man-a-fre auxillary tank question? - Page 2

Vortec_Cruiser · 03-20-06, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4Poet

IMO, the bolt thru the bed tanks aren't worth restoring...

Why do you say that? I have seen dozens of these that have been installed for 10-20 years, and not one has failed.

wantatlc · 03-20-06, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4Poet

IMO, the bolt thru the bed tanks aren't worth restoring unless fabbed to be frame mounted.

hmmmm..... at $600-800 for just a new aux tank.... I have no problem restoring it. it is not a vital piece (just a bonus piece) so does not warrant me spending that kind of money to just toss it and buy a new one.

greenfox · 03-20-06, 11:15 PM

Oh yeah the venting part, this what I did. i went to the junk yard and picked up a 83 chev pickup filler neck with the screw on cap. Than a 1980 toyota pickup filler hose went down to a utility bed shop and bught the recessed filler neck assembly.

4x4Poet · 03-20-06, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vortec_Cruiser

... The best switching valve is the Pollak fuel tank selector valve # ZX812705U – J.C. Whitney @ $80. It switches from tank-to-tank, and at the same time switches to the correct tank sender. It also has a fuel return line, which sends fuel back to the correct tank.

That's the one I have. I have a spare buried somewhere with my spare parts. I couldn't remember the mfr name.

Although I don't think the Pollak valve is fuel injection pressure capable (60psi) like one of the MAF valves is. I know mine isn't, anyway.

4x4Poet · 03-20-06, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vortec_Cruiser

Why do you say that? I have seen dozens of these that have been installed for 10-20 years, and not one has failed.

Mounting through the body and not the frame concerns me in case of an accident. Where is that tank going to go if rear-ended with only sheetmetal holding it to the FJ40?

4x4Poet · 03-20-06, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wantatlc

hmmmm..... at $600-800 for just a new aux tank.... I have no problem restoring it. it is not a vital piece (just a bonus piece) so does not warrant me spending that kind of money to just toss it and buy a new one.

I agree as long as you also weld on some frame mounts once you have the tank acid cleaned. Like pictured in a previous post by a wise man, IMO.

It wouldn't add much to the restoration cost even if the welding was done professionally. Finding, cutting, and drilling angle iron and then drilling the frame is even easier.

wantatlc · 03-20-06, 11:39 PM

here is a photo montage:

switch handle in cab - tubing/switching device up to switch handle under floor board under cabin - electrical pump mount on frame rail and the fuel shut off valve (see those here) coming off aux tank.

did not include one of the power pump toggle on the dash (which can be seen here) or the modified neck and vent setup which can be seen here in depth

Vortec_Cruiser · 03-20-06, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4Poet

Mounting through the body and not the frame concerns me in case of an accident. Where is that tank going to go if rear-ended with only sheetmetal holding it to the FJ40?

It's still between the frame rails, but that could be a consideration. Though, I don't think it would be like a Pinto.

4x4Poet · 03-20-06, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenfox

Oh yeah the venting part, this what I did. i went to the junk yard and picked up a 83 chev pickup filler neck with the screw on cap. Than a 1980 toyota pick filler hose went down to a utility bed shop and bught the recessed filler neck assembly.

That's a great idea and some resourceful scrounging.

I still have my filler neck custom mounted inside the wheelwell and want to eventually move it to through the sheetmetal. I was going to mount the original chrome Con-Fer fill neck & bracket combo through the passenger side sheet metal like the instructions always recommend, but I'm considering upsizing to 37s and moving the rear axle back 1" by relocating the center pins which would necessitate cutting the rear fender opening more towards the rear. That might interfere with the aux tank filler. I never thought of going through the rear corner using a 90º or bendable hose like you did. I still have to work out axle-to-aux tank clearance, so I have more thinking to do.

Thanks for the pic and parts sourcing info. Thread subscribed.

Vortec_Cruiser · 03-20-06, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4Poet

Although I don't think the Pollak valve is fuel injection pressure capable (60psi) like one of the MAF valves is. I know mine isn't, anyway.

Good to 65 PSI.

Yours may be an older model.

4x4Poet · 03-20-06, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vortec_Cruiser

Good to 65 PSI.

Yours may be an older model.

