O R I O N - Page 3

rusty_tlc · 08-08-07, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hatfieldcb

What are you guys using for a cross member? Or are you using a cross member at all? I've got the AA propeller style but not the mounting hardware. I might ask treeroot to make me one like his. Not sure. What's everyone think?

I have the AA x-member, I don't know if it's me or the way it's designed but I can't seem to get it to seal right. And the way it mounts on the PS under the seat tank is a bitch. Other than that is seems solid.

Dedtruk · 08-10-07, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GaryinNE

Great combo with a 2F. The H41 shifts easily w/ good spacing and at 80:1 usually the tires will slip before the engine drops to far below idle. I would do it again.

HTH,

Gary

Thanks Gary. I think it's the combo I"m going to use even though it's $$$!

Aaron

peesalot · 08-12-07, 11:53 AM

Rusty, on the AA crossmember if you have the one with a welded in cone it will leak.
If you have one that uses the original cone cover on top of the crossmember you can drill a hole to let the oil drain back into t-case. Check out the stock cone and you will see the little return channel and if you look at t-case you will see the return hole. Use the cone as template to locate hole on AA crossmember and drill a 3/16 hole. Stopped all leaks from the cone on numerous rigs where we found the hole was neglected on original install.

Poser · 08-12-07, 05:06 PM

AA crossmember....

If you use studs instead of bolts it will seal and not leak...new or old style, does not matter.

rusty_tlc · 08-12-07, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peesalot

Rusty, on the AA crossmember if you have the one with a welded in cone it will leak.
If you have one that uses the original cone cover on top of the crossmember you can drill a hole to let the oil drain back into t-case. Check out the stock cone and you will see the little return channel and if you look at t-case you will see the return hole. Use the cone as template to locate hole on AA crossmember and drill a 3/16 hole. Stopped all leaks from the cone on numerous rigs where we found the hole was neglected on original install.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poser

AA crossmember....

If you use studs instead of bolts it will seal and not leak...new or old style, does not matter.

I didn'tt have room to use the studs without a lot of cutting on the floor pan.

Why would that make a diffference??

Poser · 08-13-07, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rusty_tlc

Why would that make a diffference??

The stud and nut fastener stays secure....the bolts work loose.

I have replaced bolts that were used with this style adapter, that were leaking, with studs and the adapter stays secure to the rear of the case and does not leak.

Red locktite is your friend.

rusty_tlc · 08-13-07, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poser

The stud and nut fastener stays secure....the bolts work loose.

I have replaced bolts that were used with this style adapter, that were leaking, with studs and the adapter stays secure to the rear of the case and does not leak.

Red locktite is your friend.

Looks like I will need to pull the tranny tunnel and crossmember, again

peesalot · 08-13-07, 02:22 PM

If the return hole is not there it will fill cone with oil and leak. If hole is there it does not keep the cone full.

I agree that with the studs it is a little bit of a dance to get the cross member in.

spotcruiser · 08-25-07, 11:10 AM

Case #31
4:1 ratio
Has the retrofit parts (undercut hs gear, shift rail, shoulder washers). I held off building it until AA came up with a solution.
No problems so far.

mustardfj40 · 11-09-07, 05:16 PM

The number is a bit hard to read since the 3rd digit is double stamped on each other. So I beleive my case number is 028, pre-ordered from AA by Mudrak very early on. It sat around in the garage unassembled for a very long time. I followed Poser's threads on the Orion very closely and finally built it up with all the latest upgrades from AA which included: the back-cut gear, stepped thrust washers, I also used brand new Toyota shifting colar...

The only problem I had was shifting difficulties with the AA supplied brass nut and spring. It was impossible to shift, I tried different washers and did not help much. So I went back to the Toyota spring which I bought brand new from Toyota and the orginal headless screw so I can adjust the tension on the spring.

The Orion/H41 combo gives me about 80:1...Very sweet

and looks just like stock

And I would to thank Poser for all his efforts

and Mudrak for the case.

