Engine Rebuild Warranty on my 2F

dx379 · 10-02-09, 08:22 AM

Guys,

I had my 2F rebuilt about 6 months ago, and ever since I got it back it was making a knocking noise. I brought it back to the rebuilder under warranty. Turns out, as I expected, to be a loose wrist pin.

3 months later and endless calls, I have still not gotten it back. Turns out they are always waiting for "parts"...

So now the summer is over and it is getting cold I am sure I will get it back soon

So how long is too long to wait? I feel 3 months is ample time to fix their mistake. But then again, I have no other options. They have it pulled apart, they aren't making any money from me, so why rush to get me my car back?

Thoughts?
Jonny

eventhough · 10-02-09, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

Guys,

I had my 2F rebuilt about 6 months ago, and ever since I got it back it was making a knocking noise. I brought it back to the rebuilder under warranty. Turns out, as I expected, to be a loose wrist pin.

3 months later and endless calls, I have still not gotten it back. Turns out they are always waiting for "parts"...

So now the summer is over and it is getting cold I am sure I will get it back soon

So how long is too long to wait? I feel 3 months is ample time to fix their mistake. But then again, I have no other options. They have it pulled apart, they aren't making any money from me, so why rush to get me my car back?

Thoughts?
Jonny

3 months is plenty of time... my rebuilder sourced parts and had them installed in what seemed like days.

Trollhole · 10-02-09, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

Guys,

I had my 2F rebuilt about 6 months ago, and ever since I got it back it was making a knocking noise. I brought it back to the rebuilder under warranty. Turns out, as I expected, to be a loose wrist pin.

3 months later and endless calls, I have still not gotten it back. Turns out they are always waiting for "parts"...

So now the summer is over and it is getting cold I am sure I will get it back soon

So how long is too long to wait? I feel 3 months is ample time to fix their mistake. But then again, I have no other options. They have it pulled apart, they aren't making any money from me, so why rush to get me my car back?

Thoughts?
Jonny

3 months on something that they screwed up is way to long. Go for a visit. Have them show you what is wrong and why it is taking so long. Then have them put it in writing. Tell them they have by next week to get it fixed or you will have no choice than to pursue other options.

That should wake them up.

dx379 · 10-02-09, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollhole

3 months on something that they screwed up is way to long. Go for a visit. Have them show you what is wrong and why it is taking so long. Then have them put it in writing. Tell them they have by next week to get it fixed or you will have no choice than to pursue other options.

That should wake them up.

That's exactly my concern... what other options do I have? They already have my money from the initial build, they have my motor torn apart... Unfortunately I am at their mercy and they are really taking advantage of that...

Jonny

Michael Hanson · 10-02-09, 08:46 AM

Post their name here on Mud,get their e-mail for us. In this day of computers and internet,they need to be careful about bad p.r. and losing business. Mike

eventhough · 10-02-09, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

That's exactly my concern... what other options do I have? They already have my money from the initial build, they have my motor torn apart... Unfortunately I am at their mercy and they are really taking advantage of that...

Jonny

Do you have a warranty in writing? If you do you have more channels of recourse - like a suit.

The first place I took my disassembled motor to to get some machine work done (when I was going to do the rebuild and before I decided to let ACC finish it) had my block, head, flywheel, crank, and a few other things for about 2 months. I was told it would take a few weeks to do the work. I called every week after a few weeks to get updated and they were supposedly making 'steady progress' but were 'slammed with work.'

At month two I called and said "I'm 30 minutes out and am picking up whatever you have done when I get there." When I showed up they were frantically rushing to get the work done they said they already had done.

All that to say - might be worth showing up and finding out what is up. It shouldn't take forever and a day to get bearings.

Even if you don't have a warranty in writing you have options.

Trollhole · 10-02-09, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

That's exactly my concern... what other options do I have? They already have my money from the initial build, they have my motor torn apart... Unfortunately I am at their mercy and they are really taking advantage of that...

Jonny

Small calim court. Honestly I'd just tell them you want your motor back and a full refund if you cannot work anything out. Sitting down with the owner and talking things out professionally is the best option. Give them a deadline. Take charge of the situation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Hanson

Post their name here on Mud,get their e-mail for us. In this day of computers and internet,they need to be careful about bad p.r. and losing business. Mike

Jesus. Threats usually never come out well.

dx379 · 10-02-09, 08:51 AM

Well, I just got off the phone with them. Apparently it is all put back together.....

WAIT FOR IT...

There is now a weird noise that they can't work out. Apparently having a Toyota mechanic come look at it to diagnose the problem... Guaranteed I would have it on Monday... Which is interesting as today is Friday, they are not open weekends, but they plan on diagnosing a problem, fixing it, and putting it back together in the better part of one working day. Yet it takes 3 months to replace a loose wrist pin

Anyone sense my hesitancy

Jonny

Trollhole · 10-02-09, 08:54 AM

Go see them.