Excellent! Good to know for when I TBI my 2F.

greenfox · 03-21-06, 12:00 AM

When I get my tig I am cutting out the tank so I can use 55 springs with yj flares. I put the filler out the back because every time I was leaning to the passenger side I would spill gas. And thre screw cap filler neck has anti flow back flap and is way easy to put gas in from a j##p can.

ducktapeguy · 03-21-06, 12:26 AM

Nice pics and a lot of good information.

wantatlc,

what size tires are you running? and do the tires come close to rubbing the fuel filler hose if that side was compressed? Also, is the in-line electric pump absolutely necessary or is it more for help? Would the stock fuel pump be strong enough to suck the fuel up from that distance?

greenfox,

does the spare tire carrier interfere when filling up? I really like that filler assembly, gonna have to pick on up. Thanks for posting pics.

On the subject of senders, if the stock sender unit is half the resistance of the aftermarket ones, I wonder how hard it would be to hook up a simple circuit inline to "fool" the gauge into reading correctly. I'm gonna have to talk to a friend who's a lot better at this stuff than I.

greenfox · 03-21-06, 12:40 AM

No problem with it yet the best mod I have so far. The spare tire carrier is my costum built bumper I will post pics when it is finished because this thing is awsome.

wantatlc · 03-21-06, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ducktapeguy

Nice pics and a lot of good information.

wantatlc,

what size tires are you running? and do the tires come close to rubbing the fuel filler hose if that side was compressed? Also, is the in-line electric pump absolutely necessary or is it more for help? Would the stock fuel pump be strong enough to suck the fuel up from that distance?

I run 33x12.5 (and as big as I plan to go). I cannot see any rub marks in the filler neck (and it happen to be rubber so it would flex I suppose), but I have not had an issue. it is set back far enough the the travel does not come in contact with the neck.

as for the pump. I think the pump is a must. a few times I have forgotten to flip the electrical pump on and started to bog down, flipped that on and fuel was good to go. Also, this could be further exacerbated if on a steep uphill climb? pump seems reasonable and necessary IMHO.

Vortec_Cruiser · 03-21-06, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4x4Poet

Excellent! Good to know for when I TBI my 2F.

This would only be a concern if you have an in-tank pump. Otherwise, the tank switching valve is installed between the tanks & the electric fuel pump, where there is no pressure.

Vortec_Cruiser · 03-21-06, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lingo's Mom

No, you won't.

Mom has spoken!

wantatlc · 03-25-06, 09:09 AM

so, I got to thinking and wonder if this will work?

if you ran both leads from the sending units on 2 different tanks (your main and the auxillary) to a 2 position turn knob and then from said turn knob on to the post on the after market gas gauge on my dash that is currently setup to read just the main tank, could you not then turn the knob and switch between readings from 2 tanks? NOTE: both tanks would use the same brand/style sending unit made to work with the same style/brand gague on my dash so perfect compatability.

BTW, I know there are cool systems mentioned that with the flip of 1 switch can change tanks and use 1 gas gauge.. but you can see I already have a menchanical handle in place for selecting bewteen my 2 tanks and this setup I purpose, if possible, would only require a $4.00 turn knob.

can anyone with better wiring knowledge confirm if it is infact as simple as adding a turn knob between the gauge and both sending units to make it possible to flip flop between 2 tanks on 1 gauge?

if it is possible.. what type of turn knob configuration do you need? (i.e., SPDT - single pull double throw)

4x4Poet · 03-25-06, 10:28 PM

Aw shucks. Must not have really been Lingo's mom. What a shame...

wantatlc · 03-26-06, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve-O

wantatlc: It actually depends how long you have had the tank. The newer tanks we get out of Australia do come with a sending unit. If you do have the older Con-Ferr unit, I'm not sure if it will have one or not. Companies like autometer make universal ones you can add, but you have to know what your doing when modifying tanks.

Steve-O.. I'd say I have confirmed my tank has NO hole for a sending unit (I was able to get in a very awkward postion under my rig with a flashlight and saw over a frame rail). so, I was curious, if I install my own.. are there baffels in place in these old tanks that would determine where you can cut a hole? I have seen pictures of the newer tanks with the sending unit off to the far right (drivers side)... but wonder on these old ones with no hole if I can place it similarly or will you end up right on top of a baffel and screw yourself? or, are the old ones like this baffel free so I can place the hole about anywhere with no issues?

wantatlc · 03-26-06, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhaha

Yes I took the aux tank, used a hole saw to cut a hole just big enough to fit the float and rod in, figured how the rod needed to be bent, drilled holes for the cap, cleaned the tank about a million times, RTV around the holes and screwed the cap down. Doesn't leak and works well.

how did you avoid the baffels? did you just get lucky or did you locate them somehow before making the hole? please advise if you can.

ducktapeguy · 03-26-06, 11:06 PM

Are you able to look through the filler hole? If it's like mine, I can see the inside of the tank through the hole and see the other end, so I know mine doesn't have any baffles.

wantatlc · 03-27-06, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ducktapeguy

Are you able to look through the filler hole? If it's like mine, I can see the inside of the tank through the hole and see the other end, so I know mine doesn't have any baffles.