Edit: Add a pic:

UPDATE: Took the truck with H41/Orion combo through the 2008 Rubithon, the low gear combination is awesome!!! Many times, I was in 2nd gear, the 1st is great for tricky situation. We also spend 10 hours driving toward and and back from trail heads. So far no popping out of either high or low. In an earlier Rubithon my spotter told me to show down when I was idling (with the H41/3spd transfercase), this time Mudrak as a spotter told me to hurry up going up a major obstacle on Cadilac Hill

Cruiser Cruisin · 12-18-07, 10:04 PM

Just got the case put in. It is number 398, 4:1, and it has the thrust washers. I had the case built my my local shop, "Olympic Offroad." I also just put in a non us, stock trans with the compound low (4.95, what kind of ratio does this mean i have?). At first it had very hard shifting from low to high however it is getting much better. No problams yet, works well.

robj · 12-21-07, 01:26 PM

Case # 327
4:1 No problems w/ the orion at all. However I did snap the spud shaft like a pretzel. Its the AA adapter shaft for 16 spline to NV4500 trans. AA warrantied it and gave me the 10 spline shaft and gear,bearing etc. to convert to 10 sline . they said it was stronger?
Originally installed Jan. 07

Sputnik40 · 12-21-07, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robj

Case # 327
4:1 No problems w/ the orion at all. However I did snap the spud shaft like a pretzel. Its the AA adapter shaft for 16 spline to NV4500 trans. AA warrantied it and gave me the 10 spline shaft and gear,bearing etc. to convert to 10 sline . they said it was stronger?
Originally installed Jan. 07

Interesting! I'm running an SM420 with the AA ten spline spud to a 2.31 geared 4-speed case - have been wondering how strong that link was - but I was thinking more about the adapter, not the spud shaft. Good to see the adapter can take a beating

.

robj · 12-21-07, 06:55 PM

Hopefully the 10 spline is stronger, the 16 spline spud shaft snapped easy - way too easy I'll attach photo (maybe first time)
I have 37s but still running stock front axle shafts, they should have broke first IMO

Cruiser Cruisin · 12-21-07, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robj

Hopefully the 10 spline is stronger, the 16 spline spud shaft snapped easy - way too easy I'll attach photo (maybe first time)
I have 37s but still running stock front axle shafts, they should have broke first IMO

Bobby long makes a new shaft as well that is Cro mo. Just another option. I am very surprised that you haven't broke your from axle, mine went as soon as i put 35's on. good luck

Sputnik40 · 12-21-07, 09:35 PM

I've had the ten spline in for over 6 years - it's been thru a couple of stock birfs, stock rear axles, a chromo rear axle and 4 pinions due to bad axle wrap - and a few lock right small pins...oveall, just a lot of abuse. Guess it's the difference with the 4-1 gearset?

missipboy · 01-10-08, 11:17 AM

just saw the broken spud. i've broken two. sbc-nv4500-orion-arb-38's. i was probably a little rough on it.

peesalot · 01-10-08, 03:54 PM

I got the old school AA sm420 kit where it replaces the tranny output and the shaft is one piece all the way thru t-case. No spud. 10 spline, no breaky.

'74 UA FJ · 02-19-08, 08:43 AM

Number 408 is going in soon--hopefully next weekend if I get finished rebuilding the transmission by then. I built the orion with a new mainshaft and hi/low shift collar. The stock thrust washers gave me the correct end play(.009). I'll edit this post when I get some miles and wheeling on it.

Edit 1: After the first ride, I am disappointed. It pops out of low range on steep downhills.

Richard R · 03-18-08, 03:59 PM

I have Orion #084 on the back of a SM465
The Orion was built and installed on my 465 by Steve Cramer A.K.A "Poser"
It is in a 71 FJ40 powered by a Chev 292 I6 with a 38 Weber. I am running 4.1 gears and 35X12.5
Interco's.
Works great, gives me a good road speed and a hell of a crawl ratio

hatfieldcb · 04-10-08, 11:47 PM

OK. I have case #050. I assembled it. I put all the upgrades/fixes in it from AA. I have a used main shaft and shift collar.

It's gone in behind an SM420 in my orange project FJ40. I was finally driving it last week when I noticed a problem It's detailed in this thread.

AA is going to test what's left of my thrust washer and tell me what they think.

Sputnik40 · 04-11-08, 09:40 AM

Installing Orion #HD031. Not entirely related, but can anyone give me suggested torque specs. for the bolts that hold the late style AA SM420 adapter in place (to the SM420 - several small bolts and one or so stud/nuts)??? I installed it years ago and can't remember what they were - and while I have the cases out want to go thru each one again with a bit of lock tite

.

