change again.

Technically, even though '75 and older vehicles do not require smog inspections, all emission control devices are still supposed to be retained and working properly. The question is, will anybody ever check?

Adding another note: If the powertrain is changed out on these newer vehicles, it has to be inspected by a "referee" who puts a special label on it for future smog checks. So the powertrain you use has to be complete and all functioning, including MIL, computer controls, etc.

[Poser]

Originally Posted by pappy

That brings up a question I've had. Did Toyota install a smog pump on the F engine in 1969? I can't find anything that says they did. I seem to recall looking at a 1971 PIGGY lately and don't remember seeing an air pump.

I would say yes, as I have parted out a 1969 that had an air pump, air rail ports on the head and all the other little smog goodies......

[Tinker]

Here's the final word: The federal EPA made the rule but states decide how they enforce it - donor vehicle has to be same year or newer than the recipient. You can put a truck motor in a car, but not vice versa. It has to be paired with the same type & vintage of transmission as the donor vehicle. And the active smog components must be retained in the same configuration as in the donor vehicle.

I know because the shop that did the 5.7 Vortec/4L60E conversion to my '84 60 got a bright idea & put 2 O2 sensors right after the headers & Yd the sides together into a single cat & put the 2nd 2 O2 sensors in the single pipe after the cat. The guys at the State of Colorado emissions center were kind enough to point me to the law & state that the shop would be in a world of hurt if they didn't correct the situation (needed to be 2 O2 sensors, 2 cats, 2 O2 sensors).

If you disable or remove smog equipment, think about what could happen when you move or sell your truck. If you move to a smog control area, it's going to be tested & inspected. Same thing if the person you sell it to moves. I've never heard of a private party being convicted of removing smog equipment, but professional mechanics are plenty scared of it.

The Vortec conversion is great - I got 16mpg one day on a 75 mph trip to Georgetown up I-70 & back & that included a bunch of town driving, & it doesn't stink up the garage when I start it.

[cr cruzr]

My bad...

[Downey]

Originally Posted by cr cruzr

My bad...

Yep, I was kinda thinking your bad. Being the guy who works with this stuff all day long I have to say that Toyota Don and Tinker are 1,000 percent spot-on.

[lehiguy]

Originally Posted by ToyotaDon

This part is true, the rest about the 30 year rolling exemption is no longer true. It stopped at 1975, but with our wonderful PRK lawmakers, it may change again.

Technically, even though '75 and older vehicles do not require smog inspections, all emission control devices are still supposed to be retained and working properly. The question is, will anybody ever check?

Adding another note: If the powertrain is changed out on these newer vehicles, it has to be inspected by a "referee" who puts a special label on it for future smog checks. So the powertrain you use has to be complete and all functioning, including MIL, computer controls, etc.

Good hell, move out of CA! Let the smog Nazis have it to themselves.

[Max.Powerzz]

I just went through this. Both cats were dead,and I wanted to do a y-pipe into just one cat. The shop freaked out as if their lines were all tapped by the FBI, and were adamant that they had to follow regulations to the "T" or risk the death penalty. And this was one of the "flexible" shops that's not normally concerned with those types of things.

[roscoFJ73]

Originally Posted by Max.Powerzz

I just went through this. Both cats were dead,and I wanted to do a y-pipe into just one cat. The shop freaked out as if their lines were all tapped by the FBI, and were adamant that they had to follow regulations to the "T" or risk the death penalty. And this was one of the "flexible" shops that's not normally concerned with those types of things.

Sounds like they have been warned

[rchalmers3]

Originally Posted by Tinker

....donor vehicle has to be same year or newer than the recipient. You can put a truck motor in a car, but not vice versa. It has to be paired with the same type & vintage of transmission as the donor vehicle. And the active smog components must be retained in the same configuration as in the donor vehicle. .....

This is not exactly correct. Yes to same year and newer. Yes to transfering ALL the emissions systems from the donor.

The part you didn't state correctly is the weight classification. You CAN put a light truck motor in a Land Cruiser..... because the LC weight classification is in that catagory. Motors from lighter cars or heavier trucks are NOT allowed. That is why you are not allowed to put car motors in LC's as you state.

Your info on trannys is suspect. I was a certified smog tech and sat on a panel that helped the Air Resources Board write the BAR 2000 laws back in the day and I don't recall any limits on the trannys. We dealt with what would impact emissions and trannys don't usually make stink.

Hope this helps "clear the air"

Rick

[cr cruzr]

Just convert the damn thing to CNG, LPG, or Diesel, and tell the BAR peeps to go to hell. It won't matter what engine is under the hood. The key is that you get a lifetime smog exemption with these types of conversions.

When you convert the fuel of the vehicle, it forces the smog people to adhere to a whole other set of rules. They are required to follow these mandates just like anybody else.

Cheapest place to find a CNG vehicle? Try a local auction house that deals with municipal vehicles. Plenty can be found - and most with low miles. If you can do an engine swap, you can do it for less than most any shop will charge just for another engine.

Let the naysayers join in...


(note that this info. applies to California)