I cant see through yet as I have not pulled it down as I am using the gas up in it.(I was trying to plan ahead to order the sending unit)... BUT, it seems the baffels would hang from top down, so if they stop a few inches from the bottom of tank to allow fuel to get to gather and get to the fuel line out... are you sure you would even see them?

ducktapeguy · 03-27-06, 10:26 AM

If there were baffles, I assumed they would probably go from top to bottom, to give the tank some structural rigidity as well, but have holes or slots to allow gas to pass through without sloshing back and forth. But I could be wrong, since mine doesn't have any.

Mine tank looks almost identical to yours from what I can see, with the fuel filler tube coming out near the top of the passenger side of the tank. Meaning even if the baffles were attached from the top, they should large enough that you'd still be able to see them. The filler tube is pretty wide, I'm able to look inside and see a good portion of the opposite side of the tank. If you had a little mirror, you could probably look at the entire inside if you wanted to.

Steve-O · 03-27-06, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wantatlc

Steve-O.. I'd say I have confirmed my tank has NO hole for a sending unit (I was able to get in a very awkward postion under my rig with a flashlight and saw over a frame rail). so, I was curious, if I install my own.. are there baffels in place in these old tanks that would determine where you can cut a hole? I have seen pictures of the newer tanks with the sending unit off to the far right (drivers side)... but wonder on these old ones with no hole if I can place it similarly or will you end up right on top of a baffel and screw yourself? or, are the old ones like this baffel free so I can place the hole about anywhere with no issues?

Sorry but we havent carried these for a few years, and I never really opened one up to check. I looked around for any sort of info on it but came up empty handed. Your best bet is probably do what ducktapeguy did, drop the tank and look in any filler holes with a flashlight to see what you can find.

wantatlc · 03-27-06, 01:31 PM

thanks guys with what I have here, I think the only way is to finish using up the fuel and drop the tank. as soon as I empty the fuel I will be dropping the tank (likely this coming weekend as I burn fuel quick with that Chevy).

so, stay tuned as I will report bakc what I find out about my tank specifically AND I will report the process I use on this project to drop, drill, clean & line, install sending unit and toggle for 2 tanks on 1 gauge all when I am done.

03-20-06, 11:15 PM	#33
greenfox IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 13526 Posts: 659	Oh yeah the venting part, this what I did. i went to the junk yard and picked up a 83 chev pickup filler neck with the screw on cap. Than a 1980 toyota pickup filler hose went down to a utility bed shop and bught the recessed filler neck assembly. __________________ 73 FJ40 Green - Original 74 FJ40 Red - (BMFCAGE) SOA 36X17IROKS weldedrear ARBfront and what ever els you can think of 97 FZJ80 Green (the wife's) - locked 67 fj45lwb in the works Last edited by greenfox; 06-30-06 at 09:04 PM.

03-20-06, 11:39 PM	#37
wantatlc IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: SoCal - westsiiiide Posts: 1,441	here is a photo montage: switch handle in cab - tubing/switching device up to switch handle under floor board under cabin - electrical pump mount on frame rail and the fuel shut off valve (see those here) coming off aux tank. did not include one of the power pump toggle on the dash (which can be seen here) or the modified neck and vent setup which can be seen here in depth __________________ SoCal FJ - 1974 FJ40 \| Trail Photos \| Parts Wanted & 4Sale My FJ is better than your honor student SPECS: SBC 350 \| 4spd \| Front discs \| Saginaw \| 33's \| 3" lift SUA \| Rancho 9000's \| Detroit rear \| Dual gas tanks \| BeCool aux fan \| Sliders \| Onboard air \| Stamped Bezel Last edited by wantatlc; 06-01-07 at 01:03 PM.

