what is THIS for? well whatever it is it's leaking...

ZRotheohv · 10-05-06, 11:49 PM

This is a pic of the head and the #5 spark plug. The culprit is the white thing circled in the middle, between the #4 and #5 spark plugs. What is it/its purpose? Kinda need to know since it's leaking like MAD. Is it a replaceable plug of some sort? Is there anything I can do to stop this thing from making a HUGE mess? Any help would be GREATLY appreciated since I have to take it on a 12 hour drive on Saturday up to Idaho. Thanks a lot!

AATLAS1X · 10-05-06, 11:52 PM

Please see this post.

If the plug launches your motor is toast.

It can be tapped and plugged

http://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/106313-poser-why-plug-my-head.html

ZRotheohv · 10-05-06, 11:54 PM

Whoa thanks! I didn't even know what to search for.

Southbound · 10-05-06, 11:55 PM

Just read that linked thread. Is JBWeld really strong enough to plug something like that?? Need to get some in my emergency kit if so.

AATLAS1X · 10-05-06, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Southbound

Just read that linked thread. Is JBWeld really strong enough to plug something like that?? Need to get some in my emergency kit if so.

I would never use JB on anything, but thats me.

ZRotheohv · 10-05-06, 11:59 PM

Or would it be better to tap and plug it? And how might one pull the current plug out?

AATLAS1X · 10-06-06, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZRotheohv

Or would it be better to tap and plug it? And how might one pull the current plug out?

Local Toyota dealer or a machine shop that does heads can do it.

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 12:04 AM

Or is it possible to press the plug back in?

AATLAS1X · 10-06-06, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZRotheohv

Or is it possible to press the plug back in?

If its leaking, FIX IT..

Please do it the correct way, your 40 will thank you.

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 12:17 AM

Any idea if there's a Toyota part or will any ol' allen plug do?

Mark W · 10-06-06, 03:39 AM

The plug that is there from the factory (as your's looks to be), is a press in plug. No threads, just pushed into place. Poor choice on Toyota's part. That's why your's is leaking and why they are known to fail. As mentioned in the other thread that is linked to above, when they do it is a major problem. There is pressurinzed oil behind the plug. When the plug comes out or simple starts leaking badly enough (and it will eventually) you pump your oil right out the side of the engine. The "cold" side as it happens, so you don't get a lot of smoke and stink like you would if it was hitting the hot exhaust. (Of course you don't get an oil fed fire on the exhaust manifold either, so there is *some* good there...) The first thing most folks know about the failure is when the engine seizes from lack of lubrication.

FIX IT. FIX IT NOW.

IF Toyota sells a replacement press in plug, don't get it.

You can drill out the existing plug, tap the hole and use a threaded plug (there are no existing threads there... )

You can braze the hole up. Awkward to do with the head installed, but very doable if you are good with a torch and brazing rod. You colkd likewise solder it. Still awkward at best with the head mounted.

You can plug the hole with epoxy. You will want it very very clean. I would probably use a putty, thicker than the regular JB weld, so that it doesn't ooze out before curing. Although if you can keep it in place, JG weld works very well.

I have actually fixed this problem in the field by packing a press in zerk full of JB weld, pushing some of the JB in ahead of the zerk and then pressing the zerk into the hole. Drove it away after just a few minutes and it held for at least a year. Probably many years, I've just lost track of what ever happened to that particular head.

Mark...

Cruiserdrew · 10-06-06, 07:54 AM

Is it possible to drill out, tap and fix in place? If so, drill size and tap size?? How do you keep drill shavings out of the engine? Thanks.

tcb · 10-06-06, 08:00 AM

I had no idea about this... I will check mine today.

FJ60Cam · 10-06-06, 08:34 AM

Rent a car or something, but don't take it on a 12 hour drive if it is already leaking. If it blows, it will fawk up a perfectly good engine.

About ten years ago, my dad lent my aunt his (now mine) 60 to haul some crap around. My dad received a call saying that the truck has died and that it ran out of gas. It didn't run out of gas, it ran out of oil !!!

My dad is a woodworker, not a mechanic, so he popped in a wooden plug, added oil, and somehow drove it to the dealer.

The truck probably only had 90,000 miles or less when this happened.

FJ60Cam · 10-06-06, 08:36 AM

It lookes like the dealer JBWelded a bolt in the hole

.

It's still holding strong (the bolt, not the engine!)

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 09:10 AM

But I assume I can't do it myself (the tap and plug) correct? At least with standard Craftsman taps. The head is very hard.

GulfShoresFJ60 · 10-06-06, 10:08 AM

I tapped mine with Craftsman taps. Make sure you drill the hole to the correct tap size. The tap will say what the ideal hole size needed for the tap. The tap might break if you have too small of a hole. You just need to make sure you have someway of getting the metal shavings so they don't go in your engine.

GulfShoresFJ60 · 10-06-06, 10:09 AM

I also used thread lock on my hex bolt when I installed it to make sure it doesn't work itself loose.

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 10:12 AM

What did you do to prevent the shavings from getting in your engine?

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 10:14 AM

And what size tap/hole did you choose?

screwbird · 10-06-06, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZRotheohv

And what size tap/hole did you choose?