FJROME · 05-10-08, 08:10 PM

Orion No. 467
4:1 low range
Stock thrust washers (.009 clearance with feeler gage)
New shift rail and backcut gears
Used shift collar
17 in. lbs. bearing preload
Almost 500 miles since installation and noticeably quieter than original T-case.
Finally had a chance to test it in low range (thanks danimal) and no problems, (THANK GOD) so far so good.
Thanks to everyone here for your input and experience........Jerome

08-12-07, 11:53 AM	#63
peesalot IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: in a house Posts: 1,453	Rusty, on the AA crossmember if you have the one with a welded in cone it will leak. If you have one that uses the original cone cover on top of the crossmember you can drill a hole to let the oil drain back into t-case. Check out the stock cone and you will see the little return channel and if you look at t-case you will see the return hole. Use the cone as template to locate hole on AA crossmember and drill a 3/16 hole. Stopped all leaks from the cone on numerous rigs where we found the hole was neglected on original install. __________________ John on the hawgs

08-13-07, 02:22 PM	#68
peesalot IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: in a house Posts: 1,453	If the return hole is not there it will fill cone with oil and leak. If hole is there it does not keep the cone full. I agree that with the studs it is a little bit of a dance to get the cross member in. __________________ John on the hawgs

11-09-07, 05:16 PM	#70
mustardfj40 IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Silicon Valley TLCA# 6453 Posts: 577	The number is a bit hard to read since the 3rd digit is double stamped on each other. So I beleive my case number is 028, pre-ordered from AA by Mudrak very early on. It sat around in the garage unassembled for a very long time. I followed Poser's threads on the Orion very closely and finally built it up with all the latest upgrades from AA which included: the back-cut gear, stepped thrust washers, I also used brand new Toyota shifting colar... The only problem I had was shifting difficulties with the AA supplied brass nut and spring. It was impossible to shift, I tried different washers and did not help much. So I went back to the Toyota spring which I bought brand new from Toyota and the orginal headless screw so I can adjust the tension on the spring. The Orion/H41 combo gives me about 80:1...Very sweet and looks just like stock And I would to thank Poser for all his efforts and Mudrak for the case. Edit: Add a pic: UPDATE: Took the truck with H41/Orion combo through the 2008 Rubithon, the low gear combination is awesome!!! Many times, I was in 2nd gear, the 1st is great for tricky situation. We also spend 10 hours driving toward and and back from trail heads. So far no popping out of either high or low. In an earlier Rubithon my spotter told me to show down when I was idling (with the H41/3spd transfercase), this time Mudrak as a spotter told me to hurry up going up a major obstacle on Cadilac Hill __________________ '75 FJ40 mostly stock....yeah right! www.employees.org/~dirttrak Last edited by mustardfj40; 06-29-08 at 01:03 PM.

12-21-07, 06:55 PM	#74
robj IH8MUD Rookie Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wickenburg AZ TLCA# 14978 Posts: 51	Hopefully the 10 spline is stronger, the 16 spline spud shaft snapped easy - way too easy I'll attach photo (maybe first time) I have 37s but still running stock front axle shafts, they should have broke first IMO Attached Images Last edited by robj; 12-25-07 at 11:08 AM.

12-21-07, 09:35 PM	#76
Sputnik40 IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2005 TLCA# 6187 Posts: 1,295	I've had the ten spline in for over 6 years - it's been thru a couple of stock birfs, stock rear axles, a chromo rear axle and 4 pinions due to bad axle wrap - and a few lock right small pins...oveall, just a lot of abuse. Guess it's the difference with the 4-1 gearset? __________________ "The devil made me do it the first time. The second time I done it on my own."

08-12-07, 05:06 PM	#64
Poser Oh...Durka Durka Durka. Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: in the shop TLCA# 1856 Posts: 13,949	AA crossmember.... If you use studs instead of bolts it will seal and not leak...new or old style, does not matter.

08-25-07, 11:10 AM	#69
spotcruiser IH8MUD Addict Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Western WA TLCA# 10016 Posts: 809	Case #31 4:1 ratio Has the retrofit parts (undercut hs gear, shift rail, shoulder washers). I held off building it until AA came up with a solution. No problems so far.

12-18-07, 10:04 PM	#71
Cruiser Cruisin IH8MUD Rookie Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Arlington, Washington Posts: 50	Just got the case put in. It is number 398, 4:1, and it has the thrust washers. I had the case built my my local shop, "Olympic Offroad." I also just put in a non us, stock trans with the compound low (4.95, what kind of ratio does this mean i have?). At first it had very hard shifting from low to high however it is getting much better. No problams yet, works well.

