[MichiganChapter?]

[quote=ginericfj80;1459787]
"..I'm having a hard time following what you say as I don't completely understand who you are upset with...."

Again, Eric...I wouldn't send a dime in to any one of them for the rude and arrogant responses I've been given for simply pointing out the exclusionary and even simple procedural problems this Michigan public has faced here for years involving the largest system in this country. I mean really...how much more blunt would you like me to get?

"...I've had really good luck with Blue Ribbon Coalition. When I've chatted with them about issues I see happening they've steered me to more resources. However, they like any other organization can only go so far. They can't know what is going on in all 50 states unless we tell them about problems we have...."


I've had 'nice' conversations with the BRC right on up to the very second I 'dared' mention anybody here in Michigan that the general public is forced to deal with here behind these tightly closed doors and anonymoyus councils. I won't even get into what is said after that.

"....I've had not such good luck with the local 4wd association. They have a good id"...I've had really good luck with Blue Ribbon Coalition. When I've chatted with them about issues I see happening they've steered me to more resources. However, they like any other organization can only go so far. They can't know what is going on in all 50 states unless we tell them about problems we have...." ea of what they should be doing but I'm disappointed in what they have actually done...."

A guy mentioned to me once that many he had dealt with had the same view here and I've witnessed the exact same thing at every single orv advisory board meeting that I have ever attended.
Lots of talk about bathrooms not being cleaned and smoke blew about the department not doing this or that on the 'service' level; yet not a damn thing about fixing the system as a whole or forcing folks to actually pay for what they received.(we charge $16.25 for an over 3,000 mile system;so you don't have to be an 'Einstein' to realize that this amount just hasn't cut it and never had a chance in the first place).

"...Local motorcycle groups are definitely only looking out for themselves. Some of them have even illegally marked trails showing them closed to 4wd vehicles when they in fact are not. So as far as counting on them as allies in the fight to keep lands open to the public they aren't the best assett in my opinon...."

That is the first time I have ever witnessed this factual statement put so strongly and it is definitely a fact that when brought up frankly to these national organizations....that'll get you 'the treatment' for sure.
This group's arrogant and obnoxious behavior not only continually splits this community apart....it forces these national organizationsto 'pick sides' when simply standing up like a man to their decades long brainwashing of our youth concerning "me-only" land siezures is all that is needed.
Whatever your problem; these guys have proven that you damn well better not include anybody in that actual assessment that has ever supported them in kind over the years.
And believe me, it can be just as stupid as these refusals to simply list these meeting dates right on up to the govt. busting a guy for the exact same skill-set that they're supposed to keep us out of trouble regarding.

"...My experiences are on a local level though, I know other have had radically different experiences throughout the state. So you can't categorize folks even statewide or nationally really as the local folks are what make the impact...."

We have the largest cycling district in the nation representing the single largest on or off-road organization that I'm aware of. I would hazard to say that no other state even comes close as to the amount of land that these cyclists have spirited away for their exclusive use only and they'reangling for more with every one of these national organization's "shared trail" blessings.
They are teaching our children that they are somehow "different" from the rest of us and "deserve the right" to be segregated at untold costs to our state's economic health and our trail system's ecological future through their greedy resistance to for-profit privitized maintenance.
How many more valid points do I have to make or just how much time do you have?

Thanks for the reply and know that I very much appreciate you finally saying what many have not had the stones to mention even after witnessing same themselves to possibly the detriment of their very own trail systems.