I used a M8 x 1.25 and I chose that size because the hole size is nominal for use with that tap, and it's harder to control metal shavings if you have to drill out the hole. As GulfShores and others have mentioned, the hole size is muy important to avoid having a brittle, high carbon steel tap broken off in the hole. You don't have to have expensive gage pins, because you can use some Yankee Ingenuity to find a round object that fits snugly in the hole and then use a micrometer or calipers to measure the OD of the round object. You are lucky to have the actual plug that fits in there to use for reference, but I couldn't find mine when it blew.

For added insurance, buy the best "Made in USA" tap you can find - this is not the time to use a cheap tool that's made in China. Trust me there is a difference in the steel recipe and quality.

To capture the metal shavings, slather the entire tap in moly grease. It's much easier to control metal chips in a slow speed operation like tapping, as opposed to a high speed operation like drilling. Back out the tap often after each half turn or full turn.

I purchased a short hex head cap screw in the plastic specialty harware drawers at Home Depot to plug the hole, with a little loctite of course.

Until this thread appeared, I had totally forgotten about this happening to me. I was lucky in that mine blew as I was backing down my driveway and I saw a long trail of oil in front of the truck. If I had been driving forward, the previous posts are 100 percent correct in saying that you would not notice it until it's too late. I was only unhappy about the mess on my driveway, but very thankful that it happened there rather than out on a trail with minimal tools and means to fix it.

Hope this helps. Cheers.

-Screwbird

Timoss · 10-06-06, 01:21 PM

One other option I have seen used instead of a tap is a "pin" method. With the stock plug (or another plug) in the hole (perhaps JB welded in the hole would be best), drill through the plug from the side with a very small bit. Gently hammer a bicycle spoke or similar pin into the hole to hold the plug in permanently. Anyway, it's an option for someone who doesn't feel comfortable tapping...

Timoss
88 fj62 TLCA

lovetoski · 10-06-06, 02:56 PM

Mark W did a writeup a few years ago about how to fix this. I did the fix on my 60, exactly as he describes and it wasn't hard. It's lasted 3 years, and is still bone dry. Link to the whole article is below, and I've pasted the key paragraph in just to aid future searches.

Besides buying the tap/bit/allen screw, I had to get an angle attachment for my drill...but hey I needed one of those anyway!

Start to finish it took me one hour. I went super slow too, didn't really want to fawk up when drilling/tapping into my head!

http://www.rockcrawler.com/departmen...qna031598a.htm

The best fix (assuming you are at home, and not on the trail when you discover the problem) is to drill and tap the hole for a screw in plug. This can be done with the head on the engine.

First remove the valve cover, and the headbolt that the oil flows around. Insert a cloth, a cotton ball on a string, a soft rifle/shotgun bore swab, or some other material to prevent any metal flakes from falling into the bore. Then use a "F" sized drill bit (.257 of an inch) to drill out the short passageway between the head bolt bore and the exterior of the block. Once it is drilled, tap the hole with a 5/16-18 tap. An allen head screw can then be threaded into the hole until it is flush. Coat the threads with epoxy before installing the screw. Reinstall the head bolt and the valve cover, let the epoxy set up, and you're ready to go.

GulfShoresFJ60 · 10-06-06, 03:23 PM

What lovetoski pasted is basically what I did. I had to drill my plug out, so I left the head bolt in and drilled the plug out. After a little drilling I felt the plug push forwards (here's where leaving the headbolt in helps-keeps the plug from falling into the hole.) I pulled the drill back out and cleaned the hole shavings out by using a magnet. I then removed the headbolt and used a magnet to take the rest of the plug out from the headbolt hole. I then ran the tap into the hole. Using the grease will help keep the loose shaving down to a minimum since they will stick to the grease. You might want to start a pilot hole in the plug first to keep the bit from walking too much. On the plug, I just asked NAPA for a plug and they brought me a selection. I picked the one I wanted - I used a allen head plug. I coated the plug with loctite when I installed it.

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 05:45 PM

Screwbird, did you not have to drill at all using that M8 tap?

ZRotheohv · 10-06-06, 09:18 PM

Well just as an update, I got the original plug out (except I don't think it was the original, didn't match my brother's 60 and was just sorta weird) by drilling a small hole, screwing in a screw half way, and pulling and hitting the screw and plug out. Also, the M6x1.5 tap works PERFECT without any drilling. Plus it's metric, which just makes me happier somehow. Now tomorrow I'll just have to get the allen plug and loctite. Thanks!

GulfShoresFJ60 · 10-06-06, 09:32 PM

No problem, glad you got it out and it worked well for you.

Mark W · 10-06-06, 09:39 PM

Yep, I've fixed a couple with an M6 tap. The hole is actually a tiny bit large for this tap, but it is not as if there will ever be great strain on these threads, so it is okay.

Mark...

AATLAS1X · 10-06-06, 11:40 PM

Use a shop vac to clean the hole out and not air.

PS Good fawking job!!!!!!!!

screwbird · 10-07-06, 12:00 PM

ZRotheohv,

To answer your question, no I did not have to drill out the hole to use the M8 tap. It has been several years since I did mine, so I don't remember what the ID of my hole measured, but I do remember it was right in the nominal range for the M8 tap.

I guess I was really scared about drilling and all those metal bits. After reading some of the other threads, it occurs to me that I could have gone the extra mile and removed the valve cover, etc. I see that you and others have used the M6 for the repair, and as long as that worked, that's all that matters.

Anyway, it's great that you were observant enough to see the leak and fix it before it became catastrophic. Congratulations to you on getting her fixed.

-Screwbird