03-21-06, 12:00 AM	#42
greenfox IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 13526 Posts: 659	When I get my tig I am cutting out the tank so I can use 55 springs with yj flares. I put the filler out the back because every time I was leaning to the passenger side I would spill gas. And thre screw cap filler neck has anti flow back flap and is way easy to put gas in from a j##p can. __________________ 73 FJ40 Green - Original 74 FJ40 Red - (BMFCAGE) SOA 36X17IROKS weldedrear ARBfront and what ever els you can think of 97 FZJ80 Green (the wife's) - locked 67 fj45lwb in the works

03-21-06, 12:26 AM	#43
ducktapeguy IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Jan 2003 TLCA# 16795 Posts: 370	Nice pics and a lot of good information. wantatlc, what size tires are you running? and do the tires come close to rubbing the fuel filler hose if that side was compressed? Also, is the in-line electric pump absolutely necessary or is it more for help? Would the stock fuel pump be strong enough to suck the fuel up from that distance? greenfox, does the spare tire carrier interfere when filling up? I really like that filler assembly, gonna have to pick on up. Thanks for posting pics. On the subject of senders, if the stock sender unit is half the resistance of the aftermarket ones, I wonder how hard it would be to hook up a simple circuit inline to "fool" the gauge into reading correctly. I'm gonna have to talk to a friend who's a lot better at this stuff than I. Last edited by ducktapeguy; 03-21-06 at 12:31 AM.

03-21-06, 12:40 AM	#44
greenfox IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Stockton, CA TLCA# 13526 Posts: 659	No problem with it yet the best mod I have so far. The spare tire carrier is my costum built bumper I will post pics when it is finished because this thing is awsome. __________________ 73 FJ40 Green - Original 74 FJ40 Red - (BMFCAGE) SOA 36X17IROKS weldedrear ARBfront and what ever els you can think of 97 FZJ80 Green (the wife's) - locked 67 fj45lwb in the works

03-25-06, 09:09 AM	#48
wantatlc IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: SoCal - westsiiiide Posts: 1,441	wiring 2 tanks to 1 gague? so, I got to thinking and wonder if this will work? if you ran both leads from the sending units on 2 different tanks (your main and the auxillary) to a 2 position turn knob and then from said turn knob on to the post on the after market gas gauge on my dash that is currently setup to read just the main tank, could you not then turn the knob and switch between readings from 2 tanks? NOTE: both tanks would use the same brand/style sending unit made to work with the same style/brand gague on my dash so perfect compatability. BTW, I know there are cool systems mentioned that with the flip of 1 switch can change tanks and use 1 gas gauge.. but you can see I already have a menchanical handle in place for selecting bewteen my 2 tanks and this setup I purpose, if possible, would only require a $4.00 turn knob. can anyone with better wiring knowledge confirm if it is infact as simple as adding a turn knob between the gauge and both sending units to make it possible to flip flop between 2 tanks on 1 gauge? if it is possible.. what type of turn knob configuration do you need? (i.e., SPDT - single pull double throw) __________________ SoCal FJ - 1974 FJ40 \| Trail Photos \| Parts Wanted & 4Sale My FJ is better than your honor student SPECS: SBC 350 \| 4spd \| Front discs \| Saginaw \| 33's \| 3" lift SUA \| Rancho 9000's \| Detroit rear \| Dual gas tanks \| BeCool aux fan \| Sliders \| Onboard air \| Stamped Bezel Last edited by wantatlc; 03-25-06 at 05:11 PM.

03-25-06, 10:28 PM	#49
4x4Poet IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: MT Posts: 259	Aw shucks. Must not have really been Lingo's mom. What a shame...

03-26-06, 11:06 PM	#52
ducktapeguy IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Jan 2003 TLCA# 16795 Posts: 370	Are you able to look through the filler hole? If it's like mine, I can see the inside of the tank through the hole and see the other end, so I know mine doesn't have any baffles.

03-27-06, 10:26 AM	#54
ducktapeguy IH8MUD Regular Join Date: Jan 2003 TLCA# 16795 Posts: 370	If there were baffles, I assumed they would probably go from top to bottom, to give the tank some structural rigidity as well, but have holes or slots to allow gas to pass through without sloshing back and forth. But I could be wrong, since mine doesn't have any. Mine tank looks almost identical to yours from what I can see, with the fuel filler tube coming out near the top of the passenger side of the tank. Meaning even if the baffles were attached from the top, they should large enough that you'd still be able to see them. The filler tube is pretty wide, I'm able to look inside and see a good portion of the opposite side of the tank. If you had a little mirror, you could probably look at the entire inside if you wanted to.