adjusting the valves

jwest · 03-19-04, 11:32 PM

Tomorrow, I'm going to try to rig a one handed screw/jam-nut tightener with this.

I'll fit a slotted bit through the socket hole and fixed to the tool body. One hand slides the feeler gauge while the other turns the tool to get the proper clearance. Then squeeze to tighten the nut. The slotted bit would be in a fixed position within the rotating socket. Yea... laugh it up... I'll let you guys know if it blows or not.

Kief · 03-19-04, 11:40 PM

NO NO NO NO! YOU GOT IT ALL WRONG! I know the best way to adjust valves, figured this one out from my favorite pig farmer turned cruiser head, yep, he told me the best way. You just run that old straight six, just like the old 235, it is actually a chevy motor you know, and after it gets good and hot you go ahead and tighten them ther valves down till it starts fumblin' and then you back it off a quarter turn. Who needs those over-priced feel gaugers? Don't worry about bustin' your fingers, unless your valves are so loose you can stick em under there, yeah, they'll break then.
If you have a hard time doing this while it runnin' then you don't have rhythm. That ok, adjust'em while it isn't running with yur feel gauger. If you want to find TDC just pull the spark plug and stick one of them skinny fingers of yours in the hole and when the piston stops smashin' it then you are ready except now you can't get finger out . This is the part where you say stuff you shouldn't and the neighbor's porch light comes on and his dogs start barkin. Back it off and remember where you had it. Adjust the valves with the hand that don't hurt. If you run out of fingers and both hands hurt, stop.. should only have a couple valves left. You should fix the noisiest valves first. Fix the other ones later.
Did I mention not to lean over the fan, hope its not too late. Good luck. Hard to type with all these band aids on.

jim45r · 03-20-04, 12:30 AM

Hey, I'll paste a post from Eric Blankenship that I saw on birfield.com regarding this thread. I've never heard of the "adjust in 13s" method, but I'm going to try it on my next valve adjustment. That's what's great about these forums - every night is like sitting around a campfire, listening to stories - and no one interrupts! Thanks for starting this discussion, swank60! I've learned about six more ways to skin a cat . . . . and about $200 bucks worth of tools to help me do it!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I follow a write-up done by a Toyota master mechanic and have had excellent results; I've emailed it to several listers and would be happy to send it to anyone interested.
It's a variation on the TDC method in which you turn the engine for each valve. The way I remember it is "adjust in 13's". When #1 is down, adjust #12. When #7 is down, adjust #6, etc. It's absolutely fool-proof.

Just to add some fuel to the fire, IIRC, my FSM shows .012" for exhaust clearance... I assume it's that way for early F heads, but I have never seen that number ANYWHERE else.

Eric Blankenship mailto:fj40eric@verizon.net
Monroe, WA TLCA #6829
1964 FJ40 "Pullarium"

ranger · 03-20-04, 01:15 AM

[quote author=Overlord link=board=1;threadid=13366;start=msg123790#msg123 790 date=1079698574]
The 2F manual says to do it while the engine is running. Maybe Toyota doesn't know what they are talking about though.

[/quote]

The translation was lost from Japanese to English. :P

IDave · 03-20-04, 07:33 AM

Boy, I can't understand what the big terror is some folks seem to have about hurting themselves by checking the valve clearances with the engine running. I mean, you'd have to be a major klutzenheimer to injure something! I suppose you guys adjust the timing and the air/fuel mixture with the engine stopped, too? I've busted a lot of knuckles loosening rusted bolts, but I've checked clearances many times now and never had an injury.

What a bunch of pussies!

Landpimp · 03-20-04, 07:33 AM

thats the one I have

[quote author=jwest link=board=1;threadid=13366;start=msg124244#msg124 244 date=1079763309]
This one too...
P/N V22A

[/quote]

jim45r · 03-20-04, 09:25 AM

Ya, Dave, but I've known people that I wouldn't let work on a running engine, like my old friend that let his fan belt eat my timing light . . . Some folks have better situational awareness than others ("Trust me, Billy, the fan is still there, even though you can't see it")

swank60 · 03-20-04, 03:23 PM

I think when I sit down with mine, I am going to use the running method. I think it was iDave who said it best - when the engine is running where the adjustments really matter anyway, so it makes sense to set it on the fly...and I'd forgotten all about the "pig farmer" method, but I've know mechanics in the family who actually did it that way too (more or less by ear).