Michael Hanson · 10-02-09, 09:01 AM

Who are they? Mike

eventhough · 10-02-09, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollhole

Go see them.

Today - have them show you what they have fixed, old parts, show you the new problem, etc. Don't take their word for squat.

dx379 · 10-02-09, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Hanson

Who are they? Mike

Michael,

At this point I would prefer not to say until I get my 40 back

Jonny

Morse_FJ40 · 10-02-09, 10:05 AM

Better Business Bureau!!!!!

numby · 10-02-09, 01:16 PM

Don't threaten anything. Try to get them to agree to a reasonable completion time. Try (politely) to suggest that you'd feel better if they would put something in writing. If, and when, they miss the deadline serve them a subpoena for small claims court. You'll get both your money and your Cruiser back.

Small towns with limited rebuilding services are the worst in my experience. While they don't want a bad reputation they also know that they've got everyone over a barrel. Big cities aren't much better because they think there's another sucker waiting around the corner.

I still had a slight knock in mine when it came back from the local shop for the second time. I even had a famous California LC guru try and diagnose it. He wasn't certain what it was but at least he helped eliminate certain things. From this point I was able to solve the issue with minimal effort and $20.00 at the only other machine shop in town. I'm still in good with the shop that did the work the first time.

Point is... be there when the expert shows, be willing to laugh at the diagnosis (d'oh!), and help the rebuilder decide a course of action. You get your truck back and everyone saves face and goes away happy.

p.s. - Should've sent my block to Jim C"/

dx379 · 10-05-09, 02:01 PM

Latest**

Well, I called the rebuilder today. Apparently there is ZERO oil pressure in the motor... I'm not very familiar with motors so could someone help me understand this? I drove the 40 for a couple hundred miles with no problems aside from the knocking sound which turned out to be a loose wrist pin. If I had ZERO oil pressure, surely the motor would have seized when I had it?

I drove it to them when I dropped it off over 3 months ago. Should this be covered under warranty? The way they were talking it didn't sound like they were taking responsibility...

Jonny

destin · 10-05-09, 02:07 PM

whoa

It should be covered under warrantee!
They rebuilt it, and if it has no oil pressure, well they messed something up!

Have em fix it.
Or call a lawyer.

eventhough · 10-05-09, 02:12 PM

2Fs are tough motors - but a couple hundred miles without oil pressure and that baby should have locked down tight.

Why isn't there oil pressure? Is the oil pump not working? Is the dizzy not seated fully? Is there oil pressure on the lower end, the head, neither? What type of oil pressure gauge are you using - stock oil sending unit or mechanical gauge? Is this what they are using to read oil pressure? The stock oil sending unit can have its wire bumped off which will then cause your rig to not register any oil pressure. That happened to me on a drive. I cut the motor off cruising down a hwy but luckily the fix was just a loose wire that I knocked off earlier in the day.

A head gasket could be installed wrong keeping oil from getting to the head but that probably isn't the case...

Do you have your warranty in writing? These guys are sounding more and more like clowns every day...

What work have they done to the motor since you took it in?

lostmarbles · 10-05-09, 02:14 PM

Zero oil pressure?

They probably had the dizzy out and haven't pushed it down far enough to engage in the oil pump!

(And if so - This says alot about their lack-of-knowledge relating to your motor.)

apeterson · 10-05-09, 02:25 PM

good luck on getting them to do anything about it.... my new engine blew up in 112 miles and they dicked me around and ended up not doing much about it....

I hope you have better luck than me

dx379 · 10-05-09, 02:45 PM

Thank you guys for your responses/support. I was kind of in shock when they told me so I didn't bother asking any questions. Apparently they went ahead and pulled the motor, but I am not sure if they checked the pump or dizzy prior to that or not. I can only hope they would be smart enough not to do brain surgery without at least looking at potential causes that mightn't be as severe.

So I guess I am back to waiting on them. I can tell they are pretty upset with the amount of time they have spent on this thing, so I will give them a while to cool down before I call them again... I just hope they don't stall until my warranty runs out and then tell me I am SOL.

Jonny

John Smith · 10-05-09, 02:48 PM

A now defunct LC shop failed to seat the dizzy on my friend's 40 and his engine seized within 5 miles of the shop. Sounds like this shop is unfamiliar with F series engines and they did not seat the distributor is my guess.

dx379 · 10-05-09, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Smith

A now defunct LC shop failed to seat the dizzy on my friend's 40 and his engine seized within 5 miles of the shop. Sounds like this shop is unfamiliar with F series engines and they did not seat the distributor is my guess.

I'm pretty sure they know nothing about them.