12-21-07, 01:26 PM	#72
robj IH8MUD Rookie Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wickenburg AZ TLCA# 14978 Posts: 51	Case # 327 4:1 No problems w/ the orion at all. However I did snap the spud shaft like a pretzel. Its the AA adapter shaft for 16 spline to NV4500 trans. AA warrantied it and gave me the 10 spline shaft and gear,bearing etc. to convert to 10 sline . they said it was stronger? Originally installed Jan. 07

01-10-08, 11:17 AM	#77
missipboy IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: tunica, ms Posts: 1,220	just saw the broken spud. i've broken two. sbc-nv4500-orion-arb-38's. i was probably a little rough on it.

01-10-08, 03:54 PM	#78
peesalot IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: in a house Posts: 1,453	I got the old school AA sm420 kit where it replaces the tranny output and the shaft is one piece all the way thru t-case. No spud. 10 spline, no breaky. __________________ John on the hawgs

02-19-08, 08:43 AM	#79
'74 UA FJ IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Alabama Posts: 1,252	Number 408 is going in soon--hopefully next weekend if I get finished rebuilding the transmission by then. I built the orion with a new mainshaft and hi/low shift collar. The stock thrust washers gave me the correct end play(.009). I'll edit this post when I get some miles and wheeling on it. Edit 1: After the first ride, I am disappointed. It pops out of low range on steep downhills. __________________ 1974 FJ40 FI vortec 350, H42/Orion 4:1, 4" lift, 35s, lock-rited f/r, Saginaw ps, etc, etc. 1994 FZJ80 with lockers. Last edited by '74 UA FJ; 03-03-08 at 07:01 AM.

03-18-08, 03:59 PM	#80
Richard R IH8MUD Rookie Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 29	I have Orion #084 on the back of a SM465 The Orion was built and installed on my 465 by Steve Cramer A.K.A "Poser" It is in a 71 FJ40 powered by a Chev 292 I6 with a 38 Weber. I am running 4.1 gears and 35X12.5 Interco's. Works great, gives me a good road speed and a hell of a crawl ratio

04-10-08, 11:47 PM	#81
hatfieldcb Swimmingly Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Colorado TLCA# 2768 Posts: 950	OK. I have case #050. I assembled it. I put all the upgrades/fixes in it from AA. I have a used main shaft and shift collar. It's gone in behind an SM420 in my orange project FJ40. I was finally driving it last week when I noticed a problem It's detailed in this thread. AA is going to test what's left of my thrust washer and tell me what they think. Attached Images __________________ Chris Hatfield KCØZAB TLCA#2768, Ad Sales Manager, Toyota Trails/tlca.org "As long as you're skating on thin ice, you may as well dance!" '97 FZJ80, '69 FJ40 "Project Orange" Rising Sun 4 Wheel Drive Club Cruise Moab 2008 Advertise in TLCA's award winning Toyota Trails magazine. Last edited by hatfieldcb; 04-10-08 at 11:52 PM.

04-11-08, 09:40 AM	#82
Sputnik40 IH8MUD Lifer Join Date: Sep 2005 TLCA# 6187 Posts: 1,295	Installing Orion #HD031. Not entirely related, but can anyone give me suggested torque specs. for the bolts that hold the late style AA SM420 adapter in place (to the SM420 - several small bolts and one or so stud/nuts)??? I installed it years ago and can't remember what they were - and while I have the cases out want to go thru each one again with a bit of lock tite . __________________ "The devil made me do it the first time. The second time I done it on my own."

05-10-08, 08:10 PM	#83
FJROME IH8MUD Junior Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: South Central Cal. TLCA# 17555 Posts: 127	Orion No. 467 4:1 low range Stock thrust washers (.009 clearance with feeler gage) New shift rail and backcut gears Used shift collar 17 in. lbs. bearing preload Almost 500 miles since installation and noticeably quieter than original T-case. Finally had a chance to test it in low range (thanks danimal) and no problems, (THANK GOD) so far so good. Thanks to everyone here for your input and experience........Jerome __________________ 68 FJ40, 327/NV4500/3sp t-case,soa on 35"bfg at's,arb's F & R, it never ends. <><

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