IDave · 03-20-04, 09:58 PM

I actually understand, as I gain experience, how doing it by ear would not be so bad. I mean, the engine starts missing if you get the clearance too tight, and the clacking gets louder as things get too loose. "Just right" is a relatively narrow area between those two.

jodtan · 08-14-06, 08:37 PM

I agree with iDave's method 100%. I've done it his way and it is so much easier as long as you're not stupid enough to put your body on moving parts. Guys, do you know how often you're suppose to adjust these valves? How about converting this to hydraulic lifter. Adjust once and forget about it. This 2f is PITA in my opinion.

Poser · 08-14-06, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jodtan

Guys, do you know how often you're suppose to adjust these valves?

7-8K miles...

Quote:

Originally Posted by jodtan

How about converting this to hydraulic lifter. Adjust once and forget about it. This 2f is PITA in my opinion.

Install a small block...

Pete · 08-15-06, 07:33 AM

Swank,

MAF is "theoretically" correct because when a piston is at TDC then both valves are closed, i.e. on their seats and that's where you measure the clearance. However, the trick is making sure both valves are really closed and I always checked this by eye by rotating the engine until both valves on a cylinder quit moving. The problem with this - as pointed out to me by Steve of Steve's Off-Road (Soddy Daisy, Tenn) - is to make sure both vlavles are closed you should use the TDC mark on the crank, adjust the ones that are closed (I'm like PinHead, I have to look it up), rotate 360 deg, and adjust the others. Just going by eye can leave a valve very slightly open.

Steve also suggested setting them 0.001 or 0.002 or so loose as I have heard others suggest. Loose is better than tight to avoid burned valves.

Curious what Mark W or Jim C have to say about this.

Pete

Toyo FJ40 · 08-16-06, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ranger

I don't even understand the concept of checking valve clearance with a feeler gauge while the engine is running, you'll pound the crap out of your feeler gauge, and accomplish nothing.

I've adjusted my valves on my 72 both ways... running and not running and they both work about the same. It's kinda cool having your hands in engine while it's running and yes my feeler gauges are all bent at the ends.

Kevin

Advent · 10-12-06, 03:31 AM

I just looked up that Snap-On tool that 'pimp had, and their site isn't showing it anymore.

Anyone know what the new number is, or did they discontinue it?

honk · 10-12-06, 05:58 AM

I think that if you're comfortable checking/adjusting valves while the engine runs you'd better change your oil pump.

IDave · 10-12-06, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honk

I think that if you're comfortable checking/adjusting valves while the engine runs you'd better change your oil pump.

Not so for an F engine. It's the ONLY way to fly!

I did find out you don't do that with a 22R, however.....

honk · 10-12-06, 08:22 AM

Yeah. My '65 doesn't bring much oil up either, but I'm afraid to try the 2F in my white truck. It's got a new pump that I honed and tightened up. It makes 60 psi when I turn the engine with a wrench!

Landpimp · 10-12-06, 08:37 AM

I doubt you would have a problem, none of my F or 2f's sling much oil with the valve cover off/motor running at low RPM's

Quote:

Originally Posted by honk

Yeah. My '65 doesn't bring much oil up either, but I'm afraid to try the 2F in my white truck. It's got a new pump that I honed and tightened up. It makes 60 psi when I turn the engine with a wrench!

Poser · 10-12-06, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honk

...but I'm afraid to try the 2F in my white truck. It's got a new pump that I honed and tightened up. It makes 60 psi when I turn the engine with a wrench!

I would not be concerned about it, even up to 1500+RPM's. The 2F camshaft has two holes drilled in the number three bearing journal that control the oil flow to the rocker shaft mechanism. The only thing that would get you more volume to the rocker shaft would be to increase the size of the oil holes in the camshaft, or cut a radial groove in the camshaft bearing journal. Some light reading on the topic.