Another thing that is kind of irritating, but mute at this point, is that I bought a full OEM gasket kit from Toyota for the rebuild, and I can guarantee you every time they put this thing back together they use cheaper and cheaper gaskets

Jonny

Michael Hanson · 10-05-09, 03:53 PM

Post their name,there is strength in numbers.No one goes to battle alone .except for suicide missions. Mike

lostmarbles · 10-05-09, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

Michael,

At this point I would prefer not to say until I get my 40 back

Jonny

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Hanson

Post their name,there is strength in numbers.No one goes to battle alone .except for suicide missions. Mike

Mike - I think Johnny's right in saying that they've got hold of his goolies at the moment.

It's a nasty situation and I'm sure we all hope it ends well.

PS. - I'm sure he'd be happy to respond to any PM from a local cruiserhead who about to get a rebuild done and wants to know which shop to avoid doing business with!

65swb45 · 10-05-09, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

Thank you guys for your responses/support. I was kind of in shock when they told me so I didn't bother asking any questions. Apparently they went ahead and pulled the motor, but I am not sure if they checked the pump or dizzy prior to that or not. I can only hope they would be smart enough not to do brain surgery without at least looking at potential causes that mightn't be as severe.

So I guess I am back to waiting on them. I can tell they are pretty upset with the amount of time they have spent on this thing, so I will give them a while to cool down before I call them again... I just hope they don't stall until my warranty runs out and then tell me I am SOL.

Jonny

Why not offer them the option of NOT pulling the engine? All they really need to do is double check the dizzy fitment, drop the pan and double check the crank bearings for damage [they're the ones that go first]. If the bearings look ok and the dizzy is seated, it's time to move on.

Have them put a stethescope up to the timing cover. Sometimes a cam gear can make a knock that sounds a lot like a loose rod.

Best

Mark A.

dx379 · 10-07-09, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lostmarbles

PS. - I'm sure he'd be happy to respond to any PM from a local cruiserhead who about to get a rebuild done and wants to know which shop to avoid doing business with!

YES I would

Quote:

Originally Posted by 65swb45

Why not offer them the option of NOT pulling the engine? All they really need to do is double check the dizzy fitment, drop the pan and double check the crank bearings for damage [they're the ones that go first]. If the bearings look ok and the dizzy is seated, it's time to move on.

Have them put a stethescope up to the timing cover. Sometimes a cam gear can make a knock that sounds a lot like a loose rod.

Best

Mark A.

Mark - they had pulled the motor before I even talked to them...

The worst part, in 3 months they have never called me. I have to call them for status reports, which I am sure will continue in light of the current problem.

Jonny

eventhough · 10-07-09, 07:40 AM

It might not be now but there does come a time when you lose faith in a mechanic to fix something correctly. When that time comes you have to figure out how to leave whole - that being with your engine and $.

Your mechanic might be trying to do right by bringing in a 'specialist' but they are SLLLOOOWWW.

dx379 · 10-07-09, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eventhough

It might not be now but there does come a time when you lose faith in a mechanic to fix something correctly. When that time comes you have to figure out how to leave whole - that being with your engine and $.

Your mechanic might be trying to do right by bringing in a 'specialist' but they are SLLLOOOWWW.

That time came about 5.5 months ago when I got my motor back the first time with a knock

I am trying to be patient, but getting out of here whole at this point seems a little optimistic. I will hold tight and see how they handle the situation. Possibly them calling me for once would certainly be favorable...

Regards,
Jonny

apeterson · 10-07-09, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dx379

That time came about 5.5 months ago when I got my motor back the first time with a knock

I am trying to be patient, but getting out of here whole at this point seems a little optimistic. I will hold tight and see how they handle the situation. Possibly them calling me for once would certainly be favorable...

Regards,
Jonny

at this point you need to do what I did... ask for "part" of your money back or all of it and take it as college credits and go get your truck, bring it to someone else and move on with your life... I would still be fighting the bastards I was dealing with... I ended up getting $1000 of my $1800 back and took it to another builder and spend another $1000 plus my thousand to get it right... so I figure I learned a lesson about doing my homework and it cost me $1000 bucks... sucks that people are that way, because I am not, but guess you can stress your life away or move on and leave people like that in your past..

dx379 · 10-21-09, 07:47 PM

For those of you that are interested, wanted to update you with my wonderful "rebuild" fiasco that I have been dealing with.

I had my girlfriend go by there and find out what was going on. Unlike most women, she knows more about cars than most of my make friends, so when she offered to stop by there as she was in the neighborhood I told her to go ahead.

They told her that they are in the process of replacing all of the pistons, and that I would have it back this Friday (10/23). Apparently they are still putting paid work before mine

I am not sure what they did to the motor, but having to replace all the pistons mean that whatever they did wasn't good

The plus side is that they have replaced the better part of the motor which is always a bonus.

My girlfriend told me the disturbing news that while she was there, she saw another FJ40 sitting in the shop. Apparently the owner didn't read this thread...

Anyway, still not sure what to do from here. Kinda stuck between a rock and a hard place. Pi$$ them off and I may never get it back, say nothing and keep dealing with this crap