I adjust the vavles with the engine hot, not running, and then after the adjustment is completed, run the engine with the cover off to watch/listen to them. Have done it this way since '88. Works great every time.

honk · 10-12-06, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poser

I would not be concerned about it, even up to 1500+RPM's. The 2F camshaft has two holes drilled in the number three bearing journal that control the oil flow to the rocker shaft mechanism. The only thing that would get you more volume to the rocker shaft would be to increase the size of the oil holes in the camshaft, or cut a radial groove in the camshaft bearing journal. Some light reading on the topic.

I adjust the vavles with the engine hot, not running, and then after the adjustment is completed, run the engine with the cover off to watch/listen to them. Have done it this way since '88. Works great every time.

I was kidding about my pump a little, and know that the flow up is restricted by design. When I went through the F in my older truck I did think about the low pressure oiling to the valve gear and with seeing various oil related problems posted here considered opening up the cam for a boost. I didn't though, mostly because the F engine doesn't seem to have much to spare due to it's pump and the other limitations to the low end bearings. Thought it would be better to leave it as Toyota found adequate and keep my experiments to the old days and smallblocks.

I do them static hot also, and listen with old ears that have listened to engines for too many years now.

John, I was once ISSUED the tool you like though mine said 'Bluepoint' on it. Thought it was useless then, and still do

Doug_S · 10-13-06, 11:21 AM

I've used the method by dividing the valves in half which means if you're adjusting the first valve, then you can adjust the 12th valve, the second, the 11th valve. The valves are numbered 1-12 beginning at the front of the engine.

I even saw a diagram indicating the proper way to divide up the valves though I can't put my finger on the diagram right now.

Good luck!

Poser · 10-13-06, 04:33 PM

Top dead center of the compression stroke you can adjust valves 1,2,3,5,7,9

Top dead center of the exhaust stroke you can adjust valves 4,6,8,10,11,12

Or, you can rotate the engine and adjust any that are free and not under tension. However with this method, if someone in the past has set things really tight, you may not be able to find the tight valve since you do not really have a reference point for the ones that should be loose, like when using the method described in the Factory Service Manual, and the other diapers out there.

Valve clearances hot:

Intake .008”

Exhaust .014”

Good luck!

-Steve

PurpleFJ62 · 02-08-07, 06:39 PM

so what are the clearences?
For a cold engine?

IDave · 02-08-07, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PurpleFJ62

so what are the clearences?
For a cold engine?

The same to start.

From the FSM:

Nomis · 02-08-07, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IDave

The same to start.

From the FSM:

Dave I can't quite make out the text - could you repost a larger pic?

IDave · 02-08-07, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomis

Dave I can't quite make out the text - could you repost a larger pic?

Hey, I give to the Helen Keller society...

hank14 · 09-28-07, 03:25 PM

I did my first valve adjustment today. Read up on it here, read the FSM, and the Landcruiser Bible has a good description of what to feel for when measuring with the engine running at slow idle. I did the FSM 2F Engine Manual hot engine running to measure, stopped engine to adjust technique. At first, I went one valve at a time. As I began to get the "feel" of it, I would check 2 or 3 with it running, then adjust them slightly with it stopped.

The valves were pounding the feeler gauge at first, but when I held it lightly in my hand, it allowed the gauge to vibrate and absorb the shock while I gently slid the gauge to test the fit.

There was some oil splatter, but nothing major.

And after putting it all back together, it still runs!
The last valve adjustment was a few years and about 50K miles ago. Most of my exhaust valves were a litlle tight. The intakes were close to spec.

Cruiserdrew · 09-28-07, 03:30 PM

Holy thread, back from the dead. Congrats Hank.

94x4runner · 11-23-09, 10:09 AM

Quick question, im going to be doing the valvues on my 90 3fe in a few days and cant find the book. As far as i remember the exaust clearance is a 14 feeler gauge and the intake is an 8 feeler gauge. Or do i have that backwards? Ive always done it the TDC way in the past thats how i was tought to atleast, never had any issues doing it that way just had to go through the valvues twice after a reheat.